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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:00:04 GMT -5
beachguy - so do you think SMs begin with a commitment problem? He said he looked at rings for me SO quickly after we started dating because he just "knew" I was the right one. That hadn't been the case before. He didn't drag his feet, act scared, etc. so I'm curious..
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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:01:59 GMT -5
beachguy - being gay is a good reason because it gives me an out that's not debatable. I didn't sign up to be married to a gay man, so that's an obvious out that would be acceptable to family, friends, etc., and not just look like a cop out. I don't plan to tell a lot of people that we had a SM - that's just embarrassing for everyone.
If he came out and still wanted to be married, I would think he would understand that that wasn't feasible for me. If it wasn't and we split and he couldn't be friends, that would be okay. Because he's off living his life and I know that there's no way it could've worked because he was gay.
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Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 19:04:01 GMT -5
It would change everything because it wouldn't be my "fault" that things ended, nor could he put it on me. Also, it would give a truly real explanation as to why this happened. Tell me something... what's the difference between a gay guy and a guy that absolutely refuses to ever fuck his wife? Where in the marriage vows does it say it's ok to leave if he's gay, but not if he's just asexual or otherwise unwilling to "love and cherish" you sexually? I mean, if there isn't a specific vow to fuck your spouse regularly (and in our culture apparently there isn't) then why is gayness an out  |
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Post by greatcoastal on Dec 1, 2016 19:05:54 GMT -5
Plus, he's made it clear that he has no interest or ability in being friends if we split. He said it would be too hard and he'd have too many feelings for me. Yea...and I've got some Ocean front property for sale in Colorado! He hasn't heard or acted on a word you have said. None of it has been to hard, and he has no feelings for you. He is too self absorbed, and everything remains quiet comfy for him. You need to turn his world upside down. Call some old friends and start staying out late, take some new classes, google meetup.com join a group or too, be your true self. You have been giving for far to long. It's time for taking, standing up for yourself, using his own logic on him. Your emotions mean nothing to him. It's going to take actions. Emotionally and physically de-tach yourself from him. And see if he starts demanding, by complaining, begging that you do things his way. You need a new tone, a new motto: "That is not my problem". "that is not my concern". Getting legal council will give you the strength to know you can act on it when you are ready. After 24 yrs of marriage ,6 kids, 18 yrs of being a stay at home dad, homeschooler, adopting 3 of our children, 9 yrs of taking care of my FIL, finally, tomorrow my mediation begins for divorce. I am taking ground, and finding my joy. You can too! |
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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:08:41 GMT -5
Good question, beachguy. I really don't know. I guess it makes sense in my head, but not in real life. It is the same thing, essentially. But again, everyone would be much more understanding if you left because he came out versus because he wouldn't have sex. How many people truly understand a SM unless they've had one? They would probably just think I was super into it or something or unreasonable!
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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:11:34 GMT -5
Yeah, I see what you're saying, greatcoastal. He doesn't act like someone who claims they would feel that way if I left. And yes, at the end of the day, it is comfy for him, or HE would be the one bringing this up every month or so, not ALWAYS me. It has NEVER been him and that really annoys me. He has never found a counselor/program or done any of the work besides "trying," which has amounted to very little. I've been emotionally detaching a bit and I will be out of town next week, so I'm looking forward to that little physical separation. I hate that I will still miss him though. He won't be complaining or begging - he's very passive. He will think it's great that I'm out doing my own thing. Ugh.. I'm really glad you're finding your joy and taking your life back! I'm really happy for you.  |
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Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 19:20:02 GMT -5
Good question, beachguy. I really don't know. I guess it makes sense in my head, but not in real life. It is the same thing, essentially. But again, everyone would be much more understanding if you left because he came out versus because he wouldn't have sex. How many people truly understand a SM unless they've had one? They would probably just think I was super into it or something or unreasonable! Now we're making progress. Your decision to stay or leave comes down to how you justify your decision to family and friends. |
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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:22:52 GMT -5
Good question, beachguy. I really don't know. I guess it makes sense in my head, but not in real life. It is the same thing, essentially. But again, everyone would be much more understanding if you left because he came out versus because he wouldn't have sex. How many people truly understand a SM unless they've had one? They would probably just think I was super into it or something or unreasonable! Now we're making progress. Your decision to stay or leave comes down to how you justify your decision to family and friends. It has something to do with it. I would never want to make him look bad, nor would I want to look like I just gave in and didn't even try. Because I'm sure no one thinks we have any issues. That, and the baggage that comes along with being a divorced person. |
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Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 19:37:54 GMT -5
Your H is either (according to labels we are instructed to use)...
