blue
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Post by blue on Sept 23, 2020 21:42:56 GMT -5
Hi I’m new here and posted over at introduce yourself and my new friends, lol thought I’d be better served over here so here it goes. I’m not interested in sex with my husband; although I do want sex in general(I’m pretty close to having a full blown affair and I feel like a horrible wife and person for this; more on this later) and he’s really not interested in sex in general or so it seems. I am sure he masturbates though. Mirrorchild was kind enough to make a list for me as to reasons why pulled from my introduction. I guess on my part it’s the following, not attracted to him because: overweight, hygiene issues, lazy-mostly plays video games or surfs internet for hours and hours or sleeps( I feel Pretty alone At times) sometimes he’s very negative-not pleasant to be around, lots of whining and griping about the world-which yeah I know sucks right now, but I don’t need to be reminded. I think he needs friends or therapist to vent to.
On his side from what I’ve heard is that I’m cold, selfish, and not nurturing.My mom was not super touchy freely, but showed us she loved us in other ways So, these are all probably true. In some ways I’m kind of like the man in the relationship, kind of primal with sex. He says I’m broken- maybe I don’t know. He’s more needing touching all day long, but we go back to square one because I’m not interested. I know what my issues are. I just don’t know how to fix them. It’s a vicious messed up cycle of all kinds of f’ed up.
On other fronts though I have a full life. Two decent kids that are from my first marriage and grown. A pretty good and fulfilling career. I have a social circle of friends to hang out with. I’m also pretty involved with our local city and county government and even helping with some campaigning and canvassing. I have hobbies. We have a cute house and dogs(we both love) but then there’s the huge black hole in my life that would obliterate it all if I left and then as a Christian the separation I now feel from God for doing the unthinkable. I know not everyone believes it but I feel it and it’s been tearing me apart inside, yet here I am.
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blue
New Member
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Post by blue on Sept 23, 2020 22:13:03 GMT -5
Lol, know thy audience#1, an affair. #2 is a close runner up.
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Post by saarinista on Sept 23, 2020 23:15:39 GMT -5
blue please don't beat yourself up. Frankly it sounds to me like your husband is depressed or something. Didn't you mention that he has medical issues and he took early retirement? If so, that's pretty unhealthy. Any chance of getting him into therapy? And maybe off to the doctor for some blood work, and as you mentioned, encouraging him to get a "fun" job? I'm not surprised at all that you're thinking of having an affair under the circumstances. As you probably know they are a hassle and often problematic, but don't castigate yourself for thinking of having one.
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Post by DryCreek on Sept 23, 2020 23:24:24 GMT -5
Welcome, blue. A popular term in another forum is “low libido for you”, with the underlying point that it doesn’t matter if someone is low or high libido - what matters is that they’re low libido for their partner. That person’s not broken, but the chemistry between two specific people isn’t there; they might still be a very sexual person in a different context, and that’s not wrong. Likewise with personality, style, or even sexual drive. E.g., it’s totally possible for two people who don’t like sex to pair up and live happily. It’s when there’s a mismatch that’s like sand in the gearbox. Getting to a point here... the traits you describe for yourself aren’t bad just because they’re atypical - unless you’re poorly matched with someone who needs what you can’t / don’t instinctively give, which sounds like part of the dynamic here. You could try to adapt, but that’s not always the answer - could you be happy if you did? (Is that within the realm of possibility, and would you be motivated to? Or would it be unpleasant and forced?) We hear the phrase “new normal” a lot these days, but it’s something we’ve seen here for a long time. When refusing partners slip into bad habits, and then those of us here are often too tolerant for too long, then those habits are allowed to become their new normal. It becomes an uphill battle to motivate change because you’ve accepted it for so long, like a sapling that has grown into a huge oak tree. And you can’t really motivate his change - he has to find his own motivation. Conversely, something you’re experiencing also happens... they refuse long enough that we become reprogrammed to not see them as a sexual partner; they don’t turn us on, and we might not even understand why. It’s part conditioning, and part defense mechanism to avoid the pain of refusal. This is also hard to come back from, but it can happen and it’s within your control. If I may ask... why did your first marriage end, and are you seeing any common threads here? |
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blue
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Post by blue on Sept 23, 2020 23:41:52 GMT -5
Saarinista and Drycreek,
Thanks for the insights. He’s had bloodwork done and it was all pretty normal. Recently we talked about seeing a therapist or counselor and he’s not interested. He said I need it l0l I get what you’re saying about the new normal. It all seems so monumental and yes forced at this point to make anything happen on either end,
As for my first husband, we were young. I was 15 and he 16 when we met and he just couldn’t stay faithful. He was a serial cheater. Now looking back maybe I had a part to play, as we all do but I hear now he’s on wife #3 and has cheated and got caught rather recently. He was also really controlling to the point where he micromanaged me, so of course I looked for someone who had neither of those qualities.
