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Post by baza on Feb 9, 2022 2:36:00 GMT -5
Given that your nation survived 4 years of Trump, the underlying systems appear to have come through a tempestuous period pretty well and intact.
Same will likely apply for this new 'old white guy' who's in office.
In my jurisdiction we have as many cretins in politics as anyone else.
Yet our underlying system seems to hold up pretty well.
In my jurisdiction, the bureaucracy essentially run the country.
The politicians like to think they do, but they don't.
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Post by worksforme2 on Feb 9, 2022 6:55:42 GMT -5
In my jurisdiction, the bureaucracy essentially run the country. The politicians like to think they do, but they don't. I think this is my biggest criticism when it comes to governing in the US. There are so many un-elected bureaucrats who are rarely accountable for the damage they do when imposing their own views and values on the rest of us. Liberal Democrats are the worst offenders. Why so? Because most seem to view themselves as infinitely superior, both morally and intellectually, to the average citizen. |
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Post by Handy on Feb 9, 2022 22:12:55 GMT -5
Worksforme2
Because most seem to view themselves as infinitely superior, both morally and intellectually, to the average citizen. That sounds like Putin, Stalin, Hitler, and Hirohito/Tojo among others, but some included their own race as superior. Well not Stalin. He was a "one-off" guy.
Baza, you are correct. We muddle through problems. I just heard some people are working through the Social Security (retirement, actual disabilities and people that can't or wont work) for going on 2 years with out solving the main issue. The Social Security employees all work from home for the past 2 years. Call the 800 toll free number and someone might answer the phone after 45 minuets of waiting. Our federal tax office is the same way, everyone working from home but the building has 2 guards you have to go through and take off anything metal and your shoes. Meanwhile all of the private tax preparers work 6 days a week and some are open 12 hrs a day.
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Post by baza on Feb 10, 2022 0:28:58 GMT -5
Brother Handy . In my jurisdiction there are about 49% who vote conservative (called the Liberals) over here. They always vote conservative, always have and always will. Then there's about 49% who vote progressively (called Labour) over here. They always vote that way and always will. Then there's the swinging vote of 2% who might vote differently than they did last time out. This 2% decide the outcome. So you might deduce from this that the government of the day is decided by 2% of the electorate who are too stupid to make up their mind. Governments, Presidents, Prime Ministers come and go. But the bureaucracy goes on forever. If you are up for a laugh, google "1975 Constitutional Crisis" and have a read. |
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Post by Handy on Feb 10, 2022 3:20:36 GMT -5
Links for "1975 Constitutional Crisis" brought up adds for professional editors. I found the "1975 Constitutional Crisis" by typing in "Australian Constitutional Crisis."
There was a lot going on for several years "down under." I trust things have greatly improved. I read about problem with China and their (CCP) China Communist Party and some slow downs involving Australia's natural resources. Then some people wants Muslim law and to void Australian laws.
Like here, most of the time it is about what is good for each different group and not what makes sense or is good for the country. We get mail asking for money so the individual democrat D's (liberal) or the Republican R's (sometimes conservative but way too generous to rich peoples income stream) stating the party has to have more money to get a cohesive group (elect our guy) acting in the same direction. The R's and the D's just hate seeing the other party candidate win. I read a lot about Canada's parliament and "governor general." That wouldn't make many Americans happy if our system copied Canada. Many of the USA Native American (Indian reservations) have their own rules, which differ from the overall laws of the US. The FBI steps in when there is trouble because local and state laws sometimes do not apply on reservations. Some places (reservations) are messed-up. Several child abuse cases get dismissed because someone likes the criminal. People do not pay utility bills for months or years because heaven for bid people need the services. Tribes get federal money and sometimes certain tribal leaders take their cut and the books do not balance. Yet there are few persecutions and almost no one serves time or gets fined.
BTW, I enjoyed the articles and Youtube videos about the Australian automobile industry and its history. "The Holden Story: the history of Australia's iconic car brand" and the Holden 48/215 were very good. Some of the Ford Falcon videos were also very interesting along with the "UTE" versions of different vehicles.
