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Post by cagedadventurer on Nov 9, 2021 23:34:18 GMT -5
Wow, it appears Carl is a difficult of not impossible conversationalist; and not too clued in to the purpose of the forum. He may be indifferent with his W, but sure isn't indifferent with otherwise friendly strangers here. Carl, if you knew any of the respondents here via history, you'd possibly be aware of how irreverent your comments are. You would do well to take a calibre test revealing your utter lack of empathy...if you even cared to care about others that is.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Oct 9, 2021 11:17:48 GMT -5
I have a million aspirations and love living life...when sex is good, normal I feel like I have life by the tail and I can accomplish anything, plan anything be anything....maybe my ideal of one wife really is to my detriment. Unfortunately in this Millennia divorce or alternative relationships burden heavily on finances and our children. Hmmm, still I don't want to go out knowing I should have busted out long ago. I'm currently putting things in order and will have to soon sacrifice that proverbial pawn for a hopeful future win.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Oct 9, 2021 10:49:30 GMT -5
There's not a lot of content in here written by refuser spouses, so there isn't a real lot of information about - "what goes through the mind of those spouses who refuse/withhold sex". And, of the few examples that there are (like Brother Handy linked) they may or may not be being truthful. And in truth, when you get down to the core problem, the reasons for sexual refusal don't actually matter a real lot. Whatever the reason (or the "why") might be, you are still equally disenfranchised. So any reason/why is pretty much as good as another. The fact that you are disenfranchised is important - vitally important. "Why" you are being disenfranchised, not so much. From an article I found regarding aversion to intimacy: www.goodtherapy.org/blog/dont-touch-me-understanding-your-sexual-aversion-0904154 This post inserted below stuck with me (emphasis on underlined part) and I wanted to share as it may be something the refused could actually share with a refuser to at least help pull and expose the answer from them as coffeeachiever was mildly attempting to do. For the sake of facing a mirror and being honest about their feelings at least for those of us who are ready for any outcome from the discussion. QUOTE FROM ANGIE: I was so happy to stumble across this article and the comments after a late night Google search on the issue that’s destroying our marriage . My husband is a pilot and flies internationally and is gone for 10 to 12 days stretches. He left for his trip yesterday furious with me that I had not been receptive to his advances the entire week he had been home. His last words as he walked to the cab were “well I guess you get an entire month off” . After the kids had left that morning he had tried dragging me to the bedroom for a quick round of sex before he left for his trip. I knew this would be coming and even considered making up a lie about an appointment so I could rush out the door and avoid the inevitable . Why couldn’t I just force myself to do it and get it over with it and allow some tranquility to resume? It had been a hard week and I just kept reliving the multiple arguments and his angry outbursts with me and the kids , and although we weren’t mad at each other at the moment , the thought of trying to fake sexual pleasure was beyond repulsive. This article and many of the comments brought me to tears as the realization that others are going through the same thing and there are some possible “treatments” . We have been married 20 years and have three teenage children . The agitation and hostility that arises from his sexual needs not being fulfilled to the extent he desires is felt by all of us in the home. You would think that my need to clear the house of that stress would push me to work past my aversion and just give him that relief so we can move on. Now I realize that all those years of doing just that may have been exactly what landed us in the mess we are in now. I have even spent the past 5 years “secretly” drinking in the evenings in hope that a strong buzz will relieve my anxieties and help me get the “job” done. That doesnt works any more. It’s of course no longer a secret that I am drinking and now just another sore spot between us. My MO is to now just hit the stage of passing out before he come to bed and the next morning is spent with unspoken hostilities and anger over the unrewarding previous evening. I never even feel the desire to drink and rarely have a single drop of alcohol when he is away on a trip. I avoid “date nights” and sometimes even instigate arguments or bring up topics that I know will lead to a heated discussion in an effort to give myself an “excuse” not to want to have sex. I love him very much , you would think that love would allow me to do anything for him , but it doesn’t ! He is a devoted husband and Dad and I know he deserves that sexual reward but Trying to do that is emotionally destroying me. I never will instigate plan or suggest a “date night” any more . I am too consumed with worry that I won’t be able to “pay the piper” at nights end or if I am able to force myself to get through it, I try to rush it along as much as I can. He can see that and this also becomes a source of unspoken hostility. When we are alone he will often walk up and hug me or try to give me a kiss or grab and rub my breasts , trying to get me in a playful mood. The moment that happens I become nauseous, agitated and panicky. My mind starts replaying every recent argument or fight and I am left fighting this strong desire to shove him off of me and yell at him. I obviously have realized this is not normal, but until I ran across a few articles like this , I was just plagued with a guilt that was leading me into a depression. Thank you for sharing your stories. I am hoping we are not to badly scarred and that there may be hope and some kind of treatment that can fix this huge problem of ours. I think the first step was realizing the problem is not just “ME” .
