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Post by brian on Aug 1, 2017 20:58:24 GMT -5
"Then we got married. We fucked once during our honeymoon. Maybe another 3 or 4 times between then and the conception of our first child. It was 2 years before she would engage in that activity with me again (when she was ready to have another child). Lather. Rinse. Repeat. Until she was done having children." If you didn't have some hangups about sex, you wouldn't have stayed with a woman who even at the beginning of your marriage had sex with you so infrequently. You would have felt that sex was an essential part of marriage, and since she wasn't willing, there was no reason to stay married. Keep in mind I'm saying this as someone who left an SM. To do this, I had to clarify to myself that sex was normal, healthy and an essential part of marriage. To leave, I had to completely believe that I was normal and healthy and my spouse was flat out wrong, and our marriage was grossly dysfunctional. It took me more than 30 years to get to that point. I don't believe that saying you'll have affairs makes up for a SM. If you believed that sexual love is important as part of a marriage, you wouldn't stay with someone who is basically a roommate and a co-parent. An affair wouldn't give you the kind of love that you wanted when you married. Presumably, you wanted a committed, public love that included sex. You weren't seeking a sex-only arrangement that had to be hidden. I get what you are saying northstarmom. My hangups were more about disappointing others than about recognizing that the sexual frequency was off. I spent years "why chasing". Each pregnancy, she would become very ill. Sometimes to the point of requiring trips to the emergency room. Write off 10 months. Recovery from giving birth. Write off another 3 months. Write off a few more months of being insanely tired from having a baby around. THEN start wondering why she didn't want to have sex with me. Fast forward just a few months... have sex a few times in a short span, 2 weeks later, and we are repeating the cycle again. So there was real, physical, reasons why she wasn't interested, and being the loving husband, was willing to give her the room she wanted. After the forth child (I know, WHAT WAS I THINKING!?!) and nearly 2 years later (2007) is when I started to really question the validity of our marriage. I found EP. I read EVERYTHING on the ILIASM forum and checked in nightly to read new posts and comments. I began to understand things at a deeper level. I tried to relate to my refuser. I tried to convince her that sex was necessary, needed, and normal. Like many here, I did that for YEARS. I pretty much gave up in 2014, started planning my exit. Told myself that I was out by my next b-day. It came. It went. Still in my ILIASM shithole. Set my sights on 2015... give it one more year. Maybe if she sees that I'm serious... yeah... that one came and went too. This cycle, from what I can gather, is a rather normal experience. Baz even posted about it once (or twice, or more ) ). We go back and forth mentally until we get our shit together and can courageously move forward. We are now working at putting our kids through college (1 already started, 1 goes next year, other 2 follow later on), and I bristle at the thought of upending their world right now. Yes, I know they would survive. Yes, I know that the older two would understand. But it's just not going to happen right now. I have accepted this delay.... ...but in 2015 I was able to reach a point mentally where outsourcing was okay in my mind, and have been operating like that ever since. I have been extremely open about that with my refuser, actually HOPING (probably foolishly) that maybe, just MAYBE, she would at least TRY to have a physical relationship with me. That's apparently not in the cards. After calling her out point blank yesterday for promising sex the night before and reneging (can't count the number of times she's done that... MANY), she wanted to try and make it up to me last night. Her attempt was that she would allow me to hold her breasts for about 3 minutes. Then she sent me to the couch for the night so she could sleep. So... do I simply want to root just anybody? Probably for the first couple of times, YES!!! Because I want to feel what it's like to have sex with someone who wants to have sex with me, even if there isn't much/any emotional connection. Would/Will I be happy with such an arrangement long-term? I seriously doubt it, but I'll cross that bridge later. If you consider that I didn't want to knee-jerk leave the relationship immediately as having a sexual "hangup", that's fine, but I can trace my choices and actions all the way to the beginning and understand how I got here. Knowing what I know now, I would have chosen differently. Only knowing what I knew then, I would have made the exact choices that I did all over again.
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Post by brian on Aug 1, 2017 19:09:34 GMT -5
Wow! I haven't thought about this in a while, and now I only need 23 posts to be a senior member. Soon, everyone will have to start taking me seriously! I don't take myself seriously, so why in the hell would anybody else? LOL
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Post by brian on Aug 1, 2017 18:53:06 GMT -5
I believe many of us ended up in SMS due to our own hang ups. We were afraid or ashamed of our own sexual feelings and therefore chose someone who would not be interested in sex with us. Oh, that's definitely NOT me. I have always been in touch with my sexual feelings. I made a very thoughtful decision (or so I thought) before marrying my now roommate... although she did not share the same sexual leanings/desires that I had, the actual sex with her was really good and I decided that I could live without the rest (mostly giving oral) because the rest was adequate to show me how much she cared. Then we got married. We fucked once during our honeymoon. Maybe another 3 or 4 times between then and the conception of our first child. It was 2 years before she would engage in that activity with me again (when she was ready to have another child). Lather. Rinse. Repeat. Until she was done having children. I will have sex with just about any woman that expresses an interest in having sex with me, and I'm not bashful about it any longer.
