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Post by unmatched on Nov 2, 2016 19:22:46 GMT -5
The result is that now we go about 8 weeks with no sexual contact, and then she will suddenly out of the blue develop an interest in having sex, and seem to be totally into it while we are in the act. However, as soon as it is over, she reverts to no interest at all in doing anything further. This cycle has been repeating itself for three years now with celestial regularity. This is so familiar (apart from the regularity, for us it just seemed to come out of the blue every so often). I still can't get my head around it. |
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Post by unmatched on Nov 2, 2016 19:29:39 GMT -5
Speaking to the "changing things" part, she also said she simultaneously feels the need to demonstrate to me that these changes are going to be permanent- and resents me for feeling like she has to do that. It kind of reminds me of someone going on a diet. You get inspired and enthusiastic, and you can see all the benefits for your life and your health, and everything feels great. And that is all fine as long as it is temporary. But the idea of having to make an ongoing change that will last for the rest of your life is just too big and scary. Maybe that is because you need to take an AA approach - one day at a time - while you wait for your mindset to change. Or maybe it is because you are doing something you know you don't really want and is not sustainable for you, and you need to have the option to fall back into your comfort eating again. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Nov 2, 2016 19:42:07 GMT -5
Speaking to the "changing things" part, she also said she simultaneously feels the need to demonstrate to me that these changes are going to be permanent- and resents me for feeling like she has to do that. It kind of reminds me of someone going on a diet. You get inspired and enthusiastic, and you can see all the benefits for your life and your health, and everything feels great. And that is all fine as long as it is temporary. But the idea of having to make an ongoing change that will last for the rest of your life is just too big and scary. Maybe that is because you need to take an AA approach - one day at a time - while you wait for your mindset to change. Or maybe it is because you are doing something you know you don't really want and is not sustainable for you, and you need to have the option to fall back into your comfort eating again. Or is it the fear of intimacy. Something from her past, or just a low sense of self worth? All her problems to face and be willing to admit to. Then comes the change part, that a willing, very patient, qualified partner with the help of a qualified therapist could help. Not a very rosy outlook for anyone to want to make a future with? Especially after going through the mental abuse of a SM. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2016 20:25:33 GMT -5
Oh wow!! She's trying to hang on. I would not commit to anything until you figure out what you want for yourself. Absolutely. We only bought the new car the other weekend because my old one was literally falling apart, and the loan and title are completely in my name. That car is probably joint property though. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2016 20:36:06 GMT -5
cagedtiger - where are you now in the original 3-months of counseling timeline? Does this align with the new year's wedding? (or - the wedding stretches it "a little"?) If you start giving ground on the original "I will try 3 months" you really need to hold yourself accountable for it. Stretching it SOME is not a problem and could be very reasonable. Not acknowledging that would be a self-betrayal though. Do not get her pregnant! I support a half-cynical, half-charitable view. It's a mix, I believe - - that most refusers who do play games do not have the self-knowledge to even know they are doing it (it's instinctual in my opinion). You will never be able to please a person who does not know what they actually want (hover vs. abandon - no matter WHAT approach you take, she will be coming up with some new negative word to categorize your poor treatment of her as the reason she "can't" be physically intimate with you) I hope you will review some of your own promises to yourself in your previous posts and check the timeline on those. If you extend it, do it consciously - maybe even explain to her: earlier this year, I told myself we'd give it to the end of October - I am willing to hang with you through the wedding because I see you trying so hard. If we can't resolve to mutual satisfaction by January, we will need to make other plans for our separate futures. That may be too harsh to share with her - - but YOU should understand it for yourself if that is how the deal is at this point. Good luck, man. Taking into account missed weeks for counseling, the three months does actually coincide with the beginning of the year. I'm OK with giving things another 4-6 weeks of wiggle room based on if anything major happens in couples counseling, but that's funny to be contingent on what happens in the next few weeks. She also told me last night that she feels like she's been putting herself fully out there emotionally, and that I haven't been reciprocating, and that she can feel herself starting to shut down again as a result of that. Speaking to the "changing things" part, she also said she simultaneously feels the need to demonstrate to me that these changes are going to be permanent- and resents me for feeling like she has to do that. Man maybe I'm oversimplifying things but the convoluted, incomprehensible things she says and the way she has you guessing all the time, this is all mind games. You're getting absolutely nothing out of this three months except confusion and frustration. I hope you don't let that few weeks of wiggle room turn into a few months, into a few years... |
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Post by baza on Nov 2, 2016 21:23:20 GMT -5
Yep.