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Post by cagedadventurer on Oct 9, 2021 10:39:30 GMT -5
Thank you Handy for finding this post; amazingly I had been looking for this just last week as I thought I'd print and share it with my W. The short version is over an irrational offense surrounding her 2 new dogs in addition to the fact I had invoked her estranged sister's name in a conversation with my son regarding using his talents and gifts for opportunities, she hurled the fiery cannon balls which always include how my kids hate me, etc. Not the case, but it is what she'll do now that I can hold my own against her history of twisted wording, she's always right" beat downs and shaming. Anyway this EP article (which I had attributed to Apocrypha as I recall a brilliant summary from one of his posts) came to mind because as the haranguing continued she injected the statement " just because of one (1) thing", insistent that she is the ultimate mother and wife but for that "one thing" which reminded me of a conversation on 2001 when sex mentioned, her reply was "oh that". As though she really did not understand the mess it created and how its effects permeate EVERYTHING ELSE....negatively of course. So in addition to a deeply telling reaction from her when I asked her to help me pull a car cover over the car (Florida summer sun), it is abundantly clear that so many refusers are able to compartmentalize this sexless-ness yet with a surprisingly acceptable blank space as to the ancillary ramifications....that is the lack of all the flirts and associated fun, fun, funniness, laughter, joint planning of trips, life, the future, the bonding of a married couple who otherwise have similar ideals. The actual nature of the relationship that has developed over the course of these LT marriages is so far from where it should be but it is the acceptable normal for the refuser as they seem to value the "one thing" along with say... stocking the refrigerator or planning dinner, or going to buy the kids some clothes, whereby it holds no disproportionate weight, a weighted value that we KNOW it actually has and was designed to have. To that, my experience indicates that this blank space is legitimate; HOWEVER if it were then why do so many spouses find 1,000 ways to distract and avoid the "one thing".....the contradiction not worth speculating on, rather the acceptance of it due to kids and lifestyle; for now anyway.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Oct 4, 2021 22:15:10 GMT -5
didn’t know to expect so much “it’s crap and deal with it” advice when I first came on here. Of course I don’t “like” it - but I also do sincerely appreciate IF it’s coming from a place of real human concern. You know…intent is one thing and execution another…that’s all I’m saying.
I have been a member since 2016. I do check in several times per week and REALLY appreciate those members who continue with guidance, humor and just stories. I have not contributed in quite some time but your - coffeeachiever - reaction in just a few days has caused me to log in - hopefully for your long term benefit. Okay my wife just left the room after handing me a bowl of ice cream... now I can type again. She's being extra nice today because I am taking the boys to Florida tomorrow for over a week...i think it makes her a bit nervous I may not return.coffeeachiever - I come from the same mindset and Godly beliefs but please do not dismiss or react to what is meant in these threads as genuine, unbiased advisement. I have been at this for 33 sick years with the first years reading EVERY book ever written on marriage by Christian authors and many since. Heard every episode of James Dobson Focus on the Family and numerous video courses from many a Christian counselor. I have learned that none of them have the all the answers nor do the secular "professionals" ....IMO the Bible does have the answer since many of the men had concubines...musta' been a reason. LOL ....or not. But really there is great advice as to our behaviors and how we attend to each other but sexlessness?! It's still a beggars game for the refused.
Apocrypha was burned badly but is a virtual genius with insight you should at least ponder if you do not agree today. But do not dismiss, that will be to your detriment.
What WAS versus WHAT IS TODAY: - What I can suggest to you is that you are "telling yourself" these things about being your girl, etc. as necessary to avoid facing what you are scared may be the case....the honeymoon is over and it is not a phase. Unfortunately your W does not even know how to put this matter into words. My wife used to pout, wants to spend time together and would talk endlessly as I'd nod off to sleep thinking "I've got to work in the morning; I'm not your sister...I cannot listen to this much talk AND NOT EVEN GET LAID!)
The WHY that you seek is a moving target but it does help delay accepting the inevitable truth and maybe delay it forever. What is that truth? - it was stated above and that is once the interest is lost....rarely if ever returns. And NO AMOUNT OF COURTING HER WILL CHANGE THIS. You may get some action few times per year but you'll always initiate and you'll sense loss of interest regardless. Before long your dignity is just trashed.