I really hate this living in limbo thing.
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Post by baza on Sept 24, 2020 2:24:35 GMT -5
I think you need an alternative Sister blue. These assorted behaviours of his are NOT things over which you have any control. And these behaviours have been in situ for quite some time - enough time to get fully entrenched. And there appears to be no evidence that he even thinks his behaviours are a problem, and likewise there's no evidence that he wants to change his behaviours. All of which leaves you in a disenfranchised position, and it's hard to see the situation changing - based solely on what you've divulged. Might be time to explore your alternatives. |
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Post by jerri on Sept 24, 2020 3:02:49 GMT -5
Hi I’m new here and posted over at introduce yourself and my new friends, lol thought I’d be better served over here so here it goes. I’m not interested in sex with my husband; although I do want sex in general(I’m pretty close to having a full blown affair and I feel like a horrible wife and person for this; more on this later) and he’s really not interested in sex in general or so it seems. I am sure he masturbates though. Mirrorchild was kind enough to make a list for me as to reasons why pulled from my introduction. I guess on my part it’s the following, not attracted to him because: overweight, hygiene issues, lazy-mostly plays video games or surfs internet for hours and hours or sleeps( I feel Pretty alone At times) sometimes he’s very negative-not pleasant to be around, lots of whining and griping about the world-which yeah I know sucks right now, but I don’t need to be reminded. I think he needs friends or therapist to vent to. On his side from what I’ve heard is that I’m cold, selfish, and not nurturing.My mom was not super touchy freely, but showed us she loved us in other ways So, these are all probably true. In some ways I’m kind of like the man in the relationship, kind of primal with sex. He says I’m broken- maybe I don’t know. He’s more needing touching all day long, but we go back to square one because I’m not interested. I know what my issues are. I just don’t know how to fix them. It’s a vicious messed up cycle of all kinds of f’ed up. On other fronts though I have a full life. Two decent kids that are from my first marriage and grown. A pretty good and fulfilling career. I have a social circle of friends to hang out with. I’m also pretty involved with our local city and county government and even helping with some campaigning and canvassing. I have hobbies. We have a cute house and dogs(we both love) but then there’s the huge black hole in my life that would obliterate it all if I left and then as a Christian the separation I now feel from God for doing the unthinkable. I know not everyone believes it but I feel it and it’s been tearing me apart inside, yet here I am. Was the sex ever good? Why hide your affair? Why not tell him that you are challenged by some issues and you are opening the marriage. (Refer to resources on how to open a marrige pdf) What if he was able to make choices for himself just as you have? What if he was given the chance to be on the same level and find a delicious, sweet woman who would touch him in more ways than one. 💋 Someone who was warm, giving, and nurturing who loves touch as much as he does. (You said he constantly needs touch.I was starving for touch because sex was how I received my loving touch from my DH) I am guessing that he could be sexually starved and needing someone's sweet lovin' and laughter. You spoke of guilt a couple of times in your writing. Guilt is not always bad, it tells us that what we are planning/have done, may not be such a great idea. I didn't do it right, but what if you invited him to therapy to inform him if your choice? If one chooses to have an affair instead, don't ever tell him/her. Why? Because that burden is yours to carry, not theirs. Please don't all of the sudden think it's time to be honest, take it to your therapist or grave. Do you tell him you are no longer into him? That he's overweight? Games too much and isss gamey to boot? I hope not. See, the first thing we think when we don't get intimacy is, I wish I was better looking, do I smell? And the list goes on and on... I became obsessed with my looks and my sex techniques. Getting a Ninja tight pu$$y! Getting rid of weight and cellulite. I waited over a decade to inform, not ask, that I would be stepping out of the marrige for sex. Did I do it correctly? No, I did not! I did it and then I went to therapy to try and clean up my mess. Take what you like and leave the rest. Maybe it will help someone, someday?. |
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Post by mirrororchid on Sept 24, 2020 6:07:50 GMT -5
there’s the huge black hole in my life that would obliterate it all if I left and then as a Christian the separation I now feel from God for doing the unthinkable. I know not everyone believes it but I feel it and it’s been tearing me apart inside, yet here I am.