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Post by mirrororchid on Feb 10, 2022 6:45:07 GMT -5
Then there's the swinging vote of 2% who might vote differently than they did last time out. So you might deduce from this that the government of the day is decided by 2% of the electorate who are too stupid to make up their mind. Governments, Presidents, Prime Ministers come and go. But the bureaucracy goes on forever. If you are up for a laugh, google "1975 Constitutional Crisis" and have a read. I'm of the opinion that the 2% are the only ones thinking about their decisions and smart enough to not feel obligated to line up on every plank of a platform without exception. Such people are just sheep. The 2% that can be persuaded are the only ones politicians need to listen to. They are the ones that matter. If you swear allegiance, you can be ignored. In America, you'll watch the politicians make their promises in Iowa, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida. The places that...change their minds. What if you are pro-choice but a hunter? What if you want to legalize drugs, but also want a strong military force? These are people you can't pigeonhole and they'll want to find candidates strong on their issues and weak on the ones they oppose. This takes research and dedication. Tough to pull it off if you're stupid. I salute the split-ticket voter-at least on your side of the pond. On my side, conservatism is the only way to go because libtards are so sure they're infinitely smarter than everyone else. Pfft. Infinitely. The arrogance, huh? That's why they're called libtards. Because they think they're so smart. But they aren't. OAN tells me so. |
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Post by worksforme2 on Feb 10, 2022 9:00:28 GMT -5
I'm of the opinion that the 2% are the only ones thinking about their decisions and smart enough to not feel obligated to line up on every plank of a platform without exception. Such people are just sheep. The 2% that can be persuaded are the only ones politicians need to listen to. They are the ones that matter. If you swear allegiance, you can be ignored. In America, you'll watch the politicians make their promises in Iowa, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida. The places that...change their minds. What if you are pro-choice but a hunter? What if you want to legalize drugs, but also want a strong military force? These are people you can't pigeonhole and they'll want to find candidates strong on their issues and weak on the ones they oppose. This takes research and dedication. Tough to pull it off if you're stupid. I salute the split-ticket voter-at least on your side of the pond. On my side, conservatism is the only way to go because libtards are so sure they're infinitely smarter than everyone else. Pfft. Infinitely. The arrogance, huh? That's why they're called libtards. Because they think they're so smart. But they aren't. OAN tells me so. I like the cut of your jib here mirrororchid,...At first i was thinking you were inclined toward the lib/elitist view of the world. But I now reckon you are sort of like me, coming down on different sides of different issues. I have been known to vote a split ticket. And I have been known not to vote at all in some races when neither party offers a candidate worth taking the time to color in the little circle. Candidates like Obama and McCain come to mind. Right now, it's early looking toward 2024, but I am wondering if there will be a candidate for Pres. I can vote for without holding my nose. Or will that little circle remain void of color? |
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Post by baza on Feb 10, 2022 15:47:24 GMT -5
Puts me in mind of an ILIASM situation where the choices before you are pretty unappetising.
One candidate looks shithouse, and the other even worse.
So it's on you to choose the candidate you feel is less worse.
But if you don't vote then in effect you have voted for the winner.
You might be surprised to know that in my jurisdiction, voting is compulsory.
You cop a fine if you don't vote.
Incidently, the local sitting member in my electorate is on the right of politics (I'm pretty left) but he is a great advocate for the electorate and is a really decent bloke too. So I don't particularly like the overall policies of the party he represents, but I do think he does a reasonable job on local issues in this electorate.