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Post by brian on Aug 1, 2017 18:45:25 GMT -5
My wife of 22 years claims that we aren't having sex because she doesn't feel like we are emotionally connected. To me, that seems like a cop out answer. Apparently before we were together, she had no problem having sex with guys she just met. So, there's a small little chasm in between that I am trying to reconcile her logic on. To me, sex keeps a marriage alive and creates emotional intimacy. Extremely frustrating. Seems to me if we would just have sex more often, some of the emotional connection would return pretty quickly. I know it would on my end. yeah... mine is like that too... it's just moving the goalpost, delaying giving you sex, deflecting the blame. I've stopped playing that game. I attempt with my wife every now and then just to watch her reaction and see what reason she gives -- from being tired, headache, etc. to one of my favorites last week of "All you're showing me is lust. I want LOVE." In other words, slow down so that she can think of another reason to stop. It's like denying water to a horse for a day, walking it down to a lake, and only allowing it to walk along the shore. So, I made a game of it... at least in my head. I openly tell her that I am looking for an AP, but I think she believes that I won't ever find anyone. There's plenty more, but this isn't my thread.
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Post by brian on Aug 1, 2017 18:36:39 GMT -5
Sorry to ask the obvious. But there must be a reason. I have never heard one from my W that I believe in the last ten years. Or more like she never really gives a reason. Acts like it is normal. But I rack my brains everyday. We are both fit and healthy, content in other ways. My wife is attractive and nobody's ever said I am not. I always dreamt of falling in love and getting married but most of the possible reasons for our sexless marriage are so hurtful it tears me up inside. I am no good at reading some people and I work so hard that I just can't find the time to tackle this. Don't think I would manage anyway. I don't think I would really know where to start. I have never kept a friend that has kind of let me down, you know, why bother, but with a spouse you have to try to figure stuff out. So much else I would rather do - like have a laugh or some actual sex. WTF. But has anyone ever found a reason or do people just get a blank. Carl, welcome to the place none of us ever wanted to be in. I think everyone else has said it all, but one last thing -- grab a bucket of popcorn, sit down, and start reading through this site. In it you will find lots of insight and wisdom that will get you thinking about your own feelings and stop worrying about what your refuser is thinking or why/how you got here. The fact is you are here, and it's what you do from this point forward that matters, not what has happened in the past.
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Post by brian on Jul 31, 2017 20:58:46 GMT -5
Not even a little bit. It's all I can do to get her to make me a bowl of soup when I'm not feeling well. I've been injured several times and she still expected me to do all the housework that I normally do. If I end up seriously sick, I'm better off in a nursing home. I'd volunteer to go. If the nursing home is like this joke, I'm all in! Ethel was a bit of a demon in her wheelchair, and loved to charge around the nursing home, taking corners on one wheel and getting up to maximum speed on the long corridors. Because the poor woman was one sandwich short of a picnic the other residents tolerated her and some of them actually joined in. One day Ethel was speeding up one corridor when a door opened and Kooky Clarence stepped out with his arm outstretched. "STOP!" he shouted in a firm voice. "Have you got a license for that thing?" Ethel fished around in her handbag and pulled out a Kit Kat wrapper and held it up to him. "OK" he said, and away Ethel sped down the hall. As she took the corner near the TV lounge on one wheel, weird Harold popped out in front of her and shouted "STOP! Have you got proof of insurance?" Ethel dug into her handbag, pulled out a drink coaster and held it up to him. Harold nodded and said "On your way, Ma'am." As Ethel neared the final corridor, Crazy Craig stepped out in front of her, Butt-Naked, and holding his "You-Know- What" in his hand. "Oh, good grief," yelled Ethel "Not that Damn Breathalyzer Test again.!!!"
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Post by brian on Jul 30, 2017 6:22:48 GMT -5
I think all of us at one point have sat in a car not wanting to go home. Or sat in the driveway "listening to the end of a song." Or gone to work early and stayed late just to have the opportunity to talk to someone who isn't currently hurting you. ^^^^^^ This!
