|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 12:44:14 GMT -5
LEXUS46 - I agree too and I will keep pondering on that thought. I've been hoping for so long and believing his words without action. I don't want to have regrets. Thank you for responding.  |
|
|
|
Post by Chatter Fox on Dec 1, 2016 12:54:30 GMT -5
beeman - thank you for your kind words. He definitely knows this is a dealbreaker. If we've had one talk, we've literally had HUNDREDS. Of course, some of those times it was mostly just venting anger, but I've said for so long that I can't do this as-is forever. In the last couple weeks, the talks have become more serious, and he definitely knows this. He has tried to be more outgoing and a little more touchy, which only makes me see the lack of passion and sexuality in our relationship more. If he wasn't so nice, and I knew it was mutual or he wouldn't be crushed, I would probably be long gone. Even though he knows all of this and things are still not good, I feel like I need to give it one more chance. It hurts so much to feel like you're throwing away something that COULD be amazing, if it didn't lack so much.  I know that doesn't make much sense. Again, the problem there is my dwindling romantic feelings towards him at all. Part of me wishes he would just end it and let me go.. I appreciate your help and the help of this group! I really don't want to sacrifice my sexuality, and while it's not EVERYTHING, it's very important to me. I think it's worth fighting for, whether with him or not. Thank you again. You're very welcome! Another thing to mention. You may like the book "Too Good to Leave Too Bad to Stay" by Mira Kirshenbaum. It asks you a series of questions to gage your relationship. If you are on the fence regarding some of the non-sexual aspects of your relationship, the book may help you sort some things out with that. It may help give you a nudge in one direction or the other? (hopefully?) . I'm really glad to hear that you have made it very clear to him. That's a big step. It's not easy either. So you deserve a big round of applause for that! |
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 13:04:35 GMT -5
Thanks again, beeman! The encouragement is much appreciated. It was a big step to show him how serious I was, whether or not anything will change. He was definitely upset and for a while, unwilling to try if he "wasn't sure I was staying or leaving." Ugh. I've heard of that book and will look into it. It would probably be helpful! It seems like in general, a decision needs to be reached sooner than later. Living in this limbo of non-decision is awful!
|
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 13:14:29 GMT -5
Chatter Fox gave you some excellent advice. As far as "one more chance" and what COULD be an amazing marriage, he had all the chances he needed in the first sexless year. You've apparently made things very clear to him, and he has been equally clear: he does not intend to give you anything he is not already giving you. He is content with the celibate lifestyle HE has enforced in the marriage. The marriage that you think COULD BE is a fantasy in your own mind. It is my belief, based on experience, that our refusers rarely will or can give us the real reason. For one simple reason: They can never admit that they entered into the marriage intending to enforce sexlessness if not total celibacy, on us. I believe my refuser harbors a deep dark secret. She as much as told me that. After I backed her into a corner for 6 hours, something I don't recommend anyone else trying. Just accept that after all these years of no viable explanation that the secret is very deep and very dark.
|
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 13:18:09 GMT -5
What I wouldn't give to be 30ish again and know what I know and what I've learned here... Please don't squander the opportunity ...
|
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 13:22:15 GMT -5
He definitely did, beachguy, and I appreciate your advice too! I see what you mean. There could be some kind of secret there, I'm really not sure. As I've said, he claims that things have just been too emotional/weird around the SM issue, and that my "vibe" is no longer good because he can tell I'm uninterested. So he doesn't initiate that much. I guess I can't say that some of that isn't valid, right? I mean, if something is talked about all the time, it becomes a big deal. But how could I not talk about it? He did have 5-6 years to figure it out, especially in the beginning when it was a fairly non-emotional issue. And if he would have even put forth more EFFORT, I would've been happier. I was always the one to suggest/find counselors, bring up the conversations, read books/online forums, voice unhappiness, etc. So even if he feels bad about the situation, as he claims to, what has he done to help it? I have never once seen him do that, which kind of speaks volumes. |
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 13:23:23 GMT -5
Yeah, it's a good time to make a change if I'm going to. Young enough and no kids. Ugh, it's difficult. I know it's naive after all the pain, but I would miss the friendship. Sometimes I feel that it would be hard to find someone like him in a lot of other areas. But is giving up sex (essentially) really worth that? I'm sure there are great guys out there, I'm just out of dating practice..