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Post by mirrororchid on Feb 10, 2022 20:01:59 GMT -5
I like the cut of your jib here mirrororchid,...At first i was thinking you were inclined toward the lib/elitist view of the world. But I now reckon you are sort of like me, coming down on different sides of different issues. I have been known to vote a split ticket. And I have been known not to vote at all in some races when neither party offers a candidate worth taking the time to color in the little circle. Candidates like Obama and McCain come to mind. Right now, it's early looking toward 2024, but I am wondering if there will be a candidate for Pres. I can vote for without holding my nose. Or will that little circle remain void of color? You're quite a good sport. Bless you for splitting your ticket. I live in a deep blue state, so I can vote for my favorite, because the Democrat is going to win. If (s)he doesn't, they have no prayer. It lets me vote for Libertarian or Green candidate. I voted for Obama. I hated Clinton and Gore, and was infuriatingly unimpressed with Kerry and Dukakis. I had to tell the Democrats "Gettin' warmer...." I actually voted for Simon, Dukakis, Tsongas, Clinton, Hagelin, Bradley, Browne, Dean, Badnarik, Gravel, Obama, Barr, Johnson, Stein, Warren, Jorgenson Yeah, I lose a lot. Bill Clinton's first term made me loyal to voting third party, as long as my vote won't be decisive (like it isn't in half the states that are rock solid red or blue.) Have you heard of anyone considering running that you'd support? Maybe from both parties? Not just 'lesser of evils"? I actually liked Warren quite a bit, last round. But the South threw me tired out, stale, bland, white bread Biden. On the plus side, his lethargic, dull demeanor have done little to inflame passions after 4 years of rabid screaming. Like the whole country took a quaalude and shot of vodka or got a shot of thorazine. |
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Post by baza on Feb 11, 2022 0:04:25 GMT -5
Interesting this.
In my jurisdiction, here's how you get to be Prime Minister.
First, you've got to win the election for your electorate, which gets you a seat in the House of Representatives.
Then, the party you are in has to win a bit over half all of the electorates to be able to form a government.
Then, you'd have to have the numbers among your colleagues to depose the current Prime Minister (Scott Morrison, the member for the electorate of Cook).
Once you are sure you have the numbers you'd call for a spill of positions and your party would have a party meeting and put the matter to a vote.
You win that vote, and hey presto, you are now the Prime Minister.
The essential difference here is that I don't get a vote on who becomes Prime Minister (currently Scott Morrison, the member for the electorate of Cook).
I only get a vote to elect the member for Nicholls - the electorate I live in.
It is the sole prerogative of the elected members of the majority government to elect the Prime Minister.
The average Joe in the electorate of Nicholls gets to elect the candidate in that electorate.
There is no mechanism whereby the average Joe in the electorate of Nicholls gets a say in the election of the Prime Minister.
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Post by Handy on Feb 11, 2022 2:53:54 GMT -5
Baza
You win that vote, and hey presto, you are now the Prime Minister.
So you have to be liked by the other Ministers. I see that working similar to the Canadian process.
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Post by baza on Feb 11, 2022 5:44:49 GMT -5
Yes, Canada and Australia are very similar to the Westminster (English) system Brother Handy . Of course in the course of getting elected PM you'll have to cut deals with others in your party to get their vote. You'd have to call in past favours you've done for them. You'll have to outright lie to the factions in your party. You'll have to cut loose some old friends. You'll have to get the media onside, and you'll have to watch your back at all times for plots to unseat you, and be aware that there are many many of your colleagues who think they could do a better job as PM than you. You are going to make powerful enemies who you'll have to placate at times by trampling over some old allies. You will have to be eternally on watch for plots against you, and prepared to quash such disloyalty quickly and forcefully. This is going to occupy a great amount of your day leaving precious little time for actual governing or developing new and visionary policies. All this before you even think of those on the Opposition party who all want to rip your head off. It is said in Australia that there are only 2 types of PM's (a) - those who have been sacked. (b) - those who are going be sacked. |
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Post by worksforme2 on Feb 11, 2022 7:47:58 GMT -5
It's not quite so cutthroat here. But the 2 main political parties make up for the lack of internal intrigue by throwing each other under the bus when it suits them politically.
And right now especially, both sides seem to view each other as seditious and treasonous in their approach to governing.
I admit to a conservative bias on most issues, but I don't see progressives as treasonous, but more along the lines of ignorant, or as freeloaders on the productive elements of society.
And Harry Truman was right, "if you want a friend in Washington, get a dog".
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Post by worksforme2 on Feb 11, 2022 7:50:40 GMT -5
Declaring Canadian geese to be a part of the seditious "Trucker" cadre, because of their "honking", Trudeau orders Mounties to blow them away..... Attachments:
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Post by jim44444 on Feb 11, 2022 8:01:12 GMT -5
Declaring Canadian geese to be a part of the seditious "Trucker" cadre, because of their "honking", Trudeau orders Mounties to blow them away..... This works for me. Those damn things are nothing but poop machines. |
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