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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 22:08:08 GMT -5
Without being political (ZERO political commentary on this thread please), I think most of us can probably admit to the preponderance of hateful language that we are seeing in the media. I do not, for the record, believe that it represents the majority of people, but I think it's sensationalized to such a degree that some people latch onto it and take it as permission to be hateful to others. I promise I am going somewhere with this, but bear with me first. Tonight, while on Facebook, I posted what I thought was a sincere and benign question in my town's chat group. Out of 9 comments, 3 were snarky and hateful. It literally made my stomach hurt. And, because I am crier ( itsjustus), I felt like crying over it. And I took down the thread. It just wasn't worth the drama to me. Add the FB debacle to a lunchtime incident wherein a young male and his posse of 2 other males called me "rude" for getting to a table with my female friend before he did. Yep, he looked into my eyes and said "well that was just rude. You saw me going to that table." No, I did NOT see him. And I'm old enough to be his mother and I'm female. What is happening in our culture? Would he say that to his mother? Would he try to take a table from 2 women? Don't men hold doors or give up seats anymore? Ick. Just ick. And totally uncalled for. Those 2 incidents of hatred affected me so deeply that I went for a long walk tonight to process. What I kept coming back to is: how can I be the LOVE and the change I want to see in the world if I dislike or disapprove of my spouse so much that I divorce him? Never mind that he is hateful at times. If I leave, doesn't that mean I am just spreading hatred as well? Doesn't that plummet me down to his level? I walked and walked and thought and thought. And stared at the waxing moon (which is gorgeous tonight where I am). And decided that I should be the bigger one. I should have compassion for my husband's problems, right? I should stay and keep my vows "until death do us part" because I made a promise, because it's the right thing to do regardless of what he does, because it would show my children what LOVE and forgiveness are. Because it's love, not hate. And I don't want to multiply hate in this world. I want to multiply love. Insights? Because now I'm getting that awful, weighty depressing feeling that I have to stay, because to leave would make me the hater. And I refuse to be a hater. I'd go so far as to say it's the haters who need love the most. Help me, cause I'm drowning over here.  |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 22:25:02 GMT -5
Leaving doesn't have to be hateful. You can absolutely still be civil and even remain close if you and he both desire after a split. Personally, my relationship with my ex-refuser is better than it has been in forever since we separated last year. We were both totally amicable and adults in splitting up; unfortunately not everyone can have a peaceful resolution if their partner doesn't want it also, but you can still be the bigger person even if he decides to be hateful.
He's been much nicer to me than he's been since we were dating and I have also been much nicer to him. Separating has brought more peace for both of us. It's not whether you stay or go, it's how you treat each other while you're doing it.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 22:28:27 GMT -5
Thanks, HelenT, that's helpful.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 22:43:03 GMT -5
Is your problem with your husband really that you dislike or disapprove of him, or that you no longer have any love between you? It sounds more like you feel like you OWE him love because you made a vow, not that you actually love this man and what he brings to your life. If you stay with him, are you choosing love or obligation?
I don't think choosing to love yourself enough to make a happier life for yourself has anything to do with hatred. If you choose to remain in a loveless marriage where your needs for love are not being met, how is that spreading love? You don't need to hate him to leave, you just need to love and value yourself enough to know that pouring love down a black hole isn't improving the world.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 23:04:24 GMT -5
Is your problem with your husband really that you dislike or disapprove of him, or that you no longer have any love between you? It sounds more like you feel like you OWE him love because you made a vow, not that you actually love this man and what he brings to your life. If you stay with him, are you choosing love or obligation? I don't think choosing to love yourself enough to make a happier life for yourself has anything to do with hatred. If you choose to remain in a loveless marriage where your needs for love are not being met, how is that spreading love? You don't need to hate him to leave, you just need to love and value yourself enough to know that pouring love down a black hole isn't improving the world. Yes, I am feeling like I OWE him. I do not feel he contributes to my life in more than a financial way. And you are right, point taken, pouring love down a black hole isn't improving the world. Especially when said black hole is only diminishing the love and joy I have to give elsewhere. This is why I'm here. Because these cycles of "I'm leaving, no I'm staying" have kept me here for too long. I am not happy with this man in this marriage. But the transitory self-doubt. It's insidious. Maybe spreading love has to start with loving yourself and if that means you can't be with someone who hurts you, then that's just what it means. I'm processing a rough day here. Sorry folks for waffling. One day, I'm on top of the world and getting the hell out at the speed of light, the next day, well, I'm stuck again. Story of the last several years of my life. |
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Post by unmatched on May 19, 2016 23:08:15 GMT -5
I think @mountainrunner said it. How much love do you feel you have to give to the world right now? How much change are you bringing about in the world right now? And how much are you going to be able to give as long as half your mental energy is going into dealing with somebody who just sucks it up and gives nothing back?
Now imagine being on your own, or better still with somebody who doesn't bleed you dry but reflects back more love than you put out in the first place. What kind of a light could you be in the world then?
