pinkskies
Junior Member
Posts: 38 
Age Range: 36-40
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Post by pinkskies on Oct 4, 2016 14:02:04 GMT -5
So me and the refuser were supposed to go to counseling for the last 3 weeks and 2 of those 3 weeks there was an excuse on his part as to why he couldn't go. I basically see this as another sign that nothing is going to change on his part. Last week Friday I finally had the "talk" with him and explained that I want a separation. Of course he broke down crying apologizing and asking for another chance. As sure as I am about my decision, I am incredibly sad and hurt. It feels like I failed at keeping the marriage together - even though I know he had a role to play too. I hate seeing him so sad and crying and the impact a separation will have on my kids is even worse to think about. I know I can't stay with him because I refuse to live a celibate life yet it seems so hard to leave. I wish there was an "easy button" ;/
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 14:15:21 GMT -5
I'm so sorry.
It's awful when you try to improve things...then they don't do their share....then you call them on that....and they want another chance.
I'm remembering the different things I tried with my refuser ("bacon scented candles") and also, my attempts to get him to take care of his health issues (that he said were the reason for the SM.) We/he would start something, but it NEVER got followed through, he NEVER stuck to any of the things that were supposed to help.
I wanted him - wanted us - back the way he used to be. Judging by his actions, he wanted to be his new self (sick, depressed, unresponsive to me.)
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Post by baza on Oct 4, 2016 19:25:11 GMT -5
Keeping an ILIASM shithole together is equivalent to trying to nail jello to the wall.
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Won't work, and even if it did, what would be the point ?
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Presumably you have your legal advice and all Sister pinkskies.
Feeling for you at this time.
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Unfortunately in these ILIASM deals, it is not only YOU who had to do all the heavy lifting in trying to keep the marriage afloat, but it is going to fall squarely on YOU alone to do the heavy lifting that getting out involves.
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It can be done.
And YOU can do it.
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Post by csl on Oct 4, 2016 21:05:44 GMT -5
I know that there is a lot of condemnation for ISIASM sh*tholes, "goodbye and good riddance," but the fact is that these CAN be turned around. I know of three marriages of 25, 26 and 28 years ILIASM that changed because of this tactic, separation. In each of the three, the refuser dictated, and I mean DICTATED, a plan of action that had to be followed, or the ripcord would be irrevocably pulled. In all three cases, refusers gulped hard, but agreed to terms.
That said, I also know of a marriage or two in which the Celibate chose celibacy over marriage. But that doesn't negate the fact that ILIASMs can be turned around.
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Post by unmatched on Oct 4, 2016 21:23:27 GMT -5
I know that there is a lot of condemnation for ISIASM sh*tholes, "goodbye and good riddance," but the fact is that these CAN be turned around. I know of three marriages of 25, 26 and 28 years ILIASM that changed because of this tactic, separation. In each of the three, the refuser dictated, and I mean DICTATED, a plan of action that had to be followed, or the ripcord would be irrevocably pulled. In all three cases, refusers gulped hard, but agreed to terms. That said, I also know of a marriage or two in which the Celibate chose celibacy over marriage. But that doesn't negate the fact that ILIASMs can be turned around. Can you describe them in more detail? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 21:35:02 GMT -5
So me and the refuser were supposed to go to counseling for the last 3 weeks and 2 of those 3 weeks there was an excuse on his part as to why he couldn't go. I basically see this as another sign that nothing is going to change on his part. Last week Friday I finally had the "talk" with him and explained that I want a separation. Of course he broke down crying apologizing and asking for another chance. As sure as I am about my decision, I am incredibly sad and hurt. It feels like I failed at keeping the marriage together - even though I know he had a role to play too. I hate seeing him so sad and crying and the impact a separation will have on my kids is even worse to think about. I know I can't stay with him because I refuse to live a celibate life yet it seems so hard to leave. I wish there was an "easy button" ;/ Crocodile tears. |
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Post by baza on Oct 4, 2016 21:47:45 GMT -5
In the EP ILIASM group, which went for 8+ years and had 50,000 members, there were about 6 instances where an ILIASM shithole did a 180.
