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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2016 15:47:37 GMT -5
One other thing, are you ok with him boinking someone else? Don't think he won't. I truly would love for him to boink someone else. That would be my window of opportunity to leg it. I'm just spineless I think. Gotta give him kudos for finding someone so stupid to look after him his whole adult live without having to give anything in return! Smart man ha ha. That's truer than you think. He's very very cunning. I know his type. They remind me of the evil genius in a James Bond movie, in his control room surrounded by video monitors cackling with depraved glee as he turns and twists knobs and levers left and right. Those knobs and levers are your mind. Don't pity this manipulator. |
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Post by JMX on May 8, 2016 15:50:08 GMT -5
eternaloptimism , it sounds like there are other good reasons (in addition to the no-sex bullshit) for you to end this relationship. Like, violence and drugs. Let me ask you this - and I hope you won't be offended: are you in therapy, or have you ever been in therapy? I get the feeling that you are having trouble letting go of this situation with a childish man that you have to take care of (in ways that no adult should have to take care of another adult.) Why is that, exactly? Why is it so hard for you to leave a situation where you give so much and receive so little? What are you getting out of this? This. You have every right to leave and need to do so. My worry is that if he was violent in the past - couldn't he do this again? If he is volatile, I would NOT ask him for an open marriage. I asked my husband for one. It was not granted. He doesn't want me, and he doesn't want anyone else to have me. I've seen some valiant attempts at open marriage on these boards, but they were attempts. I don't think I've seen one that was successful. |
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Post by unmatched on May 8, 2016 15:56:17 GMT -5
From everything you have written above it sounds like you don't actually want an open relationship. You are just trying to find a way to end the one you have without having to kick him out directly. I would second what SmartKat said, go and talk to a counsellor a few times and talk through all your fears and blocks. Also if you haven't I would also recommend starting to talk to family and friends. It starts to give the whole thing more momentum and make it real.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2016 16:00:37 GMT -5
eternaloptimism , it sounds like there are other good reasons (in addition to the no-sex bullshit) for you to end this relationship. Like, violence and drugs. Let me ask you this - and I hope you won't be offended: are you in therapy, or have you ever been in therapy? I get the feeling that you are having trouble letting go of this situation with a childish man that you have to take care of (in ways that no adult should have to take care of another adult.) Why is that, exactly? Why is it so hard for you to leave a situation where you give so much and receive so little? What are you getting out of this? This. You have every right to leave and need to do so. My worry is that if he was violent in the past - couldn't he do this again? If he is volatile, I would NOT ask him for an open marriage. I asked my husband for one. It was not granted. He doesn't want me, and he doesn't want anyone else to have me. I've seen some valiant attempts at open marriage on these boards, but they were attempts. I don't think I've seen one that was successful. Twenty thumbs up. I try to be not directive and let people decide what to do on their own, they're going to anyway, but I take back my answer in this case that all you can do is ask. eternal, he will view a lover as a threat to his little gig and his control over you. And abusive manipulators can become violent when they see their hold on their victim weakening. Don't even bring an open marriage up. Get the hell out. |
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Post by Dan on May 8, 2016 16:00:47 GMT -5
I've know one person personally in a polyamoruos relationship, and think I interacted with one on EP. ( What's 'polyamory'?) Interesting. I'd like to find out more about polyamory. I just don't see how a human can get everything they need from 1 other human ... This doesn't quite sit right with me. Society has rules. We are conditioned into them without any consultation. I want to make my own rules. Actually... Not even rules...everything in life changes and is fluid so why are we so hell bent on beating ourselves up because one human doesn't quite fit what we want? I want options ha ha Yeah, society has rules. Lots of 'em about sex! An "open marriage" is when a couple agrees "sure, have sex with others". If I may summarize: "sharing a bed from time to time." Polyamory is different in this way: one or both members of the couple have "loving, spousal relationships" with more than one mate. They may share much more than a bed: finances, living arrangements, children, caregiving, household duties... as well as sex and intimacy. One of the "rules" of polyamory, however (see: even polyamory has rules!) is that all parties are fully on board and agreed to the arrangements. There is no such thing as a "secretive polyamorous" relationship. I agree with the concept: I think I have enough love in my heart that I could love more than one woman in a "spousal way". I sort of experienced that during my one "big affair": I really deeply loved my AP, but also still my wife. (I'm not saying it was polyamory, as it was secretive. I'm just saying, "I buy in to the possibility" of polyamory.) Again: I don't think that an "open marriage" or "swinging" or "polyamory" is a SOLUTION to a sexless marriage. Leaving it, and hooking up with someone who loves you and loves sex is. |
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Post by bballgirl on May 8, 2016 16:06:11 GMT -5
I am no longer of the school of thought where I feel another person has a say in my sexuality.
I felt that way at the end of my marriage.
I outsourced and had zero guilt.
