|
|
Post by callisto on Dec 10, 2016 17:53:35 GMT -5
Calisto, it's WAY more than just 'sexual desire'........it's mental health.........it's refusing the destruction of your life spirit. Oh my GAWD, it's worth EVERYTHING not to be destroyed by another!! GO!! I don't think it's that simple. callisto's marriage is not nearly as bad as your marriage, outside the sex. At least based on your mutual perceptions and what you've relayed here. We all have different numbers that we plug into the variables, so to speak. Plugging in and computing the variables has preoccupied my brain for over 4 months and it's driven me close to a nervous breakdown. Cannot believe how close a call it is. The scales are so evenly weighted. I can't fathom how it comes down to either loving companiable husband, financial security and home OR sex. Ha ha- it would be funny if it wasn't so horrendous.. If I hated my spouse, it would tip the balance to leave- make it much easier. |
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 10, 2016 18:06:24 GMT -5
I don't think it's that simple. callisto 's marriage is not nearly as bad as your marriage, outside the sex. At least based on your mutual perceptions and what you've relayed here. We all have different numbers that we plug into the variables, so to speak. Plugging in and computing the variables has preoccupied my brain for over 4 months and it's driven me close to a nervous breakdown. Cannot believe how close a call it is. The scales are so evenly weighted. I can't fathom how it comes down to either loving companiable husband, financial security and home OR sex. Ha ha- it would be funny if it wasn't so horrendous.. If I hated my spouse, it would tip the balance to leave- make it much easier. Having the benefit of 30 years of an SM, which I think is almost 3x as long as you've gone (correct me if I'm wrong)... the most difficult variable is how much you *might* dislike or even hate him, or resent him, over the next couple of decades. I felt like I was in a marathon race and I could get to the end (when one of us died). After 30 years I was just done, exhausted, and dropped out of that marathon. Knowing now that I could never have finished that marathon, why did I ever try??? I don't have a number for you to plug into that variable. That is your personal number, and unfortunately you cannot know the future and therefore cannot know that number. You can only consider a vague sense of where that may go. For me, everything just kept going downhill, in ways I did not foresee. |
|
|
|
Post by callisto on Dec 10, 2016 18:55:00 GMT -5
Plugging in and computing the variables has preoccupied my brain for over 4 months and it's driven me close to a nervous breakdown. Cannot believe how close a call it is. The scales are so evenly weighted. I can't fathom how it comes down to either loving companiable husband, financial security and home OR sex. Ha ha- it would be funny if it wasn't so horrendous.. If I hated my spouse, it would tip the balance to leave- make it much easier. Having the benefit of 30 years of an SM, which I think is almost 3x as long as you've gone (correct me if I'm wrong)... the most difficult variable is how much you *might* dislike or even hate him, or resent him, over the next couple of decades. I felt like I was in a marathon race and I could get to the end (when one of us died). After 30 years I was just done, exhausted, and dropped out of that marathon. Knowing now that I could never have finished that marathon, why did I ever try??? I don't have a number for you to plug into that variable. That is your personal number, and unfortunately you cannot know the future and therefore cannot know that number. You can only consider a vague sense of where that may go. For me, everything just kept going downhill, in ways I did not foresee. Yes, you were in the game nearly three times as long as I. The known points are : sexlessness if I stay, misery, crushed spirit unless I can channel, 'my inner nun' ... |
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 10, 2016 19:09:20 GMT -5
Having the benefit of 30 years of an SM, which I think is almost 3x as long as you've gone (correct me if I'm wrong)... the most difficult variable is how much you *might* dislike or even hate him, or resent him, over the next couple of decades. I felt like I was in a marathon race and I could get to the end (when one of us died). After 30 years I was just done, exhausted, and dropped out of that marathon. Knowing now that I could never have finished that marathon, why did I ever try??? I don't have a number for you to plug into that variable. That is your personal number, and unfortunately you cannot know the future and therefore cannot know that number. You can only consider a vague sense of where that may go. For me, everything just kept going downhill, in ways I did not foresee. Yes, you were in the game nearly three times as long as I. The known points are : sexlessness if I stay, misery, crushed spirit unless I can channel, 'my inner nun' ... And aside from what I said you might feel about him in the future, you have to try to consider your mental state and mental health and how that might decline over time (or will?  ). If you like math, charts and figures, think about extrapolating a chart of your misery index decades into the future. If you make a decision based on how you fell about things now, you will likely vastly underestimate your misery index 10 years from now, and then 20. I always considered myself a numbers guy, and I thought I was good at conceptualizing the real world implication of numbers. And how charts and graphs translate into the real world. I totally blew that when it came to my marriage and my misery index and etc. I never considered extrapolating the past into the future.... |
|
|
|
Post by callisto on Dec 10, 2016 19:22:34 GMT -5
The, 'Misery Index' ugh : /
a great name for a work of fiction about SM.. Maybe I will write it . Can't imagine hordes rushing out to purchase it though..