|
|
|
|
Post by cagedtiger on Dec 1, 2016 13:50:17 GMT -5
Yeah, it's a good time to make a change if I'm going to. Young enough and no kids. Ugh, it's difficult. I know it's naive after all the pain, but I would miss the friendship. Sometimes I feel that it would be hard to find someone like him in a lot of other areas. But is giving up sex (essentially) really worth that? I'm sure there are great guys out there, I'm just out of dating practice.. One of my best friends was in the same situation- his ex-wife even admitted that she just appeared to be into the sex to keep him around. They're still good friends now- do you think that may ever be a possibility down the road for you and your husband if you do split? I'm also fairly young, no kids, I've only been married about 2 years, and with my wife a total of about 4 years. When we first floated the idea of us ever splitting, my wife said point blank, "we won't ever be able to be friends." That gave me pause for a few days, until i realized that right now, we're only really "friends" when other people are watching. How's your support network of close friends and family outside your marriage? When i realized what was going on, i started rebuilding and strengthening that. Now that I have that, I honestly know I'd miss her dog and cat more than her. |
|
|
|
Post by beachguy on Dec 1, 2016 13:51:42 GMT -5
He definitely did, beachguy, and I appreciate your advice too! I see what you mean. There could be some kind of secret there, I'm really not sure. As I've said, he claims that things have just been too emotional/weird around the SM issue, and that my "vibe" is no longer good because he can tell I'm uninterested. So he doesn't initiate that much. I guess I can't say that some of that isn't valid, right? I mean, if something is talked about all the time, it becomes a big deal. But how could I not talk about it? He did have 5-6 years to figure it out, especially in the beginning when it was a fairly non-emotional issue. And if he would have even put forth more EFFORT, I would've been happier. I was always the one to suggest/find counselors, bring up the conversations, read books/online forums, voice unhappiness, etc. So even if he feels bad about the situation, as he claims to, what has he done to help it? I have never once seen him do that, which kind of speaks volumes. What he did: He refused you, chronically, from the early days of the marriage. After he got you to the point of counter-refusing, after YEARS of sexual neglect, he now can blame YOU for the problem. If you don't believe me than answer this simple question: What was his excuse in the earliest sexless years? I'll bet he had none. But you answer; its your marriage. I happened to have gone through this EXACTLY. |
|
|
|
Post by eternaloptimism on Dec 1, 2016 13:58:53 GMT -5
Hiya joy6016. Welcome to the nuthouse! Happy to have you on board. You hav come a long way from the nativity and manipulation by seeking this place out. I'm pretty sure soon you'll see that you have gone above and beyond what a lot of humans would do to save your relationship. DO NOT EVER feel this is your fault. Get your head on straight, and sort it out. While you are still so young. DO NOT SETTLE FOR THIS. you so deserve more. The journey has commenced. Let us all help you find your way. Lots of love xxx |
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 14:00:00 GMT -5
cagedtiger - Really good question on the friendship. He also says he could never be my friend because there would be feelings that keep coming up. We have 2 dogs, and I'm unsure of how that would play out (we're both close to them), so it might involve us still being in each other's lives for that. I would actually like to be friends after the dust settles, because like you said, we're basically already there now. We wouldn't have the day-to-day relationship anymore, but I think it would be nice to be able to have a friendship post-split.
My support network is strong, but sadly, most of it is not local to me. I know that I would want to get out a lot more and build social connections. My husband is not social, so we never fostered that too much. I have some friends that often want to do stuff, so I would be more able to reach out to them if I were single. My parents support whatever I want to do, but I can't and haven't told them the full extent of the issue. It's just too weird and embarrassing. They know there are issues, but they think that it's more about walls/emotional stuff. And while that's valid and probably also true, the SM is a different beast, I believe. They just can't understand it.
|
|
|
|
Post by eternaloptimism on Dec 1, 2016 14:00:43 GMT -5
Not nativity...my auto correct must be on festive setting ...happy December! Naivety was what I meant 🙈
|
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 14:02:22 GMT -5
beachguy - Good point. I do feel that he tries to put it on me, or always say "I see it's all my fault" and get defensive. Well, it's not, but when you're the only one who seems to be trying, it sure feels like it's all his fault. He didn't have an excuse early on, you're right. He would just get upset and cry and vow to change back then. Regardless, it's hard to leave an otherwise good person. I always assumed splitting would involve something "worse"...
|
|
|
|
Post by joy6016 on Dec 1, 2016 14:04:29 GMT -5
Thank you, eternaloptimism! I appreciate your kind words. I don't want to settle for this and by being here, I'm definitely towards the end of my rope and he knows it. What do you mean by naivety and manipulation?
Thank you for helping me to find my way. The help from you all in just a few hours has been amazing! It's not support that I can really get from people who a) haven't been through this, b) are my parents and it's weird. I feel some fault for not being able to be stronger or something. It's weird but I'm working through those feelings. Thank you again. <3
|
|
|
|
Post by eternaloptimism on Dec 1, 2016 14:05:17 GMT -5
beachguy - Good point. I do feel that he tries to put it on me, or always say "I see it's all my fault" and get defensive. Well, it's not, but when you're the only one who seems to be trying, it sure feels like it's all his fault. He didn't have an excuse early on, you're right. He would just get upset and cry and vow to change back then. Regardless, it's hard to leave an otherwise good person. I always assumed splitting would involve something "worse"... Oooooo. Careful joy. This waiting for a specific type of event to kickstart the dumping process has kept me stuck for 17 years. X |
|
I know that doesn't make much sense. Again, the problem there is my dwindling romantic feelings towards him at all. Part of me wishes he would just end it and let me go..