"ModLulu", "hl42", "Apochryapha", "TimeforLiving2" (still a member here), and a couple of others who's names escape me at this moment.
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Brother csl's point that a 180 is possible is a valid point. There IS evidence of this.
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But the math suggests it is a real long shot. 6 in 50,000 or about 1 in 8,000+.
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There was no evidence in the old EP group that "these CAN be turned around" (quoting Brother csl here) in any substantial numbers.
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The stories in the old EP group, and here, are very much the arse end of the dysfunctional marriage spectrum.
Those deals that would have been responsive to the scented candle / counselling strategies were resolved long before they ever got here.
Once you arrive here, the game is pretty much up.
If your deal was fixable, then it got fixed quite a while back, long before you ever googled 'sexless marriage' out of desperation.
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People do not google 'sexless marriage' at the first sign of trouble.
They google 'sexless marriage' as the last resort, having already tried everything else they can think of.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 22:47:28 GMT -5
I know that there is a lot of condemnation for ISIASM sh*tholes, "goodbye and good riddance," but the fact is that these CAN be turned around. I know of three marriages of 25, 26 and 28 years ILIASM that changed because of this tactic, separation. In each of the three, the refuser dictated, and I mean DICTATED, a plan of action that had to be followed, or the ripcord would be irrevocably pulled. In all three cases, refusers gulped hard, but agreed to terms. That said, I also know of a marriage or two in which the Celibate chose celibacy over marriage. But that doesn't negate the fact that ILIASMs can be turned around. Yes, if both partners are totally committed to change. I would be interested to know how long the turnarounds lasted. Did the refuser go back to refusing once the coast was clear? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 22:54:26 GMT -5
So me and the refuser were supposed to go to counseling for the last 3 weeks and 2 of those 3 weeks there was an excuse on his part as to why he couldn't go. I basically see this as another sign that nothing is going to change on his part. Last week Friday I finally had the "talk" with him and explained that I want a separation. Of course he broke down crying apologizing and asking for another chance. As sure as I am about my decision, I am incredibly sad and hurt. It feels like I failed at keeping the marriage together - even though I know he had a role to play too. I hate seeing him so sad and crying and the impact a separation will have on my kids is even worse to think about. I know I can't stay with him because I refuse to live a celibate life yet it seems so hard to leave. I wish there was an "easy button" ;/ OK Pink, you can push the "easy button" what would that look like? He would realize what he had and step up. He would turn into a sexual beast. He would divorce you but put you in a house and work to pay all your bills and turn up on saturday to be dad? I am just saying when everything is in a blender what do you really want? |
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Post by eternaloptimism on Oct 5, 2016 1:52:08 GMT -5
So me and the refuser were supposed to go to counseling for the last 3 weeks and 2 of those 3 weeks there was an excuse on his part as to why he couldn't go. I basically see this as another sign that nothing is going to change on his part. Last week Friday I finally had the "talk" with him and explained that I want a separation. Of course he broke down crying apologizing and asking for another chance. As sure as I am about my decision, I am incredibly sad and hurt. It feels like I failed at keeping the marriage together - even though I know he had a role to play too. I hate seeing him so sad and crying and the impact a separation will have on my kids is even worse to think about. I know I can't stay with him because I refuse to live a celibate life yet it seems so hard to leave. I wish there was an "easy button" ;/ Crocodile tears. Even crocodile tears are too difficult for us empaths to get past a lot of the time. Until we hit our limit and go off it!!! |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2016 6:13:11 GMT -5
Even crocodile tears are too difficult for us empaths to get past a lot of the time. Until we hit our limit and go off it!!! That's exactly why they do it. But falling for it isn't empathy. Empathy is feeling what others feel. The display of sadness is fake. They're feeling rage and a strong desire to control you. An empathetic reaction would send you running away screaming because feeling what he feels would terrify you. No, manipulators can make you think you love them. When in reality they are just controlling you by taking advantage of your kind nature. Well that kind nature has to go on vacation. |