|
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 10, 2016 21:12:12 GMT -5
The, 'Misery Index' ugh : / a great name for a work of fiction about SM.. Maybe I will write it . Can't imagine hordes rushing out to purchase it though.. I want a royalty on the 10 copies sold  |
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 10, 2016 23:38:04 GMT -5
Exactly. What he deems "normal" and "sexual" is clearly not on the same level as me. I've tried to explain that and he disagrees, but it's painfully obvious. I agree and want the same. I don't get why it's SO difficult... In some cases (like mine), I think she just cannot comprehend the idea of an emotional bond. That the concept is something she has never experienced and can't relate to. The idea of being romantically / emotionally consumed by an experience, where the rest of the world stops and all of your senses are focused on your partner... just doesn't click with them. A kiss at sunset overlooking an amazing vista... is meaningless to them. Making love in a quaint hotel while on vacation in a breathtaking location... is just sex to them. The emotion, sentiment, romance is lost on them. They don't understand it. Not unlike how catnip makes my cat go crazy, but doesn't do so much for me. ;-) I see. I feel like I do have emotional experiences with my husband though. We do have nice times. That's why I am REALLY struggling with this. Yes, there are definitely times when I feel like it could be better on that level, but it's not like we don't have fun, emotional times, or deep conversations outside of SM "talks." It would almost be easier if he was awful.. |
|
|
|
Post by mrigman on Dec 14, 2016 18:45:25 GMT -5
First time poster. I am in nearly the exact same situation as Joy but roles reversed. I just wanted to thank all the responders here because they've helped me articulate my thoughts better than I could and made me feel better that there are so many others out there who are in the same boat. I even got a Word doc open and pasted my favorite advice to revisit later on.
Same thing here: sex was fine when we were dating, started tapering before the wedding, dropped dramatically after, and now (4 years later) I'm convinced she's asexual. I feel betrayed, like she was acting as someone else before, but I know it wasn't intentional because she's not anywhere near a manipulative person. I am on the verge of becoming a counter-refuser; we just went to our first counseling session this week and when I attempted to re-ignite things after a romantic evening last night she was totally oblivious to what as going on. After starting to kiss her she'd turn away after a few seconds and kind of laugh and then go back to playing a game on her phone. The whole encounter was awkward because it's been 6+ months at this point and I don't feel as close to her. So I'm struggling with this new reality that there is a near certain chance things will never change, and if I want to stay with her the rest of my life (I do) that celibacy is part of the deal.
Joy, please keep us posted about how things are going.
|
|
|
|
Post by thefullmoon on Dec 15, 2016 10:53:06 GMT -5
First time poster. ..........that there is a near certain chance things will never change, and if I want to stay with her the rest of my life (I do) that celibacy is part of the deal. Joy, please keep us posted about how things are going. The rest can be quite long.... Do you really want to spend next 30...or more years intimacy free? Not in marriage but in "complicated friendship" in order to preserve which you have to stay celibate for some bizzare reason? |
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 15, 2016 12:53:11 GMT -5
First time poster. ..........that there is a near certain chance things will never change, and if I want to stay with her the rest of my life (I do) that celibacy is part of the deal. Joy, please keep us posted about how things are going. The rest can be quite long.... Do you really want to spend next 30...or more years intimacy free? Not in marriage but in "complicated friendship" in order to preserve which you have to stay celibate for some bizzare reason? , you should seriously consider thefullmoon 's warning. The rest of your life is a long time. You've only been in this 4 years although it may already feel like a lifetime. You have 10 more of those lifetime's to go. A celibate lifetime with a roommate you increasingly resent is a tough prison sentence to serve. There is so much more I could say about that true lifetime of enforced celibacy but it is well documented in the other stories here by those like me that were in for 30 years or more. And if you don't have any children yet, you want to think very carefully about that. No matter how little sex any of us got, there always seemed to be just enough to create children to chain us to our refusers. |
|
|
|
Post by lyn on Dec 15, 2016 16:57:57 GMT -5
Hi mrigman! I'm not a pessimistic person by nature, however, a big fan of soft data obtained from a large collective of "the refused" frequenting here, and other sites/forums similar this one. That being said, as you probably know because you've read a lot in ILIASM already, the chances of your wife turning it around are somewhere around 1%, theoretically. Please just try to step back, review the data you've collected - re-read the accounts you've saved, and take a hard look at the "marriage" your're in. In any abusive situation (and yes, no matter how sweet and "non-manipulative" she portrays herself to be), somewhere in that subconscious of hers, she's mentally abusing you my dear by rejecting and abandoning you within the constraints of your marriage. Of course, if you can fully accept a life of celibacy (unless you decide to go outside of your relationship whilst still married) then you will probably live a long, happy life with this woman you've chosen as your wife. From your post, I really doubt you can come to this conclusion though. If your really honest with your self. Just my two-cents. In any case, this is such a supportive place for of us in this situation. Please stick around! |
|
|
|
Post by thebaffledking on Dec 15, 2016 17:21:10 GMT -5
mrigman,
Part of that data consists of a huge number of new posters who have tentatively googled sexless marriage and want to see what others think, is there any saving it because I'd never ever leave my marriage, I love my wife, she's so awesome!!!!!!!!! Well, I was that guy. I first 'Ask Jeeves-ed' sexless marriage in 2007......after five or six years of soul-destroying, life-sucking clinging to a dream, I was still saying "BUT I LOVE HER!" in 2013........years wasted, nothing changed......now, and I mean RIGHT NOW, I am waking up in my own bed, my own room, as I've done since 2008.....joyless, spiritually vacant, travel books, screenplays, Gibson SG and amp, old photo albums of when I once lived.........literally sitting over in the corner under years of dust.....things I once loved......vicious and unyielding bouts of depression.......my 'mind' and my emotions are permanently damaged by all of this........thousands upon thousands of days of grinding away on this......distant now from family and friends because, well, what's to say anymore?.........I am painting an accurate picture for you......this is my life at this moment. If I were to get lucky, I may live another 30-35 years........and I have JUST enough energy left to walk away from here after the holidays. I'm going to die with my boots on. I still have a shred of dignity, my legacy (I have three children 20/22/26)......I have been through hell in a gasoline suit.........and I used to be like you in what I thought of my marriage and wife.......last night, I made a pizza for myself......there was plenty, so I debated whether to offer her some (continuing to be civil) or not.......I'm a good person, she's not.......finally it just slipped out -- "There's plenty of pizza of if you'd like some." Do you know what she said to me? She said nothing. And I kicked myself for the 12,538th time.....and then crawled another few feet towards The Holidays, just wanting them and their visits to be over so I can leave here and see if there's anything left out there to save me.