Gay
Asexual
Intimacy Averse
Otherwise very sexually fucked up
You previously suggested he is just too passive to ask you for sex, and you want to be chased, or at least not begging for it. If he is too passive, trust me on this, he is either gay (not into you or your sex) or asexual. Or intimacy averse is fashionable now for an excuse. If he had a heterosexual sex drive, he would not be passive about it. Like other things he tells you, this is all unmitigated BS to maintain his cover.
I gave you 4 options. Pick one. None of the other 3 is any better than his being gay, except maybe gayness sounds a little better when you try to explain all this to family and friends.
Personally I'm not convinced there are always or even usually clear lines between some or all of those 4 options. But that is a personal opinion, having studied my gay/asexual/intimacy averse/sexually fucked up spouse for so many years before I finally left.
Something to ask yourself: you've told your H that the marriage is in dire jeopardy over sex. He's willing to do nothing, not even to (gasp!) fuck you. All he's willing to do is gaslight you over the idea it's all really your fault, not his.
All he has to do is fuck you good (or at least he could have gotten away with that in the early years). But he didn't. He let the marriage collapse. This is not some minor problem or misunderstanding. He has some sort of severe aversion to you, or females in general, or sex in general. Enough of an aversion to put his marriage in jeopardy. The reason why doesn't really matter. What matters is that he has that severe aversion. And of course, that you are living an enforced celibate life.
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Post by greatcoastal on Dec 1, 2016 19:38:41 GMT -5
I've been emotionally detaching a bit and I will be out of town next week, so I'm looking forward to that little physical separation. I hate that I will still miss him though. He won't be complaining or begging - he's very passive. He will think it's great that I'm out doing my own thing. Ugh.. I'm really glad you're finding your joy and taking your life back! I'm really happy for you. 1) I am looking forward to that separation. What does that tell you? 2) I hate that I will still miss him though. Do you miss the fake image of your husband, or the true person who only thinks about himself? 3) Sure he doesn't mind that you are out doing yur own thing. His needs are still being met 100%. He doesn't have to do anything. He's content without you, he doesn't love you, he loves having you around. Explain that part. Make a list of all that you do, that he has never done, won't do or hasn't done in years. Your liable to find out that roommates do more for each other. 4) Your giving, caring and concern for a complete stranger like me is highly saught after, a noble trait of your strong, giving, caring personality. You deserve to be respected, saught after, cherished, and valued as a lady. YOU DESERVE THAT!!! |
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Post by unmatched on Dec 1, 2016 19:40:51 GMT -5
The most useful thing I ever learned on here was that you have to stop listening to what your partner says and start looking at what they actually do. That will tell you everything about what they really want. In your case, your husband is saying that he wants to have a sex life again, it just feels too awkward. If that is true, you should be able to turn this around in a month. Just start initiating again, be prepared to be rejected a lot, and within 4 weeks you will know whether or not you have a relationship you actually want to be in. If you can't turn it around in 4 weeks, then it is not going to happen and you really need to move on before the two of you get any older and DEFINITELY before you have any kids. So make sure your birth control is up to date If you have any doubts at all about whether you should stay in a SM, read as much as you can on here. It doesn't get any better, and after another 5 years or 10 years or 20 years you won't know who you are anymore. It isn't worth it. |
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Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 19:41:02 GMT -5
Interesting and probably true, beachguy. I have a hard time seeing the gay thing, but it's never impossible. Stranger things have happened..
