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Post by toughtiger on Mar 25, 2024 8:29:04 GMT -5
So, another week of no physical intimacy even after she "heard" me. I'm going to have to be more direct, before I had said I don't want to be celibate. I just have to tell her directly I will not be celibate and it's up to her if she wants me to be with her. Absolutely ... I bet therapists or others tell you to keep the conversation going and look at this improvement but NO ..... all words and no show is clear she thinks she can wear you down to just accepting this. Fake or snail pace progress does not help when we have already waited too long. |
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Post by worksforme2 on Mar 25, 2024 8:39:56 GMT -5
I want to agree histerical bonding isn't an always an act of desperation. Perhaps sometimes it is. Near the end of my SM I spoke several times to my W about me having a FWB. I went to some lenghts to assure the W I wasn't looking to totally replace her, just needed a woman for intimacy. She instead reset me for roughly 3 months (3rd or 4th time) and then back to refusing. My W was also enthusiastic and readily orgasmed, but it didn't mean mush over the longer time frame. I really don't get this. How can our spouses be so adverse to something that we know we both enjoy in the moment. Creates the intimate bonds and has so many other mental health benefits. My wife has also told me she always enjoyed it once we got going and we almost always both orgasmed. But now it's some kind of great hardship she's unwilling to endure even if it means me leaving her. I just don't get it man. Welcome to the club,....I never figured it out either. I know she enjoyed the intimacy and the orgasms. But one day out of the blue she no longer had any desire for intimacy and she insisted I should forget about it to. When I talked to her about it she had no reason or ratonal other than she simply was not interested any more. And she really wasn't it seems. Since our divorce she has not dated or even been out to eat with a man other than me.( 9yrs.) I feel fairly sure she would have made some comment about it if she had. |
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Post by toughtiger on Mar 25, 2024 9:14:26 GMT -5
there simply is NO rational ....
women besides perhaps getting some libido back can greatly benefit from some hormone treatment if in menopause.....
Recently listened to a long podcast on the subject of menopause. Very little studies done but that is changing... I found out lots of information about it that even I as a woman did not know. I can do things that help my libido when i find my new partner...
There are many health benefits and other then libido ........ many other symptoms and health problems ... we do not include with the basic hot flash and things..... Maybe it is a medical item that should be addressed .......as we women would expect our men to consider viagra like things if that was a possibility to help our lives.
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Post by ironhamster on Mar 25, 2024 22:16:56 GMT -5
It's OK to not understand what your spouse is thinking. They don't have to explain it. They don't have to explain why your needs aren't important to them. The "why" isn't important, so don't go "why chasing". What is important is their actions and lack thereof.
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patrick
Junior Member
Posts: 21
Age Range: 70+
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Post by patrick on Mar 25, 2024 23:17:40 GMT -5
I really don't get this. How can our spouses be so adverse to something that we know we both enjoy in the moment. Creates the intimate bonds and has so many other mental health benefits. My wife has also told me she always enjoyed it once we got going and we almost always both orgasmed. But now it's some kind of great hardship she's unwilling to endure even if it means me leaving her. I just don't get it man. Welcome to the club,....I never figured it out either. I know she enjoyed the intimacy and the orgasms. But one day out of the blue she no longer had any desire for intimacy and she insisted I should forget about it to. When I talked to her about it she had no reason or ratonal other than she simply was not interested any more. And she really wasn't it seems. Since our divorce she has not dated or even been out to eat with a man other than me.( 9yrs.) I feel fairly sure she would have made some comment about it if she had. Wait…is it not possible for a previously sexually active person to become asexual? I suspect this of my 67 year old wife.😳 |
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Post by ironhamster on Mar 26, 2024 1:21:41 GMT -5
patrick, yes, it is possible. I can tell you, if my libido ever fell off a cliff, so to speak, I would do whatever I could to get it back, but not everybody feels that way. I had a friend about four years ago whose wife decided she was done with sex, and told him to get it elsewhere with the agreement that he not embarrass her. IMHO, that is the honest loving thing to do.
