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Post by lonelyhubby on Jul 17, 2024 17:12:00 GMT -5
Perhaps you should stop doing that for her - let her see it from her end.
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Post by Apocrypha on Jul 23, 2024 12:24:03 GMT -5
Yep, and as my wife said to me. "You wouldn't abandon everything we've built just over sex would you?". It just doesn't occur the refuser how important it is until it directly effects them as I've now discovered first hand. Apocrypha may have already responded to that pithy dismissal of your simple human needs with the observation that refusers are equally ready to abandon everything you've built just over sex. All that therapy, yet the only thing that fixes a sexless marriage is a credible threat to monogamy (including post-divorce sex). Marriage counselors should have a much worse reputation than they currently enjoy. I did indeed. Could set my watch to its appearance in the dialogue. From her end of it, all that has transpired in this ordeal is an occasional disagreement, and perhaps a discussion in therapy that she hopes might avert something serious that could happen one day. That's a price SHE is willing to pay. This isn't real until an actual material consequence happens. Not a "signal". Taking your ring off, sleeping in another room - those might raise an eyebrow that you are pointed at something serious, but even they don't carry the heft. Divorce papers and/or beginning a mediation process, discovering an affair, moving out (with no plan to move back), or being posed with an either/or choice of open marriage vs divorce, with an immediate and imminent plan for either one - present a threat credible enough to take seriously, with a consequence attached to doing nothing, or not choosing. |
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Post by Apocrypha on Jul 23, 2024 12:48:19 GMT -5
I think one of the most difficult parts of this is when the other partner minimizes or doesn't fully grasp the loneliness that comes with sexlessness. They don't grasp it or care, because most likely their needs are still being met by the rejected spouse Or, their needs are not met either, but they regard their own celibacy as a sacrifice they are willing to make to preserve the marriage. This makes them the hero in their own minds, the longer they can endure the marriage while lacking someone who they consider a sexual partner. It also means that every time their partner prioritizes sex as a problem to be solved, their partner threatens the marriage. |
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Post by mirrororchid on Jul 29, 2024 14:58:47 GMT -5
Yes, my spouse has told me that she gets it and feels bad. Other times she asks how I feel lonely when we do other things together like watch tv or go on walks. What would happen if you were up for TV and sex, but you would endlessly, always, tell her, "No", you don't want to go for walks. She's been indoors for months but you're never in the mood. She can't seem to explain "cabin fever" to you and the fact you won't just go for the walk once in a while is confusing and hurtful after a while. She goes on walks alone, yes and you ask why it matters so much that you be there. She says she's lonely, but you do the other two things, sex and TV. She goes for the walks, why do you have to be there when it happens? It's the same isn't it? We "bond" over this? I don't get it. I know I should. I don't get why it's important to you, but you keep saying it is. I just gotta accept that, but I just don't think about it and I haven't made time. Maybe tomorrow. |
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m76
Full Member
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Post by m76 on Aug 4, 2024 17:55:51 GMT -5
I've been having a rough time for a couple of weeks now.
So in counciling I had expressed that my minimum needs are some kind of sexual touch one a week. That really is bare minimum, I'd of course would rather have sex everyday if I could. So we worked out our intimacy date nights.
Last date night didn't go well (I was touching her "wrong") and the mood was killed after she told me she felt I was treating her like a toy. For context I was accidently brushing my hand on her ear which she doesn't like. The date before that one was cancelled and this week's didn't happen either.
In addition to this I was helping her move stuff back into the house from an author's thing she had gone to and I noticed the LGBTQA flag and an asexual (ace) flag that she displayed on her sale table.
When i saw those flags it hit me hard that she will never want or desire me. She can say she loves me and may even offer pity HJ's from time to time, but the reason we miss so many sessions and that they need to be scheduled, is because she really really doesn't want sex, it's part of her identity.
I know I have to talk to her about separating but it's so hard, and I don't know how I'm going to do it but without a doubt I know I'll be miserable as long as I'm with her.
Not looking for advice right now, I know what has to be done, just not sure I can.
