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Post by shamwow on Jul 13, 2018 11:19:04 GMT -5
Baza, there is one more option that we have unfortunately seen many times here. It's the crash, swerve, crash, swerve, crash through approach. This technique involves making the leave decision (or having it made for you), swerving back into the lane, crashing into a guardrail, swerving back into the road, and repeating the process until the vehicle finally comes to a stop. It's a bit like when I used to drive fucked up in the old days. It seemed bad to me, but was a terror for anyone in the car with me and for anybody in my path. Without naming names, we have seen many examples of this on this forum. Not a pretty sight. Have I mentioned how much I love ILIASM?  Just be sure not to join their esteemed number, friend. 👍 |
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Post by saarinista on Jul 13, 2018 22:09:25 GMT -5
@shynjdude look, you've had all of this financial security for years. did it make ya happy? nope. because it never could.
stop worrying so much about money. it's only going to keep you stuck. You are going to come out of the divorce with a bit less money. But the money you have now isn't making you happy, so I'd say it's not that important. Divorce is not a money saving option. It's a way to get away from another person so you can have a happy life.
And if you don't think you can live with less money, you are wrong. I do. Many live with less than all of us on this forum.
You've commented many times on this forum about your long-term unhappiness with your marriage. I'm not a fortune teller, but my best advice to you, my friend, is to get with the lawyer and proceed with all due haste in the divorce.
I don't know about all this medical stuff your wife wants done with your insurance. Personally, I'm sitting here with a broken wrist in a splint (not a cast; the ER wont do casts) right now which has yet to be seen by an orthopedic surgeon because many won't take my Obamacare insurance so I can't get an appointment very quickly. It's a bummer, but I don't have a job with corporate insurance and neither does my husband so that's all I can get. Guess what? I'm surviving. Your wife can too.
If your wife wanted people to keep living in the style to which she'd become accustomed, she should have cared more about the state of your marriage. My sense is that your marriage was never really happy. End it. You'll be doing both of you a favor.
Move forward. It's the only sensible alternative.
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Post by tirefire on Jul 14, 2018 12:41:45 GMT -5
@shynjdude, sorry, busy week. Just reading this all now. Hang in there. Things always seem more hectic and chaotic when you are in the middle of it. Feel good that the wheels are rolling and you are on your way to happiness. I'm hoping things work out for you in the short term as well.
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Post by shamwow on Jul 14, 2018 18:21:18 GMT -5
@shynjdude look, you've had all of this financial security for years. did it make ya happy? nope. because it never could. stop worrying so much about money. it's only going to keep you stuck. You are going to come out of the divorce with a bit less money. But the money you have now isn't making you happy, so I'd say it's not that important. Divorce is not a money saving option. It's a way to get away from another person so you can have a happy life. And if you don't think you can live with less money, you are wrong. I do. Many live with less than all of us on this forum. You've commented many times on this forum about your long-term unhappiness with your marriage. I'm not a fortune teller, but my best advice to you, my friend, is to get with the lawyer and proceed with all due haste in the divorce. I don't know about all this medical stuff your wife wants done with your insurance. Personally, I'm sitting here with a broken wrist in a splint (not a cast; the ER wont do casts) right now which has yet to be seen by an orthopedic surgeon because many won't take my Obamacare insurance so I can't get an appointment very quickly. It's a bummer, but I don't have a job with corporate insurance and neither does my husband so that's all I can get. Guess what? I'm surviving. Your wife can too. If your wife wanted people to keep living in the style to which she'd become accustomed, she should have cared more about the state of your marriage. My sense is that your marriage was never really happy. End it. You'll be doing both of you a favor. Move forward. It's the only sensible alternative. Divorce is not a money saving option? Totally true...at least at first. Depending on your ex, it could pay for itself in just a few years. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2018 21:35:49 GMT -5
Things getting weirder. Possible reset attempt, but not sure.
Wife claims that she's relieved I mentioned divorce, the pressure is off, we can now talk honestly with each other. And we really are; much better discussions than before and while we sometimes fall into older patterns, it has definitely been better.
She also claims that she is happy I outsourced - not happy about the deception but that I found a way to get rid of the pain I was in.
But she is also saying that she is now horny - and looking forward to being able to have sex with the next guy.
Right now I see that hugs and kisses for her are making her happy, and I have no problem with that.They certainly defuse some of the old argument patterns. But when she says "why didn't you do this before" I get a bit pissed off, since of course I tried and was rejected.
So whether this is a major mindfuck to want to get me back, or legitimately a change in her as a result of new circumstances, I don't know. (She also claims her latest medical procedure has made her feel much better, hence her new interest in sex. Not officially with me, because she is worried I caught something from my outsourcing.)
