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Post by lyn on May 23, 2017 14:19:08 GMT -5
I just saw this topic touched-on in "other relationship issues", but I wanted to throw this out - a different slant on it with regards to future dates/love interests: ------ if you know someone lies to you (even white lies) ...... should you avoid dating this person completely? I know everyone "lies" or as greatcoastal put it, tell "half-truths" sometimes. But if someone lies to you about stupid stuff (when the lies are obvious) - is this a red flag to not date a person like this? Just wondering if I'm hypersensitive to being lied to. My H tells white lies (and has told many big lies) - for such a long time I really find I cannot tolerate it in my life going forward - from people I may date, or even friends - new or old - for that matter. Maybe I just answered my own question. But really, are white lies enough to take someone out of the "possibly date" category? [ (Edit- just to add - I will be out of this thing within a month or so..... so really beginning to wonder about this type of thing. I'm sure I'll have many more questions like this one - thanks in advance 😉) |
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Post by cagedtiger on May 23, 2017 14:37:17 GMT -5
I do think it's enough to disqualify somebody from the dating pool. Just be up - front about that and I think it'll work out better for you.
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Post by lyn on May 23, 2017 14:48:12 GMT -5
Yeah - I'm thinking it's on the deal-breaker list. Why invest personally in someone if they disrespect you by lying - even dumb lies - from the start?
Is 100% honesty too much to ask for?
I don't think so. White lies aren't really necessary imho. One can be honest without being an a-hole. Just takes some tact I guess.
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Post by greatcoastal on May 23, 2017 15:14:51 GMT -5
Yeah - I'm thinking it's on the deal-breaker list. Why invest personally in someone if they disrespect you by lying - even dumb lies - from the start? Is 100% honesty too much to ask for? I don't think so. White lies aren't really necessary imho. One can be honest without being an a-hole. Just takes some tact I guess. Where in the same boat! So.... here's a question for myself to share with you? How "honest", am I going to be? What kind of "training" have I had to "keep it all inside, keep the peace at all cost", but it really annoys me, makes me angry. How "honest will I be about it? My past history of a SM with a Narc. How "honest " am I going to be about that? How much up front honesty will scare off a potential date? How much of your good, happy, person with potential side do you want to show, and how are you "honestly" going to handle your "tainted" past? My problem? I've seen it already, I'm going to be too honest! It could be a stage where I need comfort and sympathy to anyone who can understand a SM. It's a crazy time! |
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Post by wewbwb on May 23, 2017 16:22:52 GMT -5
Yeah - I'm thinking it's on the deal-breaker list. Why invest personally in someone if they disrespect you by lying - even dumb lies - from the start? Is 100% honesty too much to ask for? I don't think so. White lies aren't really necessary imho. One can be honest without being an a-hole. Just takes some tact I guess. I lie to people every single day. Just today I said "Don't worry, we are doing everything we can to get your car out by the end of the day." Never ever going to happen. But the lie makes them feel better. Does this make me bad? If I "never let the truth get in the way of a good story" am I untrustworthy? Or funny? If I say "I'm staying a little late at work tonight" - and instead I'm buying Christmas presents, am I disrespecting you? Personally, a better "benchmark" is are they able to honest and trust worthy when it matters to you? Now some of this is rhetorical, (I told the customer that I wouldn't let his car go until I was satisfied that everything was correct) But I don't see this as a "either/or" issue. Like most things I think it is a matter of perspective. |
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Post by merrygoround on May 23, 2017 16:23:29 GMT -5
For me, lying is a deal breaker.
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Post by wewbwb on May 23, 2017 16:27:32 GMT -5
After a moment of reflection let me pose this question to everyone.
Almost everyone here took a vow, an oath, to "love and honor" our refusers.
Now that you don't, are you a liar?
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Post by lifeinwoodinville on May 23, 2017 16:34:46 GMT -5
In my opinion it has a lot to do with the lie itself. An example of an acceptable lie would be "No, we are not planning a surprise party for your birthday." An example of a lie that is not acceptable would be "No, I didn't have sex with your brother!"
But what about omissions? Is it a lie just to not volunteer the information? If my wife cheats on me but just doesn't volunteer the information, is that a lie?