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Post by lonelytiger on Aug 4, 2024 20:05:35 GMT -5
I've been having a rough time for a couple of weeks now. So in counciling I had expressed that my minimum needs are some kind of sexual touch one a week. That really is bare minimum, I'd of course would rather have sex everyday if I could. So we worked out our intimacy date nights. Last date night didn't go well (I was touching her "wrong") and the mood was killed after she told me she felt I was treating her like a toy. For context I was accidently brushing my hand on her ear which she doesn't like. The date before that one was cancelled and this week's didn't happen either. In addition to this I was helping her move stuff back into the house from an author's thing she had gone to and I noticed the LGBTQA flag and an asexual (ace) flag that she displayed on her sale table. When i saw those flags it hit me hard that she will never want or desire me. She can say she loves me and may even offer pity HJ's from time to time, but the reason we miss so many sessions and that they need to be scheduled, is because she really really doesn't want sex, it's part of her identity. I know I have to talk to her about separating but it's so hard, and I don't know how I'm going to do it but without a doubt I know I'll be miserable as long as I'm with her. Not looking for advice right now, I know what has to be done, just not sure I can. Do you think your wife is asexual? Sometimes I wonder if mine is that as well, as she doesn't respond at all to anything sexual and she doesn't like dirty talk/slang for anything sexual. She has told me she can take it or leave it when it comes to sex. |
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Post by worksforme2 on Aug 5, 2024 7:26:23 GMT -5
I've been having a rough time for a couple of weeks now. So in counciling I had expressed that my minimum needs are some kind of sexual touch one a week. That really is bare minimum, I'd of course would rather have sex everyday if I could. So we worked out our intimacy date nights. Last date night didn't go well (I was touching her "wrong") and the mood was killed after she told me she felt I was treating her like a toy. For context I was accidently brushing my hand on her ear which she doesn't like. The date before that one was cancelled and this week's didn't happen either. In addition to this I was helping her move stuff back into the house from an author's thing she had gone to and I noticed the LGBTQA flag and an asexual (ace) flag that she displayed on her sale table. When i saw those flags it hit me hard that she will never want or desire me. She can say she loves me and may even offer pity HJ's from time to time, but the reason we miss so many sessions and that they need to be scheduled, is because she really really doesn't want sex, it's part of her identity. I know I have to talk to her about separating but it's so hard, and I don't know how I'm going to do it but without a doubt I know I'll be miserable as long as I'm with her. Not looking for advice right now, I know what has to be done, just not sure I can. In Augest of '23 when this post 1st started you began recieving replies and thoughts from the members here. I went back to refresh my memory . I wrote at that time your W barely tolerates you and that she was unlikely to change her behavior. Others voiced similiar thoughts. Now it is 1 yr. later and very little has changed, except that you may be seeing her openly embracing a homosexual mindset. It's likely this has been in the background all along, just not openly voiced. She continues to treat you like a doormat. No advice, just offering an observation on her behavior following her return from this latest trip. It looks like she is sending you a very clear signal. Are you really getting the message? If you know what has to be done are you going to begin taking the actions you need to, to address your finances and family dynamics, or are you going to wring your hands for another year? |
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Post by toughtiger on Aug 5, 2024 7:43:23 GMT -5
I think letting go is hard and even if you see the situation clearly ... part is finance ...
part is relationship with child even grown kids and dismantling a life is hard...
I think part is not wanting to see our mistakes when i look at spouse and even talk to my therapist it is harder to see WHY ....
why did i not leave a long time ago or WHY i got together with this person as they had long term friends and family that had reservations etc.
