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Post by Dan on May 19, 2016 8:30:02 GMT -5
I made the decision a few weeks ago to return to therapy, and have selected a new therapist after a "trial" session. (My therapist from the last decade retired.) I start again next week. Which means I had to tell my wife. Even this I have been dreading: just telling her I'm headed back to therapy.
I pointed out this morning that our sex and intimacy is entirely at zero, and I have no idea how to start it again. She agreed on both points. "But we're improving on other points, right? Give us credit where credit is due," she gently nudged with an upbeat tone. Out loud I agreed: "yes, better on some points"... but inwardly added "because I'm just emotionally detaching and don't care any more."
Then I mentioned I've decided to go back to therapy... then quickly added -- as if to soft-pedal the news -- "where I'll also be talking about dealing with our kids, and my fears about my ailing parents". To which she replied "OK, glad to hear it is not only about me". Why was that important for me to add?
Sometimes I think she is "sticking her head in the sand" about our problems. Or maybe just not bringing them up because she has no more of a solution than I do. And, well, the same could be asked about me. Hey, I'm an engineer: I *LOVE* to work on problems. Correction: I love to work on solvable problems! And, alas, I've come to admit (to myself) that I think my marriage is "unsolvable"; I can't see a path to rebuild it to something that will satisfy me.
Back to the breakfast table: within a minute or two she looked really somber. I think the message "it is serious" sunk in.
Which, is probably exactly what I wanted this morning: I wanted to say "things are serious, and in all likelihood headed for worse"... without ACTUALLY having to discuss the problem with her at that moment.
Why oh why am I beating around the bush so much on this (telling her in my heart of hearts I don't see a future with her)?
THAT is probably the main reason I'm headed back to therapy: to figure out WHY I'm dragging my feet.
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Post by bballgirl on May 19, 2016 10:20:03 GMT -5
I think it's a good idea for you to go back to therapy and use it as a vehicle to drive you towards the life that you want for yourself in regards to your marriage.
What was interesting to me was you stated to her that you wanted to also discuss the kids, your parents, etc. and while that may be true, something I have observed about you and I think most of us on here, is you are so kind and don't want to hurt your wife. Making that statement demonstrated that because you yourself are shielding her a little from the realities of the situation. That's not a bad thing either. It's almost a get into the pool by putting your toes in then walk down the steps slowly instead of jumping in.
I sort of used that method too. I told my husband I was going to therapy and that I wasn't in love with him about a month before I asked for a divorce. I used it as a vehicle to prepare myself and prepare him.
As far as kids, parents, even our own health and being alone, things have a way of working out, they just do.
If you work well together to parent your kids then you will work well whether you are married to each other or not because you love your kids.
Finances are usually tougher after divorce in my book that's just money. To me love and being made to feel loved is more important.
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Post by DryCreek on May 19, 2016 11:55:46 GMT -5
Dan most people hate confrontation and awkward conversations. Engineers fall squarely in that category. That, and perhaps a touch of empathy, is enough obstacle to prevent "solving the problem". Never mind that its also a squishy problem that defies a black-and-white answer. Day by day, it's far easier to let the problem perpetuate instead of confronting it, even when in the big picture it would be so much easier to have ripped off the Band-Aid and dealt with it. And it may also be that confronting the topic is a tired saw. "I'm still here, I'm still unhappy" gets to be pretty old. But equally, giving up the fight gives the perception that things are improved when they haven't. It's unpleasant no matter how you slice it.
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Post by greatcoastal on May 19, 2016 12:11:40 GMT -5
I pointed out this morning that our sex and intimacy is entirely at zero, and I have no idea how to start it again. She agreed on both points. "But we're improving on other points, right? Give us credit where credit is due," she gently nudged with an upbeat tone. Out loud I agreed: "yes, better on some points"... but inwardly added "because I'm just emotionally detaching and don't care any I' ve got to comment on this one.She took your need for respect through intimacy and sex, and threw it in the trash! Totally switched gears, shrugged it off denied it, etc...please hold her feet to the fire! Repeat it, make her own up to it! Sounds like the only improving is you caving more, by detaching, ( just like me)! |
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Post by ggold on May 19, 2016 12:14:11 GMT -5
@dan I am the same. I cannot get the words, "I want a divorce," out of my mouth. The truth is I am petrified. I married him when I was 25 years old. Looking back, I was just so young and should have lived a little on my own. There's nothing I can do about the past now. My husband also sticks his head in the sand about our problems. If I did not bring our issues up, he would never. He is content to live this way. I don't understand how, but it's not for me to figure out. My own therapy has helped me immensely. I have become more aware and empowered through it.
My therapist recommended a marriage counselor for us. We are going together in June. (Second time around) I have not yet mentioned to him that it will be more for mediation. It is hopefully with the help of a professional that we can both agree this marriage is over, we need to move on, and do it all as peacefully as possible for our children.
This all just sucks!!!!!
I am sorry for what you are going through. You have my support.
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Post by bballgirl on May 19, 2016 12:19:21 GMT -5
DryCreek- good point about the black and white, the empathy too For me to have gone through with the divorce from the point where you first say those words to your spouse up to the moving out - I had to take the emotion out of it. I'm extremely empathetic. However it became a question of logic for me: Do I want to be celibate for the rest of my life? Do I want to live under the same roof with someone I'm not in love with? There it is the black and white. (Of course for me there were so many other dysfunctional issues but if the sex and the love were there I would have worked through them). So then when it's black and white and you take the emotion out it's easier to rip off the band aid. My ex told me that the night I told him I wanted a divorce that I was like a robot with no emotion like it was rehearsed and robotic. It was and that's not me but it's the ME that I had to be in order to have a chance at the life I wanted FOR ME!