mrigman......the warnings you're getting are real.......from people who all started out exactly where you are. Heed the warnings.....give your wife an ultimatum before it's too late. Love yourSELF first.
(and if anyone should think, 'Meh, these men and women here are probably a bunch of gross, washed-up losers', look around at our photos!!!! This place is a goldmine of hotness, it really is!! Good, interesting, fun, hot people who just happened to get burned by a bad decision!!)
|
|
|
|
Post by GeekGoddess on Dec 15, 2016 18:13:59 GMT -5
thebaffledking - I nearly cried aloud for the "photo albums of pics from when I used to live" love to ya brother - stay strong, stay resilient- and don't offer her kindnesses that aren't for your own benefit dear. She'll just keep pissing on your overtures from all the data there is.
|
|
|
|
Post by callisto on Dec 15, 2016 18:38:36 GMT -5
mrigman, Part of that data consists of a huge number of new posters who have tentatively googled sexless marriage and want to see what others think, is there any saving it because I'd never ever leave my marriage, I love my wife, she's so awesome!!!!!!!!! Well, I was that guy. I first 'Ask Jeeves-ed' sexless marriage in 2007......after five or six years of soul-destroying, life-sucking clinging to a dream, I was still saying "BUT I LOVE HER!" in 2013........years wasted, nothing changed......now, and I mean RIGHT NOW, I am waking up in my own bed, my own room, as I've done since 2008.....joyless, spiritually vacant, travel books, screenplays, Gibson SG and amp, old photo albums of when I once lived.........literally sitting over in the corner under years of dust.....things I once loved......vicious and unyielding bouts of depression.......my 'mind' and my emotions are permanently damaged by all of this........thousands upon thousands of days of grinding away on this......distant now from family and friends because, well, what's to say anymore?.........I am painting an accurate picture for you......this is my life at this moment. If I were to get lucky, I may live another 30-35 years........and I have JUST enough energy left to walk away from here after the holidays. I'm going to die with my boots on. I still have a shred of dignity, my legacy (I have three children 20/22/26)......I have been through hell in a gasoline suit.........and I used to be like you in what I thought of my marriage and wife.......last night, I made a pizza for myself......there was plenty, so I debated whether to offer her some (continuing to be civil) or not.......I'm a good person, she's not.......finally it just slipped out -- "There's plenty of pizza of if you'd like some." Do you know what she said to me? She said nothing. And I kicked myself for the 12,538th time.....and then crawled another few feet towards The Holidays, just wanting them and their visits to be over so I can leave here and see if there's anything left out there to save me. mrigman......the warnings you're getting are real.......from people who all started out exactly where you are. Heed the warnings.....give your wife an ultimatum before it's too late. Love yourSELF first. (and if anyone should think, 'Meh, these men and women here are probably a bunch of gross, washed-up losers', look around at our photos!!!! This place is a goldmine of hotness, it really is!! Good, interesting, fun, hot people who just happened to get burned by a bad decision!!) BK, I really, really wish you the best in your escape for the New Year. |
|
|
|
Post by lyn on Dec 15, 2016 18:41:55 GMT -5
thebaffledking just want to hug you with tears streaming down my face after reading this post. Your heartbreak is palpable in every post - this one though........ you are a hell of a guy, it's obvious. Life will be awesome again! She Is a fool. Please try to dust off that collection in the corner - that Gibson misses you! Plug in that amp and shred that - tell her to stfu when she tells you to turn it down.
|
|
). If you like math, charts and figures, think about extrapolating a chart of your misery index decades into the future. If you make a decision based on how you fell about things now, you will likely vastly underestimate your misery index 10 years from now, and then 20.