it never fails to amaze me when people continue to do things that simply do not work i think it is hard to admit we made errors or did not see or ignored a problem to make our decision "correct"
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Post by lonelytiger on Aug 5, 2024 8:16:05 GMT -5
I think letting go is hard and even if you see the situation clearly ... part is finance ... part is relationship with child even grown kids and dismantling a life is hard... I think part is not wanting to see our mistakes when i look at spouse and even talk to my therapist it is harder to see WHY .... why did i not leave a long time ago or WHY i got together with this person as they had long term friends and family that had reservations etc. it never fails to amaze me when people continue to do things that simply do not work i think it is hard to admit we made errors or did not see or ignored a problem to make our decision "correct" I'm getting the same thought process going now that I've been seeing a counselor and discussing among other things my marriage and the lack of sexual intimacy in my marriage. My counselor has even asked me why I am still with her even though we are incompatible when it comes to sex since it's very important to me. When she asked me that it was like something hit me over the head. As embarrassing as it was to discuss these things with my counselor I'm glad I did. I'm still processing through things and haven't decided yet what I want to do but you mentioned two things that are holding me back on wanting to leave: finances and our kids. I don't think my wife is leaning homosexual, but I do honestly think she's truly asexual and I just didn't see the signs at the beginning of our marriage until years later. |
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Post by toughtiger on Aug 5, 2024 21:02:19 GMT -5
I'm getting the same thought process going now that I've been seeing a counselor and discussing among other things my marriage and the lack of sexual intimacy in my marriage. My counselor has even asked me why I am still with her even though we are incompatible when it comes to sex since it's very important to me. When she asked me that it was like something hit me over the head. As embarrassing as it was to discuss these things with my counselor I'm glad I did. I'm still processing through things and haven't decided yet what I want to do but you mentioned two things that are holding me back on wanting to leave: finances and our kids. I don't think my wife is leaning homosexual, but I do honestly think she's truly asexual and I just didn't see the signs at the beginning of our marriage until years later. I guess i am skeptical of the whole A sexual thing ..... I mean I get it if they never wanted sex .....ever .......but so many seem to be OK with sex, up to a certain point............... then decide they are a sexual about the time they are done with having kids or such. so if they love their spouse why would they use them and then decide the arrangement no longer works..... seems selfish and sad. |
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Post by lonelytiger on Aug 5, 2024 21:08:46 GMT -5
I'm getting the same thought process going now that I've been seeing a counselor and discussing among other things my marriage and the lack of sexual intimacy in my marriage. My counselor has even asked me why I am still with her even though we are incompatible when it comes to sex since it's very important to me. When she asked me that it was like something hit me over the head. As embarrassing as it was to discuss these things with my counselor I'm glad I did. I'm still processing through things and haven't decided yet what I want to do but you mentioned two things that are holding me back on wanting to leave: finances and our kids. I don't think my wife is leaning homosexual, but I do honestly think she's truly asexual and I just didn't see the signs at the beginning of our marriage until years later. I guess i am skeptical of the whole A sexual thing ..... I mean I get it if they never wanted sex .....ever .......but so many seem to be OK with sex, up to a certain point............... then decide they are a sexual about the time they are done with having kids or such. so if they love their spouse why would they use them and then decide the arrangement no longer works..... seems selfish and sad. Mine was okay with sex when we were dating. I was her first as well. Our wedding night should have been the first clue though that something was off as she really wasn’t into it and it’s when the oral sex stopped and I was told she found it disgusting. I had asked her years later why she was into oral and sex while we were dating and she said she was afraid I would have left her had she not done that. I honestly don’t know why I didn’t leave shortly after to be honest. We get along great other than the sex. |
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Post by lonelytiger on Aug 6, 2024 19:45:05 GMT -5
Note to self: don’t ever bring up the possibility of her being asexual. I tried to broach this subject with her tonight and she appeared to get offended saying I was trying to put a label on her and she hates labels. I played a video describing asexuality and she said she didn’t agree with it. Sure she doesn’t desire sex like I do and if she was single she could go the rest of her life without sex but she said she does occasionally desire it from me. Color me surprised.
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Post by lonelyhubby on Aug 7, 2024 7:23:44 GMT -5
Oh yeah = had than confrontation with the Wife after she told me "I never liked sex" - I demanded an explanation, which she resented, and I asked her point blank if she was asexual and never liked sex, why did she engage in so much sex before and for years after we married. she "clarified" and said it "changed" for her. I said, changed as in you decided you will never have sex again and don't desire it - AKA deciding you are asexual now? She got defensive and insulting and went off about me gaslighting HER.
Withholders don't like to be worked into logical corners that they paint for themselves. Replace the word sex with anything else in a relationship and people would call them as*holes for acting the way they do, but somehow because it is sex - nobody calls them out for their bullsh*t
And now - just yesterday she leaned over in bed and caressed my face and put her arms around me as she slept. I can't for the life of me figure her out anymore. Still not a kiss or sexual touch though.
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Post by lonelytiger on Aug 7, 2024 8:57:23 GMT -5
Don't you hate it when they get all defensive when you ask questions like this? Mine will also ask me why I can't just accept her for who she is. I keep telling her I accept her just fine, I'm just trying to figure out where the disconnect is coming from.
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Post by worksforme2 on Aug 7, 2024 10:09:14 GMT -5
Don't you hate it when they get all defensive when you ask questions like this? Mine will also ask me why I can't just accept her for who she is. I keep telling her I accept her just fine, I'm just trying to figure out where the disconnect is coming from. Along a similiar note, my X would ask me why I couldn't be like some of the other husbands among our friends who were also in a SM. She said they had accepted celibacy, so why couldn't I. I should have offered to meet her half way. I would accept her being celibate, if she would accept me getting sex outside the marriage. |
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