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Post by brian on Jul 29, 2017 7:53:21 GMT -5
I don't have an answer for you there. I wish I knew what was going on inside my refuser's head as well. She'll "promise" a sexual encounter "when she returns" while she is on a business trip (from a safe place, mentally), but after 15 years of those promises with ZERO deliveries, I can't see how she thinks that I might actually believe that she might deliver.
I have told her straight up that if I ever found someone that would have sex with me, I was taking them up on the offer. I suppose she thinks that no one would ever offer because she hasn't changed her behavior at all.
She continually says that we need to work on our intimacy, but she would rather watch shows on her ipad until 2am than spend some awake time in bed with me.
I gave up a few years ago trying to understand what's going on in her head. That's akin to the "why chasing" that has been discussed numerous times. At this point, I have simply chosen to do things for me. My room mate has noticed a difference, but hasn't acted upon it. At this point, the amount of work she needs to do to turn this around is beyond what she is willing/capable of doing, IMO, so I have chosen to live my life for me (albeit in a relatively non-selfish manner as it pertains to my kids).
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Post by brian on Jul 26, 2017 6:34:14 GMT -5
Devils advocate here: what if instead of asking the refuser to chamge, we change. Not for our refusers sake but for ourselves. What if we took better care of ourselves, dropped those few pounds we carry around, updated the wardrobe, got a new haircut, take that trip, start that hobby. Forget the refuser for awhile. Focus on ourselves, our needs, our happiness. At some point the refuser might notice. And if they dont, fuck 'em. You will probably have attracted half a dozen new potential partners by the time the transformation is done. Maybe the change starts within us. Of course it is possible if a Refuser wants to change. But that is the issue, the vast majority of refusers don't give a flying fuck in hell how their behavior affects their spouses. Doing this right now myself. I'm doing what I'm doing for me. Not for her. Not for our relationship. Not for anybody else in this world. I'm living for me.
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Post by brian on Jul 21, 2017 7:17:16 GMT -5
I have made no secret of myself here. I haven't exactly sent my wife the url for this site, but she knows that I frequent an online SM forum. I don't even hide my name (I did on EP). I am who I am. I'm on here for me. If my roommate and legal spouse wants to check up on me here, so be it. But... I do have a complication. My vindictive, rebellious 14yr old son (kid 3 of 4), found me here, made a fake profile, and then sent me a private message: Need Some help you freak? Gotta love kids! That's mortifying and somewhat impressive. Kids these days 😳😳 I never acknowledged even seeing it. Haven't mentioned it to anyone before. I have no desire to give him the pleasure of knowing that he pushed my buttons. Instead, I am hoping that he wondered if he sent it to the right person or not. He tried to hide his identity by using a name different than his own, but he didn't do a good enough job at it and I can see his real identity.
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Post by brian on Jul 19, 2017 19:00:28 GMT -5
I have made no secret of myself here. I haven't exactly sent my wife the url for this site, but she knows that I frequent an online SM forum. I don't even hide my name (I did on EP). I am who I am. I'm on here for me. If my roommate and legal spouse wants to check up on me here, so be it.
But... I do have a complication. My vindictive, rebellious 14yr old son (kid 3 of 4), found me here, made a fake profile, and then sent me a private message:
Need Some help you freak?
Gotta love kids!
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Post by brian on Jul 19, 2017 6:06:20 GMT -5
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Post by brian on Jul 16, 2017 16:54:02 GMT -5
@shynjdude , you are exactly right. Anyone who stays in a SM for any length of time is a wonderful person. But if you express any dissatisfaction to your refuser, the refuser will accuse you of being selfish. Then you try to take a close look at yourself to get rid of any trace of selfishness. This is how the refuser keeps control of us. Yep! "All you think about is sex!" Uh... no, I'm not that simple "If I gave it to you and did nothing else, you would think our marriage was great!" Ummm... no, but the lack of sex is killing our marriage and I can hardly believe that you can't see that! My refuser refuses to see that what I am asking for is normal, natural, and part of a healthy relationship.
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Post by brian on Jul 16, 2017 16:33:05 GMT -5
Congratulations! I got snipped back on 02, and it was one of my best decisions. It was a huge advantage in outsourcing. Sorry about the 20 times. You can just masturbate, but then it may be time to start looking for applicants for outsourcing. Yeah... been looking
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Post by brian on Jul 16, 2017 16:32:05 GMT -5
brian , congratulations Enjoy the 20 xxx Enjoy the 20? It will be just more of the same. LOL I haven't had an orgasm induced by another person in over a decade!
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