I don't think 100% honesty is a great idea either. For example, I don't need to know what sex acts that my partner has performed on anyone. That's not going to do anything but create mental images in my head that I do not want. I had an ex-girlfriend years ago that liked to "volunteer" that kind of information. I didn't ask you about that kind of thing for a reason!
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Post by merrygoround on May 23, 2017 16:39:10 GMT -5
After a moment of reflection let me pose this question to everyone. Almost everyone here took a vow, an oath, to "love and honor" our refusers. Now that you don't, are you a liar? Mine was in response to the OP on dating. Get that out of the way early and disqualify. Your question - he lied first. And continued.  |
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Post by lifeinwoodinville on May 23, 2017 16:40:30 GMT -5
Yeah - I'm thinking it's on the deal-breaker list. Why invest personally in someone if they disrespect you by lying - even dumb lies - from the start? Is 100% honesty too much to ask for? I don't think so. White lies aren't really necessary imho. One can be honest without being an a-hole. Just takes some tact I guess. I lie to people every single day. Just today I said "Don't worry, we are doing everything we can to get your car out by the end of the day." Never ever going to happen. But the lie makes them feel better. Does this make me bad? If I "never let the truth get in the way of a good story" am I untrustworthy? Or funny? If I say "I'm staying a little late at work tonight" - and instead I'm buying Christmas presents, am I disrespecting you? Personally, a better "benchmark" is are they able to honest and trust worthy when it matters to you? Now some of this is rhetorical, (I told the customer that I wouldn't let his car go until I was satisfied that everything was correct) But I don't see this as a "either/or" issue. Like most things I think it is a matter of perspective. Now that you point that out I lie all day too. I told a guy in email today that I was "sorry for the confusion". In reality I'm sorry he's so damn stupid that he couldn't fill out a basic four question, multiple choice request form correctly. |
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Post by wewbwb on May 23, 2017 16:55:41 GMT -5
I'd also like to point out that I'm not saying that I am "right". All I'm saying is that there is "gray" in the world and we as people, as fallible humans, need to understand that.
A lie to cover a misdeeds or to appear to be different from what you are can (probably should ) be a deal breaker, while "I won't mind if your mother stays with us a week" shouldn't be. In my opinion.
Of course, I could be wrong.
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Post by snowman12345 on May 23, 2017 17:41:49 GMT -5
I don't lie at work, people's lives and health may depend on my honesty. However, I might not disclose everything unless specifically asked. I may do this because I don't have complete information on the situation.
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Post by bballgirl on May 23, 2017 18:07:43 GMT -5
After a moment of reflection let me pose this question to everyone. Almost everyone here took a vow, an oath, to "love and honor" our refusers. Now that you don't, are you a liar? Nope I'm not a liar, but I finally learned to love myself first. |
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Post by wewbwb on May 23, 2017 18:54:16 GMT -5
I don't lie at work, people's lives and health may depend on my honesty. However, I might not disclose everything unless specifically asked. I may do this because I don't have complete information on the situation. Might you "downplay" certain risks because you think one solution is better than another? Is that not the same thing? Again all I'm saying is that the idea of 100% total honestly is not the same thing as "right speech " Furthermore, if someone says "I always tell the truth " they are lying and to me that's a far bigger "red flag" then someone who practices "right speech " |
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Post by baza on May 23, 2017 19:01:26 GMT -5
I reckon Sister lyn , that if you bar everyone who lies to you from your dating list, then you will never have another date in your life. And that would probably not be a life enhancing position to take. If you are going to engage in life generally, then you are going to be dealing with liars, starting in the morning when the barista insincerely wishes you a good day when you purchase your latte. If you are going to engage with a person specifically, you are a certainty to be told a few porkies here and there. Would it be a productive use of your time and resources to try and verify everything someone says to you for its' veracity ? I'd imagine that would bog you down somewhat, much like "why chasing". Here's a scenario for you. Ms enna and I had agreed to meet back in about July 2009. It was all organised. And I baled out of it on 2 days notice. I claimed ill health. Ms enna believed I had gotten cold feet (or at least strongly suspected it) The facts were that I was indeed quite sick, but it would not have been unreasonable for Ms enna to think "this bloke is just jerking me about". So when I suggested we meet a week later than we had previously agreed, she would have been quite entitled to tell me to fuck off. She - a little cautiously - agreed to the re-schedule. And we met. And the rest is history. It could oh so easily have crashed and burned when I baled out of the original agreement. |
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