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Post by worksforme2 on Mar 26, 2024 4:57:46 GMT -5
Wait…is it not possible for a previously sexually active person to become asexual? I suspect this of my 67 year old wife.😳 I never meant to infer it wasn't possible for someone who was once a very sexual being to become asexual. That is pretty much exactly the case with my X. When the hormones go away so does the libido in most cases. Like ironhamster when I realized my libido had fallen off I had my hormones checked. Turns out I had very low testerone numbers. Once I started therapy the libido came roaring back. I talked to my then W about HRT but she was not interested. She had 2 close relatives die from overian cancer so she would not risk it. About 10yrs. later she had her one ovary removed. |
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Missingout
Full Member
Posts: 245
Age Range: 46-50
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Post by Missingout on Mar 26, 2024 5:02:51 GMT -5
patrick, yes, it is possible. I can tell you, if my libido ever fell off a cliff, so to speak, I would do whatever I could to get it back, but not everybody feels that way. I had a friend about four years ago whose wife decided she was done with sex, and told him to get it elsewhere with the agreement that he not embarrass her. IMHO, that is the honest loving thing to do. I read a dead bedroom comment on Reddit yesterday that a husband took anti depressants to kill his libido!!! His doctor gave him this medication for that reason. Hesus what is wrong with people. The husband was happy after 6 months when it started working . My god people don’t understand the long term affects of these pills and he didn’t care. He was in his Mid 40s I believe. |
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Post by mirrororchid on Mar 26, 2024 5:53:43 GMT -5
Welcome to the club,....I never figured it out either. I know she enjoyed the intimacy and the orgasms. But one day out of the blue she no longer had any desire for intimacy and she insisted I should forget about it to. When I talked to her about it she had no reason or rationale other than she simply was not interested any more. And she really wasn't it seems. Since our divorce she has not dated or even been out to eat with a man other than me.( 9yrs.) I feel fairly sure she would have made some comment about it if she had. Wait…is it not possible for a previously sexually active person to become asexual? I suspect this of my 67 year old wife.😳 ILIASM member Apocrypha warns refused spouses that such "asexual" partners may end up very much reignited by a new partner. People take it personally, but they shouldn't. If a refusing spouse needs internal normal biological mechanisms to be sexual partners, then you did the right thing leaving. Why deprive them of life's joy just because it is impossible for it to occur with you? The refused spouse was not an option, regardless of staying or going. This is one of the reasons I think refused partners should not demand celibacy of their refusing spouses. "If you have anything in your tank, it's mine!" The only way for the tank to fill is for someone else's pheromones to fill it. It's not personal or conscious. (At least, it need not be.) Insistence that the only sex a refusing partner have be with the refused spouse is condemning them to celibacy just as the refusing spouse traps the refused. It is the flipside of the non-consensual celibacy refusers demand. Evolutionary psychology suggests disinterest has to do with biology deliberately breaking couples apart to force them to find new mates and to diversify the gene pool. Nevermind menopause has removed the reproductive advantage, the mechanism is not necessarily well-designed. The reasoning may extend past its logical purpose and there was no evolutionary pressure to restore libido to sexless elder partners. Guys will have a harder time of it because they are fertile well past menopause age and leaving a celibate mate could mean more kids. So the guys leave or stay and outsource more readily, if the theory holds. Why the male to female ratio here at ILIASM is fairly even, I tend to think women seek to discuss the matter more often, where guys will just charge forth and fix the problem as they see it, perhaps paying for the remedy. Let me address the refusal despite pleasant outcome issue. Some podcast hosts have compared it to being offered a lovely dessert or snack after having had a full meal. It may well be great if you take it, but you're under the impression it won't be a good thing at the time. You have no hunger, so it doesn't appeal. The biological condition isn't there. But if it's fresh cookies from scratch baked by your spouse, you'll try one out of love and may discover you're glad you accepted. In the sexual case, the pheromonal conditions aren't there so there's no arousal; no skin hunger. The idea has no appeal, even when the offer is a good one, perhaps consistently. It's not you. The mental decision to have the cookie anyway overrides the biological processes in play. Sex as a gesture you end up benefitting from is the same happy outcome, but does not change the underlying lack of natural initiative. |
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m76
Full Member
Posts: 419
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Post by m76 on Mar 26, 2024 6:19:09 GMT -5