You will go from being you to someone you do not even recognize as you bobb and weave and meander to her emotions.....all in hope she will screw your brains out. You'll become whoever you think she needs you to be to get laid while your emotions seesaw from furious, jealous, disgusted, sad and numb....to furious again. This is your future. There is one immediate solution that may prove temporary or permanent - You have to practice the words "Honey, a marriage without physical union is not a marriage. It really is a legal living arrangement like room mates sharing a lease. It certainly is not what God had in mind as sex was his endless marriage gift to us. I know we can never maintain the real bond meant for marriage without the glue that is sexual union, but I am not going to be a sex pest or beggar. Therefore as saddened as is makes me to utter these words, I need to go and not pretend I can live in a sexless relationship with someone I really love".
Threat of loss or divorce somehow causes the bedroom action to resume; where no amount of other conversation or therapy will otherwise get you consistently laid again. BTW there are many a thread as to do not bluff..be ready to go or you lose all credibility. I do not think you are ready for this stage yet but you will get there so please keep this available.... I was just trying to give a more accurate picture of who me and my wife are. This may be true BUT if you do not quit this forum, you will discover in time that even though you have painted this picture (and we know that you are the guy actually in it), the strangers yet veterans here KNOW what is actually accurate. You may be in it but you actually do not know. I know this sounds pompous but insight from experience trumps your hopes and dreams every time at least when it comes to this particular issue.
In closing, Please, don't waste your life on this all consuming pain. Stay friends, be decent but don't torture yourself. And my money is on Apocrypha - she will be having sex again with the next one. It's all a messy thing it is and I wish there were a magic wand but for all the things man can fix and correct, this is one of the most elusive of all.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Apr 27, 2021 22:39:15 GMT -5
He is confident, aggressive and clearly loves se, and those are a turn-on to many women including women whose husbands passively endure sexless marriages. Whining about the sexlessness of one's marriage is passive endurance. The type of man that your wife likes would ditch a sexless marriage. [/quote]
This is so well stated! Thank you Northstarmom! It's why we do get resets when we leave or are walking out...the passivity/keep the peace BS keeps us here!
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Post by cagedadventurer on Nov 19, 2020 22:52:57 GMT -5
Half tank to empty in 4 years, that well sums it up. The Obgyn ..just stall tactics. This does not improve. If not for the kids, easy decision. You won't last like this though, it ( the rejection and SM) makes life and ambitions seem moot. Hint, they only respond to affairs and divorce papers...both anazing aphrodisiacs.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jul 12, 2020 18:17:09 GMT -5
TiredofTears, porn has ruined sex for him; he has ruined it for you both. Apocrypha summarizes it quite well with , " they just don't want to have sex with us" ...it's a mental hurdle to get over but at least clarity has a chance once you do. I really feel your pain because even the weekly guest room action, while nice, is still not the same as your spouse.....daily, spontaneously, and with some care to maintain connection for the sake of the marriage. Your pic...you look adorable...there's no logic to his ways.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jun 21, 2020 8:36:47 GMT -5
I am a slug - leaving my horny juices on anything that does not move that I happen to sit on.
That’s it. That’s the story. I am Super horny, unsatisfied. Entertaining offers to eat my pussy.
I want a dick inside of me RIGHT NOW!!
It’s not even funny.]
To every man on this forum, how different our world's would be if our wives spoke to us like this! JMX...these be poetic words.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jun 2, 2020 21:56:31 GMT -5
I'm curious Newlywed if you expected this much attention so quickly and if you were actually hoping for marriage saving advice...vs. these hard truths? The advice provided so far is all you need. It comes from very caring, well informed, experienced sexless marriage survivors and endurors. Your gut is so right...and unfortunately the marriage is a lost cause. We all simply know this already based on your one post. It is a reality you just need to accept. Many of us would not have married or have stayed married due to children. You're a lucky one here. Run, annul, divorce...just do it. Believe me if it were fixable we'd offer all sorts of solutions. He's not a bad man but you should not be together. The yard work story...just the first of hundreds of excuses he has yet to invent.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Mar 21, 2020 4:14:32 GMT -5
Red flags,
I think in this case with H of JMX, he's become brazen almost antagonistic in his disregard for her. The red flags per the article have been there for a long while. He just seems not to care about anything...except video games. This in and of itself makes a bad marriage. And a husband by title only.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Oct 3, 2019 14:36:16 GMT -5
Welcome back time4intimacy,
3 things. 1- I think we all appreciate you taking time to "work on your marriage". You are early 40's and to make SURE you have not failed in some real capacity causing your W's disinterest, you had to "try". Trying can mean new actions, fitness, avoiding potentially annoying actions, paying closer attention to her, showing intentional interest in her world, changed attitudes or responses to her, etc. You tried it I am sure. Even the new house and boat... maybe were in some way a renewal of the earlier days, that is activity to keep you both engaged in a commonality. But you are back here because..... well it is inevitable 99.9% of the time.