The "black hole". This is your need for more physical connection? Emotional connection? Both? Maybe it's unclear to you? A mysterious need you can't identify? What is it not everyone believes? In God? Your connection to Him? That physical needs are a real thing? That those needs are worthy of "obliterating" everything else? That divorce displeases God and causes distance? Then, on a subsequent post: "I really hate this living in limbo thing."
Limbo of inadequate sex and trying to make more happen? Or the stay/cheat/leave decision? Or a third thing?
Sept 24, 2020 4:02:49 GMT -4 jerri said: (Refer to resources on how to open a marriage pdf) I think this is the resource she's referring to, right, Jerri? www.practicalpolyamory.com/images/14_steps_to_opening_a_relationship.pdf |
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Post by worksforme2 on Sept 24, 2020 11:33:52 GMT -5
Welcome again blue.
Your situation voices many of the same traits seen in other SM found here. A spouse that exhibits a # of behaviors that adversely affect the marriage and your relationship. You have gotten some fairly good responses so far and as the community here and perhaps you yourself learn and understand more about the dysfunctional aspects of your marriage the comments and the advice will probably get more specific.
You may have already read or figured out for yourself that there are basically 3 paths in a SM. Stay and continue the status quo. Cheat (an affair) or some other means of opening up the marriage to intimacy outside the current boundaries or Leave. There are some slight variations within these options but basically it's these 3.
I have a couple questions. How long have you been married? How long has the relationship been basically sexless? You have probably had several talks with your spouse about the problems in the marriage as you see them. Have you made it clear to him how damaging his actions or lack of actions are to the marriage and to you? Does he give you a reason(s) why counseling is off the table? What does he offer as an approach to meeting your needs and the needs of the marriage?
If you are close to a full blown affair I read that as you might already be in an emotional or online affair and are considering taking the next step. Or perhaps you are considering a work colleague that you have opened up to and found them to be receptive to the idea of a sexual relationship with you. What ever the current status of that thought it goes without saying that introducing another person into an already dysfunctional situation brings with them a whole new box of potential hand grenades. I am not commentating on the right or wrong of it, just the potential for things to go in a direction entirely unexpected.
If you know you have issues and you are open to doing the work needed to address those issues, perhaps some time spent in individual therapy might go a long ways in equipping you with some tools or techniques to deal with them. It could help you be a better person going forward.
I agree the living in limbo thing is a drag. But changing that dynamic requires some sort of action or intervening factor to change it. One of the questions for you is have you reached the point where you are prepared to initiate that action or if having weighted the potential result, you have decided to let the pot boil for a while longer.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2020 13:45:31 GMT -5
You'll get lots of advice here, most of it very well thought out and full of real world experience and lots of research (also known as "why chasing"). Your situation might be at least a little unique in that your desire remains and there are specific reasons why it left (for your spouse) that you are in touch with. You're on both sides of the SM as it were. Many of us here know that our spouse lost desire but don't know why. Was it ever there? Have I changed? Am I just a bad person?
Best of luck.
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blue
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Post by blue on Sept 24, 2020 17:29:51 GMT -5
Wow, all of you have given me so much to ponder. Jerri, the sex has never been mind blowing. It was good in the first year or so, and then it dwindled pretty quickly and we had teenagers, careers, school etc. that kind of took over. He also was addicted to porn I think for lots of years that he admitted to then now says he’s since stopped. I think that really damaged our relationship. We had a brief stint that was really good a couple years ago and then it was interrupted and it never came back. He was always good to me in other ways and that filled the gap,I guess. We’ve been together 23 years this October. Neither of us have ever been open to an open marriage so that’s not an option and I’ve steered clear of saying hurtful things to him, because I don’t want to regret that, but I know not talking is probably hurtful also.
Mirrorchild that Black hole is the part of my life that outsiders don’t see but it’s the missing piece that I feel would give me joy and make our life more meaningful, if I could figure out how. I feel like the connection is both emotional and physical. I think that if I cheat or get a divorce that it will sever my relationship with God, we’ll I’m already there, I suppose. Of course like many people probably I think of how it will explode everywhere, my kids who see him as stepdad, friends, the house, dogs, in-laws, the list goes on and on. For me the limbo, is wtf am I doing? I feel like morally I only have to options stay and try to fix it or leave.