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 13:13:30 GMT -5
I'm sorry you're in this place, Dan. I know it's not fun to put it mildly. It's understandable that you are softening the blow to your wife. Is it because you don't want to say something that triggers a divorce until you've decided thay's what you want? Because I know that's why I avoided a direct confrontation for so long (ironically in my case avoiding a direct discussion for so long only ensured the problem festered so long there was no hope for the marriage). I hope you find peace, whatever you decide is best for you.
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Post by ggold on May 19, 2016 15:13:22 GMT -5
DryCreek - good point about the black and white, the empathy too For me to have gone through with the divorce from the point where you first say those words to your spouse up to the moving out - I had to take the emotion out of it. I'm extremely empathetic. However it became a question of logic for me: Do I want to be celibate for the rest of my life? Do I want to live under the same roof with someone I'm not in love with? There it is the black and white. (Of course for me there were so many other dysfunctional issues but if the sex and the love were there I would have worked through them). So then when it's black and white and you take the emotion out it's easier to rip off the band aid. My ex told me that the night I told him I wanted a divorce that I was like a robot with no emotion like it was rehearsed and robotic. It was and that's not me but it's the ME that I had to be in order to have a chance at the life I wanted FOR ME! I'm going to have to take the emotion out bballgirl. That's the only way I'll get through it. :-( |
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Post by bballgirl on May 19, 2016 15:26:50 GMT -5
DryCreek - good point about the black and white, the empathy too For me to have gone through with the divorce from the point where you first say those words to your spouse up to the moving out - I had to take the emotion out of it. I'm extremely empathetic. However it became a question of logic for me: Do I want to be celibate for the rest of my life? Do I want to live under the same roof with someone I'm not in love with? There it is the black and white. (Of course for me there were so many other dysfunctional issues but if the sex and the love were there I would have worked through them). So then when it's black and white and you take the emotion out it's easier to rip off the band aid. My ex told me that the night I told him I wanted a divorce that I was like a robot with no emotion like it was rehearsed and robotic. It was and that's not me but it's the ME that I had to be in order to have a chance at the life I wanted FOR ME! I'm going to have to take the emotion out bballgirl. That's the only way I'll get through it. :-( Then take it out! Practice, rehearse, pretend like you are a lawyer making closing arguments to get your client off of death row. Be firm, resolute and emotionless. |
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Post by ggold on May 19, 2016 15:43:36 GMT -5
I'm going to have to take the emotion out bballgirl . That's the only way I'll get through it. :-( Then take it out! Practice, rehearse, pretend like you are a lawyer making closing arguments to get your client off of death row. Be firm, resolute and emotionless. It's going to be so hard!!!! I have to practice. ugh |
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Post by bballgirl on May 19, 2016 15:45:31 GMT -5
Then take it out! Practice, rehearse, pretend like you are a lawyer making closing arguments to get your client off of death row. Be firm, resolute and emotionless. It's going to be so hard!!!! I have to practice. ugh Yep hardest thing I ever had to do but my future self was worth it. |
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Post by ggold on May 19, 2016 15:47:40 GMT -5
It's going to be so hard!!!! I have to practice. ugh Yep hardest thing I ever had to do but my future self was worth it. You are so right. |
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Post by wewbwb on May 19, 2016 16:01:18 GMT -5
@dan it may be similar to my situation. I love my W - I just don't like the lack of intimacy, in and out of bed. Is that enough to get divorced? I struggle with that. Daily.
There is also the fear of the unknown, the fear of change, and the lose of comfort.
It's a decision not to be taken lightly.
I recognize that the struggle you feel is real. It is also a sign of how seriously you take your commitments.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 16:47:04 GMT -5
Dan, I think this is hard for anybody who is a decent human being, and more so if you ever really loved them. It took me 3 years to get to the point of having The Talk (TM) and making it stick. I don't know whether it's harder if you had a good relationship, because I see people here in this group with lousy relationships who are still there. My refuser and I did have real love and happiness for a long time. I have to keep reminding myself that, when the problems started, he would not do his part in the solving of them. I have to remind myself that he wouldn't let me help him. He shut me out of that, in a lot of ways. And he resented that I kept bugging him about sex - but that was the *only* thing I bugged him about. If he had just made an honest effort in that *one* area of life, if he had let me in, if he had let me help him....I could have dealt with all the other issues. All was not great bar the sex; but the sex made me able to deal with the other problems. Anyway, I took 3 years to do this; and I took tiny baby steps. And I'll say it again - this is so hard for us, because we tend to be loving, kind people who want our relationships with other people to be harmonious.
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Post by baza on May 19, 2016 19:16:03 GMT -5
@ dan
Suggestion.
Don't fret too much about "why" you are dragging your feet about having "The Talk", as the answer is invariably "because I'm not ready".
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And, you won't be ready until such time as you have done the boring old things of -
- seeing a lawyer in your jurisdiction and establishing how a divorce would shake out for you
- putting together an exit strategy and knocking it in to do-able shape
- shoring up your support network
- researching everything you can about managing kids (if any) through such a process.
In other words, you have to have constructed a viable alternative to staying before you start seriously thinking about going.
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THEN, comes "The Talk", undertaken from a position of certainty, with a viable alternative in your pocket.
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Seeing a new therapist as you propose comes under the heading of "shoring up your support network" which is an important component of the wider picture, but it is only "part" of it, and those other aspects need to be done as well to complete the picture.
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I think that if you fully and diligently prepare yourself, you won't find the prospect of "The Talk" as intimidating as it may seem to you today.
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