What if how I've behaved has contributed to this? I'm not trying to take ALL the blame here, but I haven't acted wonderfully once this started, and it got worse over time. I've been so angry in the past and probably said stuff I shouldn't have. I hardly believed myself sometimes. Can't that turn off sexual desire/expression for someone? Again, I refuse to take all the blame, but isn't it a possibility?
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Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 19:47:14 GMT -5
Now we're making progress. Your decision to stay or leave comes down to how you justify your decision to family and friends. It has something to do with it. I would never want to make him look bad, nor would I want to look like I just gave in and didn't even try. Because I'm sure no one thinks we have any issues. That, and the baggage that comes along with being a divorced person. If I were you, when you do finally talk divorce with him, I would propose a non-negotiable deal: We can either maintain a "we drifted apart" approach to family and friends, and keep this between the two of us or... If you insist on blaming me for the divorce I'm free to discuss our sexlessness with any and all. He will, eventually, break Plan A. Probably sooner than later. But then you are free to discuss, guilt free, all the sordid details of his sexlessness. You may think it's embarrassing to talk about your sex life and his failures. If he is inwardly gay, it may be far more embarrassing for him to ever admit that. That's why you just read a story here about a guy that stayed in the closet for over 20 years until apparently the pressures on keeping his secret were too great. I'm sure some guys keep that dark secret all their lives. Some people are comfortable coming out gay. Some aren't. I hope you don't sacrifice your life solely to keep his secrets. You weren't put here on Earth to do that. You're an intelligent and vivacious woman. You deserve so much more than that. |
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Post by DryCreek on Dec 1, 2016 19:49:14 GMT -5
Good question, beachguy. I really don't know. I guess it makes sense in my head, but not in real life. It is the same thing, essentially. But again, everyone would be much more understanding if you left because he came out versus because he wouldn't have sex. How many people truly understand a SM unless they've had one? They would probably just think I was super into it or something or unreasonable! I had to force myself to read the whole thread before replying because my thinking went exactly the same place as beachguy. He's gay: it's not your fault, nothing can be done, and you can be at peace with leaving - even if you never share the 'why' with anyone. I.e., it doesn't change any of the facts, just your willingness to accept them. He's not gay: the facts are no different. He's not sexually interested in women; specifically, his wife. Whether he does or doesn't want sex with anyone else is irrelevant. On the basis of your efforts and the vast experiences of this group, those facts aren't changing. The only missing piece is choosing to be at peace with the decision. After 25 years, I can tell you that leaving only gets harder. So does staying. 20 years from now, will this episode be a distant memory, or will you still be coping? |
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Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 19:56:32 GMT -5
Interesting and probably true, beachguy. I have a hard time seeing the gay thing, but it's never impossible. Stranger things have happened.. What if how I've behaved has contributed to this? I'm not trying to take ALL the blame here, but I haven't acted wonderfully once this started, and it got worse over time. I've been so angry in the past and probably said stuff I shouldn't have. I hardly believed myself sometimes. Can't that turn off sexual desire/expression for someone? Again, I refuse to take all the blame, but isn't it a possibility? You just put yourself in an endless loop: He refused you You got angry because your lover won't fuck you He won't fuck you because you're always pissed at him Guess, what, you aren't the first one to get manipulated into that. Like me. Yea, big time. It's all part of his deflecting the problem. The problem started when he stopped fucking you. He stopped fucking you when he put the first ring on your finger. Your relationship started dying right then and there. It just took you 6-8 years to get your head out of the fog. Welcome to the club. I went through that, and many or most others here too. If you insist on blaming yourself... even if you are such a bitch that he would never consider fucking you again, does that change anything? You are still celibate and miserable, and getting more miserable by the day. And you have 50 years or so to deal with this, unless you bail before you die. |
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