I met a man that is an incredible lover and taught me so much about my sexuality.
I do not believe in asking permission to someone about a topic that they refuse to participate in, it's none of their business and they made that choice.
I never worried about getting caught because I was already done with the marriage and if he found out I would have said, "well did you think I was going to live like a nun forever?" It would have just sped up the divorce which is what I really wanted. Of course I was too smart to get caught. I made sure with 100% certainty that I was discreet and covered all of my bases.
Look bottom line - you have one life and if you enjoy chocolate cake then you should indulge every once in a while and if you enjoy sex then you should do that too!
I guess I don't see sex so much as a sacred act anymore like I used to. It's more like dessert only you burn calories instead of add them so enjoy your life and find your happiness in whatever that may be!
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Post by eternaloptimism on May 8, 2016 17:11:26 GMT -5
eternaloptimism, it sounds like there are other good reasons (in addition to the no-sex bullshit) for you to end this relationship. Like, violence and drugs. Let me ask you this - and I hope you won't be offended: are you in therapy, or have you ever been in therapy? I get the feeling that you are having trouble letting go of this situation with a childish man that you have to take care of (in ways that no adult should have to take care of another adult.) Why is that, exactly? Why is it so hard for you to leave a situation where you give so much and receive so little? What are you getting out of this? No I'm not. I want to be but struggling to afford his therapy so mine has no chance. If I were alone I could afford it. I found out last night he hasnt even told his therapist about his weed addiction. What!!!!! Why even bother going? He's very selfish. He's had a lot if shit he hadn't dealt with in life and is very fucked up. My guess is that ive always believed I can make him better.... I now realise I can't!! Xxx |
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Post by eternaloptimism on May 8, 2016 17:15:42 GMT -5
I truly would love for him to boink someone else. That would be my window of opportunity to leg it. I'm just spineless I think. Gotta give him kudos for finding someone so stupid to look after him his whole adult live without having to give anything in return! Smart man ha ha. That's truer than you think. He's very very cunning. I know his type. They remind me of the evil genius in a James Bond movie, in his control room surrounded by video monitors cackling with depraved glee as he turns and twists knobs and levers left and right. Those knobs and levers are your mind. Don't pity this manipulator. He's very clever. No denying it! I'm gonna start referring to him as the evil genius now. I like that  |
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Post by eternaloptimism on May 8, 2016 17:25:22 GMT -5
eternaloptimism , it sounds like there are other good reasons (in addition to the no-sex bullshit) for you to end this relationship. Like, violence and drugs. Let me ask you this - and I hope you won't be offended: are you in therapy, or have you ever been in therapy? I get the feeling that you are having trouble letting go of this situation with a childish man that you have to take care of (in ways that no adult should have to take care of another adult.) Why is that, exactly? Why is it so hard for you to leave a situation where you give so much and receive so little? What are you getting out of this? This. You have every right to leave and need to do so. My worry is that if he was violent in the past - couldn't he do this again? If he is volatile, I would NOT ask him for an open marriage. I asked my husband for one. It was not granted. He doesn't want me, and he doesn't want anyone else to have me. I've seen some valiant attempts at open marriage on these boards, but they were attempts. I don't think I've seen one that was successful. He drank a lot in his violent phase. Now he's a pot head he doesn't have the energy for violence! I could kick his ass anyway these days! I'm not scared of him. I see very clearly I'm moments like this that I'm not meant to be here with him. But like I say, I'm a sucker through and through and the tiniest glimmer of hope keeps me rooted. I need to get into therapy and get stronger to do what needs to be done... Running away seems easier. If I didn't have the kids I would have been gone a long time ago i think x |
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Post by JMX on May 8, 2016 17:36:06 GMT -5
I am a sucker too. Recovering sucker. Your journey will be a long one. That's not being pessimistic, but honest. Read as much as you can get your hands on here - a lot of us have a link to our stories in our profiles. It will help catch you up to speed in the futility of the situation.
Some days, you will work to get out. Most other days you won't. Eventually, those will reverse. Finally you will get out.
Good luck!