"If" one wants to know how seriously one is taking the resolution of an ILIASM shithole, then here's a checklist. . .
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Does one have the appropriate legal advice for the jurisdiction ?
Does one have an exit strategy (based on the legal advice) in do-able shape ?
Does one have ones support network shored up and ready to help one through the exit strategy - if that proves necessary ?
Does one have all appropriate research and plan to help the kids (if any) transition through such an event - if that proves necessary ?
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If one has not got these things stitched up, NOW, one is kidding oneself about being ready to drive the ILIASM shithole to resolution THEN.
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Without these things, one is NOT ready.
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And, there is nothing wrong with not being ready. It is a perfectly legitimate choice to be unprepared (it might not be the smartest choice in the world, but it IS a legitimate choice)
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The down side to this is, that the deadline arrives, the time to enact ones exit strategy arrives, and one does not actually have one.
Backwards by some distance one goes, with ones cred shred.
And still, with it all to do. . . this time starting from a worse position.
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Post by csl on Nov 2, 2016 21:24:02 GMT -5
I had a similar conversation with my wife. She asked why we weren't more sexual. I told her flat out that with everything I had been through with her, I had lost my desire. I mentioned the weekend at the bed and breakfast, which was supposed to be a romantic but she refused. I told her that it was on her to win me back and let me know I was wanted. If she wanted sex, she would have to ask. I had already asked enough and got shot down. I wasn't going to be the initiator, Just because I'm nosy; how long ago was that? |
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Post by DryCreek on Nov 2, 2016 21:40:08 GMT -5
cagedtiger, a couple late thoughts on your original post... First, "We should have sex every day for 30 days... but starting tomorrow, not tonight." WTF? Clearly a structured program and not emotionally motivated. Second, she may be coming from a place of "I know I should enjoy sex, and I know he wants more intimacy. Maybe if I 'fake it till I make it' I might regain some desire." A very doubtful, but optimistic spin. It might have been interesting to see just how far she would take it - propose all the things you've wanted to do that she's refused. I agree with your sentiment that she was just trawling for info. Seriously, adoption? Is she completely disconnected from reality? She really seems to be in denial.
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Post by cagedtiger on Nov 2, 2016 21:58:57 GMT -5
It kind of reminds me of someone going on a diet. You get inspired and enthusiastic, and you can see all the benefits for your life and your health, and everything feels great. And that is all fine as long as it is temporary. But the idea of having to make an ongoing change that will last for the rest of your life is just too big and scary. Maybe that is because you need to take an AA approach - one day at a time - while you wait for your mindset to change. Or maybe it is because you are doing something you know you don't really want and is not sustainable for you, and you need to have the option to fall back into your comfort eating again. Or is it the fear of intimacy. Something from her past, or just a low sense of self worth? All her problems to face and be willing to admit to. Then comes the change part, that a willing, very patient, qualified partner with the help of a qualified therapist could help. Not a very rosy outlook for anyone to want to make a future with? Especially after going through the mental abuse of a SM. I'm still waiting for the "face and be willing to admit to" part. She said she's going to start going to therapy again, but with the therapist she was seeing before (the overly expensive, out of network one in the next county over who told me that I was missing sex in our relationship because I'm a man, and "it's a man and woman thing." I expressed to her my concerns about going back to her and why, and she acknowledged them, but said she was still planning on going back to her. That was two weeks ago. No further comment about when she's planning on starting back. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2016 22:08:45 GMT -5
Or is it the fear of intimacy. Something from her past, or just a low sense of self worth? All her problems to face and be willing to admit to. Then comes the change part, that a willing, very patient, qualified partner with the help of a qualified therapist could help. Not a very rosy outlook for anyone to want to make a future with? Especially after going through the mental abuse of a SM. I'm still waiting for the "face and be willing to admit to" part. She said she's going to start going to therapy again, but with the therapist she was seeing before (the overly expensive, out of network one in the next county over who told me that I was missing sex in our relationship because I'm a man, and "it's a man and woman thing." I expressed to her my concerns about going back to her and why, and she acknowledged them, but said she was still planning on going back to her. That was two weeks ago. No further comment about when she's planning on starting back. That's not surprising she is going back to that therapist. The therapist is clueless about sexless marriages so will not challenge her on it. They will instead work to come up with solutions to your sexual preoccupation. These solutions will probably not include, oh, you know, like for example having sex. |
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Post by obobfla on Nov 2, 2016 23:14:23 GMT -5
I had a similar conversation with my wife. She asked why we weren't more sexual. I told her flat out that with everything I had been through with her, I had lost my desire. I mentioned the weekend at the bed and breakfast, which was supposed to be a romantic but she refused. I told her that it was on her to win me back and let me know I was wanted. If she wanted sex, she would have to ask. I had already asked enough and got shot down. I wasn't going to be the initiator, Just because I'm nosy; how long ago was that? The talk was six months ago. The weekend was for our anniversary three years ago. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2016 23:25:19 GMT -5
Cagedtiger,
That would piss me off about only being interested when she's had something to drink. Your wife is not even trying to make things better.