I still cannot see me staying. But it has been a roller coaster week.
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Post by baza on Jul 14, 2018 22:32:01 GMT -5
What leaps out at me is the 4th last line....where (in respect to what your missus' is up to) you say - "I don't know".
It would appear that she has managed to get your focus off your plan, and back onto her and her possible motivations.
Thing is, that if you have a solid plan, and if you have the resolve to carry it through, then it is largely irrelevant what your missus does or does not do. Or what she says or does not say. Under these circumstances it doesn't matter a rats arse whether you "know" what she's up to or you don't.
Just as long as YOU know what YOU are up to.
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Post by northstarmom on Jul 14, 2018 22:46:27 GMT -5
"
Right now I see that hugs and kisses for her are making her happy, and I have no problem with that.They certainly defuse some of the old argument patterns. But when she says "why didn't you do this before" I get a bit pissed off, since of course I tried and was rejected.
So whether this is a major mindfuck to want to get me back, or legitimately a change in her as a result of new circumstances, I don't know. (She also claims her latest medical procedure has made her feel much better, hence her new interest in sex. Not officially with me, because she is worried I caught something from my outsourcing.)"
Given the years you've been enduring a crap sex life with her, it's highly unlikely that your wife has developed permanent sexual passion for you after hearing you want a divorce and have outsourced. It's highly likely that she is trying to deflect you from proceeding with the divorce now. She's also trying to gaslight you so that you think that you've been the refuser. Her behavior may be due to her wanting you around for her surgery. It may be due to her having a financial interest in delaying the divorce. You may never know the cause and chasing it is a waste of time. You need to spend your time figuring out what you want and also figuring out how to get a fair divorce. After all, even if you don't want to divorce, your wife's plans may include that. This is not the time to focus on what makes your wife happy. It's the time to figure out what you want out of your life. If it's hard for you to figure this out, individual therapy can help.
Consequently, it would be very wise for you to ASAP talk to a lawyer and make sure you are prepared for divorce and also are informed of the financial consquences of having a quick divorce before the year ends or waiting until the new tax kicks in. Talk to a lawyer so you can figure out the divorce timetable that works best for you. As I've said before, divorcing your wife won't prevent your being a support to her during her surgery.
If you are divorcing it would be best if you moved out of the bedroom and started treating your wife like she's your roommate, not your helpmate or best friend. This isn't the time to be hugging and kissing her. She had plenty of time before to enjoy such pleasures with you but she rejected them -- for years. What's going on now is just a distraction very likely because she has consulted a lawyer and knows it's to her advantage to delay the divorce. She also may wish to keep you from outsourcing because she's wise enough to know that if you find a compatible woman, that could cause you to speed the divorce.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2018 22:54:31 GMT -5
What leaps out at me is the 4th last line....where (in respect to what your missus' is up to) you say - "I don't know". It would appear that she has managed to get your focus off your plan, and back onto her and her possible motivations. Thing is, that if you have a solid plan, and if you have the resolve to carry it through, then it is largely irrelevant what your missus does or does not do. Or what she says or does not say. Under these circumstances it doesn't matter a rats arse whether you "know" what she's up to or you don't. Just as long as YOU know what YOU are up to. You are right. But because I did bring up the D word before I was ready, I don't have a specific enough plan, beyond "I'm happy to wait six months or so for her to do what she needs medically but I won't wait beyond that to start the legal process." And given a choice of six months of relative calm and six months of hell, I'm OK with the calm. At the moment we both agree that we will split things up as best we can ourselves and then go to mediation on what we cannot agree on. The timeframe on selling the house - or if she wants to buy me out - is not set yet because I do want to cooperate and not start a war yet, and she is still processing what has happened and thinking of her options. I fully understand that my fear of an all out war is very possibly a manipulation by her. On the other hand, she does seem genuinely fearful of my own anger when she pushes my buttons and very conciliatory when that happens. She is also offering a Jewish divorce early, before the civil divorce, sort of a down payment to show that she is not trying to torpedo the process - and also which would effectively make this an open marriage, since in our own eyes we would not be married but we would still be in the same house (She wouldn't want anyone to know about this, which I understand. No evidence any rabbi would do this.) Five long days until my next therapy appointment  It is indeed tough to keep my head on straight while this is all happening. |
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Post by ironhamster on Jul 14, 2018 23:00:23 GMT -5
Her response is 180 degrees out of phase with what I experienced. I told my wife December 9th of last year, and after that we never even touched each other passing in the halls. She never had any interest in having sex with me, and the suggestion that she would develop a healthy sex life with a man she was actually attracted to was met with an eye roll.