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Post by bballgirl on Oct 5, 2016 7:21:54 GMT -5
Even crocodile tears are too difficult for us empaths to get past a lot of the time. Until we hit our limit and go off it!!! That's exactly why they do it. But falling for it isn't empathy. Empathy is feeling what others feel. The display of sadness is fake. They're feeling rage and a strong desire to control you. An empathetic reaction would send you running away screaming because feeling what he feels would terrify you. No, manipulators can make you think you love them. When in reality they are just controlling you by taking advantage of your kind nature. Well that kind nature has to go on vacation. Exactly! They count on that kindness to manipulate us! A year ago when I told my H that I wanted a divorce he begged me to go to counseling even though I asked him 3 times to go and he wouldn't in previous years. He threatened to quit his job thinking I would get scared and back down - I didn't even respond to the text. He came home crying, begging me not do this which turned into us both crying. By the end of the week he tried to reset me and that was the one time in our marriage I got to refuse him. I was focused on myself for once in my life about what I wanted- to be FREE! |
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Post by bballgirl on Oct 5, 2016 7:55:46 GMT -5
pinkskies It sounds like your "Talk" was very typical. Your H realized how serious you are and realized he has lost control and is now trying to do whatever he can to keep HIS life from being inconvenienced. I can see the value in just a separation to benefit both you and the marriage if you want to take a middle of the road approach and test what life on the other side is like. Talk to an attorney to see what options you have legally. Divorce is such a final thing and should not be taken lightly. I would advise you to date and enjoy your life free from marriage and explore your sexuality, take care of some bucket list items, date men. If your H is serious about trying to win you back he will make that effort - tell him during the separation he can fix himself and his issues, court you and try to win back your trust and affection. I suspect he will put forth zero effort. Refusers are usually takers not givers.
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pinkskies
Junior Member
Posts: 38
Age Range: 36-40
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Post by pinkskies on Oct 5, 2016 13:53:34 GMT -5
Thank you all so much for all of your feedback. I live in a state where you have to wait 1 year post separation to file for divorce. I'm going to take it one day at a time. I've given up hope that he's going to change. I just need to stay strong through all of this.
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Post by csl on Oct 5, 2016 23:14:24 GMT -5
I know that there is a lot of condemnation for ISIASM sh*tholes, "goodbye and good riddance," but the fact is that these CAN be turned around. I know of three marriages of 25, 26 and 28 years ILIASM that changed because of this tactic, separation. In each of the three, the refuser dictated, and I mean DICTATED, a plan of action that had to be followed, or the ripcord would be irrevocably pulled. In all three cases, refusers gulped hard, but agreed to terms. That said, I also know of a marriage or two in which the Celibate chose celibacy over marriage. But that doesn't negate the fact that ILIASMs can be turned around. Yes, if both partners are totally committed to change. I would be interested to know how long the turnarounds lasted. Did the refuser go back to refusing once the coast was clear? Actually, no. In the case of the wife who was in 28 yrs., she reported that her husband had a Damascus Road type of experience, that he changed their yearly vacation destination so that they could combine it with a men's hormonal facility. Three years after the blow-up, she reported that she had never imagined that her marriage could have been so great. The guy I know of, who I believe I mentioned once before, is the one who gave his wife an ultimatum: change or move out. She threatened divorce, but when he got the classified ads and started looking for an apartment for her, she agreed to his terms of counseling, reading a book by Dr. Laura (of all people!), and frequency of at least once a week. He reported two years afterwards that his wife kept up her part of the 'bargain' and hadn't tried to back off. It's been a while since I read the third person's account (a wife), but I seem to remember that the ultimatum of separation had long-term effect, as well. |
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