Welcome to the club,....I never figured it out either. I know she enjoyed the intimacy and the orgasms. But one day out of the blue she no longer had any desire for intimacy and she insisted I should forget about it to. When I talked to her about it she had no reason or ratonal other than she simply was not interested any more. And she really wasn't it seems. Since our divorce she has not dated or even been out to eat with a man other than me.( 9yrs.) I feel fairly sure she would have made some comment about it if she had. Wait…is it not possible for a previously sexually active person to become asexual? I suspect this of my 67 year old wife.😳 They absolutely can. The problem in my relationship is that my wife (we're in our 40s) has been making excuses to not have sex for 15 years, with absolutely no contact for thr last 6. For all these years she's dangled the carrot saying "not tonight, I'm tired" or any other excuse. So for 15 years I've held onto hope that we could get back to a normal sex life. If she had been honest with me 15 years ago that "not now" really ment "not ever" I could have saved years of effort, rejection and depression. The lack of any kind of effort on her part to meet my needs tells me she doesn't really care about me at all. Even an asexual person can be affectionate with kisses and hugs possibility even enjoy other light sexual contact. |
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Post by lonelyhubby on Mar 26, 2024 6:36:56 GMT -5
Wait…is it not possible for a previously sexually active person to become asexual? I suspect this of my 67 year old wife.😳 They absolutely can. The problem in my relationship is that my wife (we're in our 40s) has been making excuses to not have sex for 15 years, with absolutely no contact for thr last 6. For all these years she's dangled the carrot saying "not tonight, I'm tired" or any other excuse. So for 15 years I've held onto hope that we could get back to a normal sex life. If she had been honest with me 15 years ago that "not now" really ment "not ever" I could have saved years of effort, rejection and depression. The lack of any kind of effort on her part to meet my needs tells me she doesn't really care about me at all. Even an asexual person can be affectionate with kisses and hugs possibility even enjoy other light sexual contact. I 100% agree. Asexuality is the new excuse replacing the headache. By making it a sexual identity - it is guarded and beyond reproach ("you can't judge me I'm asexual"). This is simply a dodge of responsibility to own and address the problem within themselves as to why they have chosen celibacy and forced celibacy as a replacement to a healthy marriage. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Mar 26, 2024 7:46:39 GMT -5
As I've mentioned before there's "greysexual" where they decide to turn the switch on or off as they choose. Concerning women ( my ex W) they can turn it on hot and heavy to procreate then they're done. Forcing celibacy on you. Until the divorce,when their whole world is turned upside down,and their cozy reputation of a 'happy marriage' gets exposed!
I'd like to know a % of how many (asexual/greysexual) turn the switch back on after the divorce,and how long it lasts? Something to be aware of when re-entering the dating pool .
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Post by worksforme2 on Mar 26, 2024 8:05:01 GMT -5
As I've mentioned before there's "greysexual" where they decide to turn the switch on or off as they choose. Concerning women ( my ex W) they can turn it on hot and heavy to procreate then they're done. Forcing celibacy on you. Until the divorce,when their whole world is turned upside down,and their cozy reputation of a 'happy marriage' gets exposed! I'd like to know a % of how many (asexual/greysexual) turn the switch back on after the divorce,and how long it lasts? Something to be aware of when re-entering the dating pool . This possibility is one of the reasons I use messaging and 1st meets to establish a potential partners sexual state. If she hasn't had sex in years the red flags come into view. If she is honest and says she is done with sex then I am done with her. When dating after leaving a SM one really needs to establish that the dating relationship will not be celibate. |
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Post by h on Mar 30, 2024 6:47:44 GMT -5
patrick, yes, it is possible. I can tell you, if my libido ever fell off a cliff, so to speak, I would do whatever I could to get it back, but not everybody feels that way. I had a friend about four years ago whose wife decided she was done with sex, and told him to get it elsewhere with the agreement that he not embarrass her. IMHO, that is the honest loving thing to do. I read a dead bedroom comment on Reddit yesterday that a husband took anti depressants to kill his libido!!! His doctor gave him this medication for that reason. Hesus what is wrong with people. The husband was happy after 6 months when it started working . My god people don’t understand the long term affects of these pills and he didn’t care. He was in his Mid 40s I believe. I looked into antidepressants once for this reason. The main reason I decided against it was that I wanted a temporary solution. I read that there were cases where the drugs changed a person's brain chemistry to the point that even after coming off the drugs, their libido never came back. |
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m76
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Posts: 419
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Post by m76 on Apr 1, 2024 16:50:03 GMT -5
So, we have another counciling session tomorrow.
I have no idea what we're going to talk about. Its been a few weeks now since the idea of a shower together was brought up and she said it would be something she'd be willing to do. Multiple opportunities have come and gone with her rejecting everything I suggest.
At this point I don't want to try anymore. She's says she's open to trying things and that she's "heard" me but the reality is that her actions are clearly saying my needs don't matter to her.
The best we've done in 3 months of "trying" is 2 minutes of kissing once, and a few cuddle sessions while watching TV.
The only question I need to tackle now is do I live as roommates until my son is done high-school or do rip off the bandaid and just leave.
The other option is to find a "friend" without her permission(shes already rejected this idea). I know some here encourage this, but I think when she finds out, that arrangement would be used as ammunition against me with family and friends. So I'm not yet willing to go there.
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