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Post by eternaloptimism on May 8, 2016 18:18:23 GMT -5
I am a sucker too. Recovering sucker. Your journey will be a long one. That's not being pessimistic, but honest. Read as much as you can get your hands on here - a lot of us have a link to our stories in our profiles. It will help catch you up to speed in the futility of the situation. Some days, you will work to get out. Most other days you won't. Eventually, those will reverse. Finally you will get out. Good luck! Thanks JMX. I can't access the links it seems. I deleted my EP account before it shut and it's asking for a log in. Grrr. I'll catch up with everyone's story eventually. Xxxxx |
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2016 19:27:26 GMT -5
eternaloptimism, it sounds like there are other good reasons (in addition to the no-sex bullshit) for you to end this relationship. Like, violence and drugs. Let me ask you this - and I hope you won't be offended: are you in therapy, or have you ever been in therapy? I get the feeling that you are having trouble letting go of this situation with a childish man that you have to take care of (in ways that no adult should have to take care of another adult.) Why is that, exactly? Why is it so hard for you to leave a situation where you give so much and receive so little? What are you getting out of this? No I'm not. I want to be but struggling to afford his therapy so mine has no chance. If I were alone I could afford it. I found out last night he hasnt even told his therapist about his weed addiction. What!!!!! Why even bother going? He's very selfish. He's had a lot if shit he hadn't dealt with in life and is very fucked up. My guess is that ive always believed I can make him better.... I now realise I can't!! Xxx Now there's progress. |
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Post by unmatched on May 8, 2016 19:39:32 GMT -5
If I were alone I could afford it. I found out last night he hasnt even told his therapist about his weed addiction. What!!!!! Why even bother going? He's very selfish. He's had a lot if shit he hadn't dealt with in life and is very fucked up. My guess is that ive always believed I can make him better.... I now realise I can't!! Xxx I think that is really important. I spent years thinking that underneath all her issues my wife deep down really wanted to be intimate and emotionally connected and sensual. It didn't matter how many times she told me the opposite. When I finally believed her it was like turning off a light. All that time I had been trying to have a relationship not with the real person in front of me but with some strange figment of my imagination. It wasn't respectful to or supportive of her. It just put her under lots of pressure to be something she wasn't. And that probably killed her sex drive more than anything else. Now I am starting to see her as a real person who doesn't want the same things that I do. And after all those years of desperately craving intimacy with her, I am suddenly finding I don't really want it any more. In your case, you need to stop seeing your husband as a victim, and start seeing him as somebody who deliberately (if maybe not so consciously) goes out and looks for ways to hide from his life. (And from his past, and his feelings, and from you.) At some point, he might decide he wants to do something different. But I wouldn't hold your breath. |
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Post by Dan on May 8, 2016 21:09:21 GMT -5
From everything you have written above it sounds like you don't actually want an open relationship. You are just trying to find a way to end the one you have without having to kick him out directly. I would second what SmartKat said, go and talk to a counsellor a few times and talk through all your fears and blocks. Also if you haven't I would also recommend starting to talk to family and friends. It starts to give the whole thing more momentum and make it real. : I agree with unmatched ... and think it, in a way, applies to me, too. So many things you said resonate with me: - "I'd be over the moon if he turned to me and said he agrees that we are incompatible and we should go our separate ways." - "My ideal is to stay with him happily. But I'm never going to get happiness here. I'm just waiting for something to happen to kick me one way or the other." Here's another realization after reading what *I* wrote to you! You know all my "Plan B" options in asking for an open marriage? I phrased each as "either start having sex with me, or [let me do Plan B]". At this point, I'm so convinced that I will never have a satisfying sex life with my wife that -- in all cases -- I don't want her to pick "start having sex with me"... ANY of the "Plans B" sound better to me. I should just offer her the list of "Plans B": Dear S____: Please pick one: 1) agree to an open marriage, 2) divorce me. If you fail to pick, I'm going to 3) fool around. But since I'm 100% sure "option 1" is a non-starter (she announced it once, unprompted!), I may as well save the us the trouble of even putting that on the table, and just put-in for the divorce now. Everyone: PLEASE don't beat me up about this. I'm still "getting there"... not all parts of my brain are with me yet. |
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Post by unmatched on May 8, 2016 21:14:49 GMT -5
eternaloptimism : I agree with unmatched ... and think it, in a way, applies to me, too. So many things you said resonate with me: - "I'd be over the moon if he turned to me and said he agrees that we are incompatible and we should go our separate ways." - "My ideal is to stay with him happily. But I'm never going to get happiness here. I'm just waiting for something to happen to kick me one way or the other." Here's another realization after reading what *I* wrote to you! You know all my "Plan B" options in asking for an open marriage? I phrased each as "either start having sex with me, or [let me do Plan B]". At this point, I'm so convinced that I will never have a satisfying sex life with my wife that -- in all cases -- I don't want her to pick "start having sex with me"... ANY of the "Plans B" sound better to me. I should just offer her the list of "Plans B": Dear S____: Please pick one: 1) agree to an open marriage, 2) divorce me. If you fail to pick, I'm going to 3) fool around. But since I'm 100% sure "option 1" is a non-starter (she announced it once, unprompted!), I may as well save the us the trouble of even putting that on the table, and just put-in for the divorce now. Everyone: PLEASE don't beat me up about this. I'm still "getting there"... not all parts of my brain are with me yet. Dan, you are such an idiot, you need to get your shit together. [just kidding  ] But from what you have said before, you don't really want to fool around, and I suspect you would find an open marriage frustrating and unsatisfying fairly quickly. Which kind of cuts down the options a bit. Just a thought... |
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