While I don't expect everyone to have the same reasons or responses, I find it odd that she would be happy to accept a PDA level of intimacy given what she now knows, that her past efforts had fallen so short for so long that you found what you needed elsewhere. Perhaps her stated interest in a future flame is to invoke jealousy, as if that were possible.
Yes, indeed, this screams "reset attempt" to me.
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Post by baza on Jul 14, 2018 23:13:43 GMT -5
It now reads like Mrs @shynjdude has a better - and more do-able - plan that you do Brother.
If that's right then you have lost the initiative, and you're playing catch up.
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Post by northstarmom on Jul 14, 2018 23:15:37 GMT -5
" fully understand that my fear of an all out war is very possibly a manipulation by her. On the other hand, she does seem genuinely fearful of my own anger when she pushes my buttons and very conciliatory when that happens. She is also offering a Jewish divorce early, before the civil divorce, sort of a down payment to show that she is not trying to torpedo the process - and also which would effectively make this an open marriage, since in our own eyes we would not be married but we would still be in the same house (She wouldn't want anyone to know about this, which I understand. No evidence any rabbi would do this.) "
She is gaslighting you by offering you something that she knows damned well isn't going to happen.
I agree with Ironhamster that she's attempting a reset. Move out of the bedroom. Start acting like you are going to divorce. "Acting" like you are going to divorce doesn't mean you have to be nasty or vindictive. Just treat her like a roommate whom you're on polite terms with. You wouldn't share a bedroom with such a roommate. You wouldn't hug and kiss them or share your innermost thoughts. You'd be pleasant and polite.
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Post by saarinista on Jul 15, 2018 0:17:30 GMT -5
@shynjdude look, you've had all of this financial security for years. did it make ya happy? nope. because it never could. stop worrying so much about money. it's only going to keep you stuck. You are going to come out of the divorce with a bit less money. But the money you have now isn't making you happy, so I'd say it's not that important. Divorce is not a money saving option. It's a way to get away from another person so you can have a happy life.... . Move forward. It's the only sensible alternative. Divorce is not a money saving option? Totally true...at least at first. Depending on your ex, it could pay for itself in just a few years. that's very true too, shamwow. My point was just that in the short run, a divorce involves expenses, but the happiness payback is huge in the medium and long run assuming you've thought things out. You might even up with more money down the line if your spouse is a spendthrift. Either way, happiness is key. |
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Post by saarinista on Jul 15, 2018 0:20:19 GMT -5
Things getting weirder. Possible reset attempt, but not sure. Wife claims that she's relieved I mentioned divorce, the pressure is off, we can now talk honestly with each other. And we really are; much better discussions than before and while we sometimes fall into older patterns, it has definitely been better. She also claims that she is happy I outsourced - not happy about the deception but that I found a way to get rid of the pain I was in. But she is also saying that she is now horny - and looking forward to being able to have sex with the next guy. Right now I see that hugs and kisses for her are making her happy, and I have no problem with that.They certainly defuse some of the old argument patterns. But when she says "why didn't you do this before" I get a bit pissed off, since of course I tried and was rejected. So whether this is a major mindfuck to want to get me back, or legitimately a change in her as a result of new circumstances, I don't know. (She also claims her latest medical procedure has made her feel much better, hence her new interest in sex. Not officially with me, because she is worried I caught something from my outsourcing.) I still cannot see me staying. But it has been a roller coaster week. All this sounds very fishy to me. I smell BS. |
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Post by northstarmom on Jul 15, 2018 1:13:30 GMT -5
"So whether this is a major mindfuck to want to get me back, or legitimately a change in her as a result of new circumstances, I don't know. (She also claims her latest medical procedure has made her feel much better, hence her new interest in sex. Not officially with me, because she is worried I caught something from my outsourcing.)" She is gaslighting you. Signs of gaslighting: "They know confusion weakens people. Gaslighters know that people like having a sense of stability and normalcy. Their goal is to uproot this and make you constantly question everything. And humans' natural tendency is to look to the person or entity that will help you feel more stable—and that happens to be the gaslighter. " You are confused because she is acting in a confusing way. "Their actions do not match their words. When dealing with a person or entity that gaslights, look at what they are doing rather than what they are saying. What they are saying means nothing; it is just talk. What they are doing is the issue. " Example of this: She now says she has a sex drive and would fuck you except that she knows you outsourced. Look at her actions: She hasn't fucked you for years and now she's giving another excuse why she won't. www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/here-there-and-everywhere/201701/11-warning-signs-gaslighting |
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Post by beachguy on Jul 15, 2018 1:49:27 GMT -5
The amount of mindfuckery you are getting borders on evil.
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It is indeed tough to keep my head on straight while this is all happening. 