2- You differentiated pissed from upset. And you want to screw someone else - because you are pissed. But don't. Not to take the high road but it just may as well be on your terms when you are no longer pissed. No social out-casting need occur which becomes unnecessary relationship fall-out.
3- Stuff appears now to be holding you in - leaving the "prickly" comfort zone that is. I have learned, I do NOT enjoy these activities where my wife is included if there is no sex as part of the adventure. The fact is, she is more of an accommodation to my schedule and I'd rather do activities solo or with my kids or a co-worker. Point is, the new house should have her screwing your brains out in every room just because. The boat, some sex action on that would make that purchase much more appreciated. I build homes, the CEO of a large home builder once stated that they like to include 2 shower heads in master showers because the guys "anticipate" these getting used simultaneously. He (the CEO) knows better but it still has some positive subliminal implications helping buyers say yes to the purchase. BUT it is another let down after the thrill of the new home is gone. This goes for the cars, boats, vacation homes, vacations, and even babies.
So you have done the financial math, she stated what she stated and as a matter of fact, so it is time to practice and deliver your "exit statement". Practice it so upon verbal delivery it comes across as just a business decision; that is with no emotion but just an unfortunate requirement based on the new deal in front of you and for survival it "must be done". AS she realizes that none of these material things have any meaning to you compared to a real marriage (for which you work TOO hard at sustaining), she will either realize the importance of sexual fulfillment or she will agree and you are confident as to your next moves.
If she wants to remain married, re-read about reset sex in this forum and be ultra cautious. Do NOT get her pregnant.
You are 44, don't be here where you are 46 unless it is a success story. She's done, but you are attached to the lifestyle like many of us are. I say that but I do have sex 1-2 x per week but if that stops (even if it does not get more exciting) no money, no stuff is keeping me here. "It's just business" as they say.
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jun 22, 2019 5:20:24 GMT -5
Michael, you're not being misunderstood. You're NOT the negative things you mention either in her eyes.....ugly or a jerk. But you must face the fact she is checked out. The non answers are withheld replies she is afraid to vocalize because the words will hurt and she does care not to be cruel sounding. As crazy as it sounds she is holding on to hope you'll file for divorce and end this. If I'm wrong, go buy thd divorce package at an office store and bring it home offering an amicable split. Her reaction will answer all those currently unanswered questions. Note, see a lawyer first to see how you'll fare first....Baza advice none of us should ignore. But really, you'll be here nonths from now, no changes and more frustration. If no kids, leaving would have been an easy decision for most of us here. BTW. In time, youll HOPE she finds soneone to sleep with, you'll care less and less the more she rejects you or revokes....
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jun 22, 2019 5:08:49 GMT -5
JMX I mean... you bought her shoes...I am guessing you are implying anything a H buys for his W does not entitle him to be sexual with his W? Maybe you could expand on your answer to help Michael. JMX, if you don't mind, I'll interject....buying someone shoes means they'll walk out on you....so come on what do you want from her " I mean... you bought her shoes"
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Post by cagedadventurer on Jun 10, 2019 6:59:33 GMT -5
If you visited 20 therapists, paid 100.00 to each, you'd still not have received the quality advice provided you here in the past 24 hours.
You now know what to do. You now know what to stop doing.
BTW your looks have nothing to do with this issue therefore no change will make a difference. But just in case you are still floundering with indecision, take these replies seriously. This advisement is from years of aggregated experiences. Next steps..it's now your move:
1- see lawyer, file and end this mess- do H a favor in the meantime. 2-stop Facebook guy for now....this goes nowhere either...you're just desperate. We all understand. 3-Lose some weight if this makes you feel more confident, hanging with H tells us you lack healthy confidence thus destined to repeat, repeat, repeat. 4- stop posting or anything further that displays wealth. You'll never know who to trust.
BTW- not that he is a bad guy, most of our spouses are not. But he's just a putz, no zest for life and not a thing you can about it EVER.
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