Your wife wants you to spend money on the house. You should be saving money for when you leave. It sounds like she wants you indebted and trapped with her.
Maybe you should stop the hand holding and hugging. She's getting her needs met for affection and ignoring you. It's your right to have sex and it's an important need for many people. Do not let anyone tell you otherwise. I understand now why you do not want to engage your wife. It sounds like the marriage is already dead. You're still young and have a whole life ahead of you. She's only going to suck the life out of you. You need to recognize why you married a woman like her. If you do not understand this, you may marry a similar woman and find yourself in the same situation
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Post by GeekGoddess on Nov 3, 2016 6:03:58 GMT -5
Taking into account missed weeks for counseling, the three months does actually coincide with the beginning of the year. I'm OK with giving things another 4-6 weeks of wiggle room based on if anything major happens in couples counseling, but that's funny to be contingent on what happens in the next few weeks. She also told me last night that she feels like she's been putting herself fully out there emotionally, and that I haven't been reciprocating, and that she can feel herself starting to shut down again as a result of that. Speaking to the "changing things" part, she also said she simultaneously feels the need to demonstrate to me that these changes are going to be permanent- and resents me for feeling like she has to do that. Wow!! She resents that her husband wants her to be loving, intimate, fun, affectionate. Sounds like basic incompatibility to me. Nothing against her but she's probably not capable of a deeper level of intimacy and connection. Sometimes if you really love someone you have to let them go. THIS is so honest though! I would be tempted to let her know that is how her actions made me feel that within the first year I started resenting (my EX - this is accurate) but I never had the courage to tell him so back then - because I thought I was the one being "over sensitive" and just a big baby - but that is what vulnerability is, taking the risk with the person I love to be totally honest. NOW I know this. It's still hard to practice it though. But at least this confession of resenting seems totally honest. It's just that - -- "yeah, see how I feel these past 2 years?" doesn't seem appropriate to SAY....and yet I sort of relished the times in my exit plan when I knew he was FINALLY getting a taste of what bitter cold feels like from a spouse. That may be a little mean - but I am just being honest. |
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Post by cagedtiger on Nov 3, 2016 8:45:13 GMT -5
Wow!! She resents that her husband wants her to be loving, intimate, fun, affectionate. Sounds like basic incompatibility to me. Nothing against her but she's probably not capable of a deeper level of intimacy and connection. Sometimes if you really love someone you have to let them go. THIS is so honest though! I would be tempted to let her know that is how her actions made me feel that within the first year I started resenting (my EX - this is accurate) but I never had the courage to tell him so back then - because I thought I was the one being "over sensitive" and just a big baby - but that is what vulnerability is, taking the risk with the person I love to be totally honest. NOW I know this. It's still hard to practice it though. But at least this confession of resenting seems totally honest. It's just that - -- "yeah, see how I feel these past 2 years?" doesn't seem appropriate to SAY....and yet I sort of relished the times in my exit plan when I knew he was FINALLY getting a taste of what bitter cold feels like from a spouse. That may be a little mean - but I am just being honest. Or, as she puts it, "I feel like you're punishing me by putting me through what you've been feeling the last two years." Which isn't even a little bit intentional on my part- she has repeatedly told me she knows that. But she's repeatedly brought up the feeling like she's being punished bit over the last 3 months. |
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Post by beachguy on Nov 3, 2016 9:04:22 GMT -5
The result is that now we go about 8 weeks with no sexual contact, and then she will suddenly out of the blue develop an interest in having sex, and seem to be totally into it while we are in the act. However, as soon as it is over, she reverts to no interest at all in doing anything further. This cycle has been repeating itself for three years now with celestial regularity. This is so familiar (apart from the regularity, for us it just seemed to come out of the blue every so often). I still can't get my head around it. Gas lighting |
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