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 23:14:31 GMT -5
I think @mountainrunner said it. How much love do you feel you have to give to the world right now? How much change are you bringing about in the world right now? And how much are you going to be able to give as long as half your mental energy is going into dealing with somebody who just sucks it up and gives nothing back? Now imagine being on your own, or better still with somebody who doesn't bleed you dry but reflects back more love than you put out in the first place. What kind of a light could you be in the world then? Oh the wasted mental energy. So. much. wasted. energy. I can't imagine being with someone who could reflect love and light. I don't even know what that looks like or if I would ever have the courage to hope for it. But, even on my own, when I think of leaving... the days where I feel/know I am going to leave, my light becomes 1000 watts brighter instantly, just at the thought of being on my own. Thank you, unmatched. |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 23:21:09 GMT -5
@elle, what you're going through is so normal and I would be willing to bet that most of us who have chosen to leave have gone through some variation of it. If you are a loving human being, it isn't going to be easy to leave someone, knowing you will be causing them pain. You're entitled to waffle a bit now and then. It's just part of the process.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 23:25:56 GMT -5
Thanks, @mountainrunner, for understanding and validating. I get neither of those at home, as you can imagine. I'm off to bed now. Hopefully with sleep will come clarity.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 23:33:22 GMT -5
I think you need to draw the line somewhere. You can have the desire to show love to the world (which would include compassion for your husband) without tolerating situations that hurt you.
Since my refuser did have some real problems, it was hard for me to get over feeling like I bailed as soon as things got difficult. I have to remind myself that I stuck around through 11 years of the normal ups and downs of life. The last 3 years, our problems were *not* just a normal part of life.
And, I also have to remind myself that he had a part in this, too. He knew how much it mattered to me for us to have a good sex life. Knowing that did not cause him to address the issue. Compassion is a two-way street.
Does your H show compassion towards you?
It's great to want to do good in the world, and show that universal kind of love. I understand what you're saying. But at the same time, somebody has to be looking out for you - making sure that you are not being treated unfairly.
In my experience, you can't always count on other people to behave fairly towards everyone, to show compassion, to take the high road, to do the right thing. So - that person who is looking out for you and making sure you're not being hurt? It had better be you.
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Post by baza on May 19, 2016 23:53:39 GMT -5
If your mission in life is to spread happiness (and that is a fine ambition) then it behoves you to have your own torch burning at its' brightest to shine that love light as brightly as possible.
There are two ways of doing this.
#1 - is where you embrace people into your life who enhance it.
#2 - is where you distance yourself from people who deplete your life.
If you are concentrating your light on people who deplete it, then you have a double whammy effect
(a) - you are NOT going to have any impact on a depleter, so that energy has been wasted
(b) - you are going to have less energy to focus on the life enhancers in your orbit.
So your output is going to be vastly diminished.
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Post by lwoetin on May 20, 2016 1:17:01 GMT -5
I walked and walked and thought and thought. And stared at the waxing moon (which is gorgeous tonight where I am). Help me, cause I'm drowning over here. Very pretty writing! I should enjoy the moon and stars too. It will be difficult to show your children what love is if you don't love him anymore. It is not your fault that you don't. It should be his job to try to make you fall in love with him. I think you should tell him that you are seriously drowning and if he really tries to save you, then your marriage can survive. I don't think anyone can last until death do us part though, without feeling loved. You'll be dead way before that. |
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Post by DryCreek on May 20, 2016 1:47:21 GMT -5
@elle, some misc thoughts... If you have an outpouring of love, does it make sense to pour it on the ground, or into the empty cup of someone searching for the same? It's yours to waste, but imagine how its value is amplified by someone who desires it.
Relationship with your H will be what you two choose to make it. Unfortunately, divorce has the effect of exposing people's true persona, and sometimes that is a very nasty person (in which case, excising them from your life is a very good idea, and not to be mourned).
And I may have already mentioned this in another thread of yours, but journal. When times are hard, it's a good outlet. Later when your mood is different, re-reading / editing it to be more objective will yield a good point of reference over time of just how good/bad things really are, and whether it's factual or mostly your heat-of-the-moment interpretation that makes it seem that way.
DC
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Post by darktippedrose on May 20, 2016 3:15:46 GMT -5
I think you want to give your love, even forced because many of us feel guilty. Our refusers, even the worst of the worst aren't 100% bad 100% of the time.
they know this. they mix it up to keep us here. Love and hate have nothing to do with this. Its power and control.
I think the love that we don't have enough of, is loving ourselves. If divorce helps you forgive and forget and get peace of mind, then I don't see the problem.
Hate is what happens you're hurt deeply by someone you love.
The opposite of love is indifference. When you no longer care, there is no love.
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Post by tamara68 on May 20, 2016 4:18:34 GMT -5
About the unkindness in this world, you must realize that whatever you do, it is certain that not everybody will like you. People are different. The fact that some people are rude to you or don't like you doesn't say anything about you. It says something about them.
I know it is hard to ignore unkindness, I am not that good at it myself, but it helps to know that or even accept that unkindness is inevitable. Ignore it as much as you can and enjoy all the kindness that is out there too. And you are a big part of kindness!
About feeling you have to stay. I had the same sort of feelings. How can I be a good person if I leave?
You ARE a good person, but will you stay that way if you are forced to live an unhappy life? the only thing that will happen is that your energy will fade and you will feel miserable.
You are thinking more of others than about yourself. Think of yourself first. There is no reason why someone else would be more important than you.
Do what is good for you and you will flourish.
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