Worksforme2, It’s been a long time since I’ve initiated sex but he used to say he didn’t feel good, or he ate to much, he needs to take a shower-that one gets an eye roll from me. I get the feeling if I initiated enough he wouldn’t always have an excuse; however, it happens enough times that I get irritated and then if it’s been a while he has problems and it’s not fun for me; I’ll stop it there. So It’s a vicious cycle because we do it, I get disappointed, he gets frustrated and it doesn’t happen again for months.
I feel like my next step is probably therapy and at the very least at least I can find out how and why I’m so messed up, lol or maybe think about what I can do on my side.
Thank you all for the patient and wise words.
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blue
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Posts: 9
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Post by blue on Sept 24, 2020 21:32:31 GMT -5
Thank you.
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Post by baza on Sept 25, 2020 1:42:38 GMT -5
This idea of individual therapy and sorting your own shit out is a good one - irrespective of what your marriage is like - Sister blue . It gives you the best possible chance of bringing the best possible version of blue into the picture. And, from that position you'll be able to handle whatever comes up. If you sort your own shit out, chances are that you'll then be able to bring your ILIASM deal to resolution. |
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Post by mirrororchid on Sept 25, 2020 4:37:18 GMT -5
He also was addicted to porn I think for lots of years that he admitted to then now says he’s since stopped.
Mmm hmm. Okay. We have a few ladies here who have had "pornsexual" husbands. If he hasn't stopped, it may help to stop two or three days before a date with you. It may help with the performance issues (perhaps a bit too much if he's done too soon in which case gauging how ready he should be might be explored.) ...We had a brief stint that was really good a couple years ago and then it was interrupted and it never came back.
Despite the kids and such? That'd be an interesting avenue to determine what made it good and can a similar stint be introduced. It could be a positive approach to getting a physical relationship resumed. ...Neither of us have ever been open to an open marriage so that’s not an option
If you stick around, you'll see my curiosity over society's embrace of divorce over open marriage here and there in the forums. Mirrorchild that Black hole is the part of my life that outsiders don’t see but it’s the missing piece that I feel would give me joy and make our life more meaningful, if I could figure out how.
Is the black hole encompassing more than the relationship? You mention a comfortable life (job, kids), perhaps a lack of excitement and novelty is part of it and the affair is an enticing, enormous opportunity for novelty and in that is some of its appeal, diminished if novelty is introduced otherwise? ...if I cheat or get a divorce that it will sever my relationship with God, we’ll I’m already there, I suppose.
It sounds a bit harsh. How I'd respond to that would depend on your faith. Christian? Jewish? Muslim? csl is a devoted Christian (Protestant, I think). He'd have a plethora of resources to suggest, I suspect. I'm more of a Yahvist philosopher with affinity for the carpenter from Nazareth, not fitting any category neatly. ... the limbo, is wtf am I doing? I feel like morally I only have to options stay and try to fix it or leave.
If I'm not misreading you, given what I think you've said is a consequence of divorce, you may be giving yourself only one moral option. Not to say divorce is immoral. Only that it seems you think it is. I'd ask what makes divorce immoral? Compare it to what would make opening the marriage immoral. You may find other people's sense of morality is the same as your own, a hard look at whether that's necessary or suitable may be of use. (Societal views of what's moral affect us profoundly, so agreeing with them or pretending to, deliberately, is understandable.) |
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Post by csl on Sept 25, 2020 20:38:39 GMT -5
On other fronts though I have a full life. Two decent kids that are from my first marriage and grown. A pretty good and fulfilling career. I have a social circle of friends to hang out with. I’m also pretty involved with our local city and county government and even helping with some campaigning and canvassing. I have hobbies. We have a cute house and dogs(we both love) but then there’s the huge black hole in my life that would obliterate it all if I left and then as a Christian the separation I now feel from God for doing the unthinkable. I know not everyone believes it but I feel it and it’s been tearing me apart inside, yet here I am. Please go to my blog and look for my different series on Covenant, on Scarlet Letter, and on Balance. Use the search option available in the sidebar to find and read those series. Next week, I am putting up a free .pdf that can be downloaded, that deals with christian misunderstanding on divorce. |
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