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Post by sadkat on Jul 6, 2019 21:10:55 GMT -5
Well, notdeadyet- my comment was intended to be transparent and I’ll agree to disagree that it was juvenile. People who know me well will probably laugh at the thought that I was dodging an issue. My thoughts- good relationships don’t do power struggles. Instead, there’s a lot of give and take. Compromise and seeking to understand are key. All of these involve a lot of humility and willingness to communicate. Seeking to be in control of another person is a relationship killer. Look at the way you handled my comment. Compare it to the way TheGreatContender -aka Daddeeo disagreed with me. Do you see a difference? He was respectful and honest with his comments which elicited more communication from me. I totally got (and respected) what he disagreed with. A key point is that he didn’t try to change my mind- he simply stated his position in a way that I was able to understand. Your comment sought to put me down first and then demand that I “explain myself”. It didn’t feel good and would normally have stopped communication with both parties feeling resentful and angry. I recently had an awesome experience with a good friend that underscores the value of good communication. Believe me when I tell you that I threw out a lot of comments that I probably shouldn’t have. Those were handled with respect and humility while at the same time making me clearly understand the opposite point of view. I learned a valuable lesson about how good a relationship can be if both parties are willing to be open and honest with one another. Having the courage to be vulnerable is key. I don’t know if I answered your question but I’ve strived to give you a picture of what I believe a good relationship should be like. I don’t see it having anything to do with women these days wanting to be more in control.
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Post by deadzone75 on Jul 7, 2019 13:39:09 GMT -5
@whynotm3 , I’ll offer a slightly different spin... All marriages are flawed. We all have negative traits - things we do or don’t do; it’s a question of how easily those can be overlooked / tolerated / compensated for elsewhere. Intimacy goes a long way toward greasing the skids of marriage - helping us see the positives and overlook the negatives. Intimacy might wane on its own, or maybe it gets snuffed by some extra bad behavior. Either way, when the balance gets tipped, our attitude sours and those traits become less tolerable. It’s easy to become a death spiral, because who wants intimacy when you’re angry? (Perhaps this is where angry / makeup sex plays a valuable role?) In your case, you’ve got an extra drain on the intimacy side of the balance. H is choosing to give intimacy to other partners while you aren’t getting enough. His priorities are in the wrong place; even if his behavior hasn’t changed otherwise, that’s going to cause problems. That’s like going on a cruise while you skip mortgage payments. Bottom-line: His lifestyle should be a supplement to a healthy marriage; it sounds like he’s letting it become a substitute. I agree 100%. All marriages are flawed. But the intimacy masks a LOT of negativity. From big fights to small annoying habits, these can all stand out more than they should when you have no sex. It's easy to think, why should I work to resolve this argument, or why do I put up with this annoying habit? What is the payoff? I'm sure it's not good to think about a marriage in terms of "payoff", but when you subtract intimacy from it, what really is the point?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 17:22:34 GMT -5
I don't think you can generalize the "what came first" but I do know that the dwindling sex (whatever the cause) between mismatched partners often sets up a long-term negative feedback loop that grows. Less sex - resentment - worse marriage due to resentment - rinse/repeat. However, I also think that the SM also misses out on shared way heal and find a happy place again. I'm sure there are suitable substitutes for that trust/Love you too hon to happen outside of the bedroom but we never found it.
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Post by paddlingalone on Jul 9, 2019 11:36:13 GMT -5
Been away a while, focusing on my kids and marriage. All seemed to be taking a good turn for the better, but we always end up back where we started. Here's one thing I've discovered over the past several months of work and self-discovery (and many of you have already come to this realization), that is sex (or lack thereof) really is a symptom of a bigger/different problem. More sex won't fix whatever else is broken in the marriage. Try as you might, the facts are the facts. My advice for anyone who cares, look outside the circle of your bedroom. Somewhere therein the problem lies. Not ready to call it quits, but definitely finally see sex isn't the answer ... at least for me. I do think this is correct. In healthy relationships, if there's a sexual problem usually the partners will be interested in resolving it, especially if one has admitted it's causing them distress. We have situations where we express discontent to our spouses, and our spouses do nothing. I'm not sure if the underlying problem is lack of empathy, or lack of sexual compatibility. I try to to see it from his point of view -- how would I feel if my spouse wanted me to desire something I just didn't want, and was asking me to see a doctor on top of it when I otherwise felt perfectly fine? Here's the axis where change either happens or does not happen -- even if I didn't have much libido, I think I'd have enough empathy for my spouse to take their concerns seriously and at least investigate, even if I didn't really view myself as having a problem. I'd acknowledge the marriage has a problem, and I'd act on that and we'd go from there. I think I'd also have enough common sense to know that most people want regular sex, even if I didn't. This has been especially hurtful to me as I've realized this. Lack of sexual release is one thing, but realizing your spouse doesn't care about you or the marriage is very depressing. I think our spouses also know many of us are "stuck" to an extent so they become complacent. Let's be honest -- if we were all in casual dating situations with no strings attached, we'd be gone a long time ago. But our situations are complicated and many of us are entrenched. Hence the phenomenon of the long-term sexless marriage. In my situation I feel like all my husband needs me for is taking care of the house and the kids. I have very few bargaining chips. I think I married a man who is hormonally asexual but wanted kids and didn't really care about me from the outset. Now he's got what he wanted plus a wife to take care of our children and his needs. I brought up the subject of his Low T and treatment recently, and he seemed somewhat open-minded to seeing a specialist. We are switching medical coverages right now so he can't act on it presently, but once he can it will be interesting to see if he does. I recently told him if we continue to have a sexless marriage for no good reason, I will be taking off my ring, because I don't feel like a wife. I feel like a domestic helper. He used to like to cuddle with me at times, but he has stopped asking for that. Spends most of his time on his computer now, while I putter around the house. Not sure what's happening, but it doesn't feel good.
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Post by ironhamster on Jul 10, 2019 2:05:16 GMT -5
My condolences, paddlingalone, and welcome to the forum. Keep in mind, about the only leverage you have is your credibility. If you set conditions for keeping your ring on, and those conditions are not met, you must take it off or he will not listen to the next consequence.
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Post by Apocrypha on Aug 2, 2019 16:20:29 GMT -5
Been away a while, focusing on my kids and marriage. All seemed to be taking a good turn for the better, but we always end up back where we started. Here's one thing I've discovered over the past several months of work and self-discovery (and many of you have already come to this realization), that is sex (or lack thereof) really is a symptom of a bigger/different problem. More sex won't fix whatever else is broken in the marriage. Try as you might, the facts are the facts. My advice for anyone who cares, look outside the circle of your bedroom. Somewhere therein the problem lies. Not ready to call it quits, but definitely finally see sex isn't the answer ... at least for me. I am inclined to agree. Looking upstream from the result - which is an aversion to sex with your marital partner - there is a cause of that. That reason is so compelling that the aversion overrides someone's natural libido (which remains unsatisfied for both partners) and puts your whole lifestyle at risk. Those are high stakes, so it's not mere indifference. Having dated many divorcees at this point, I've found a fairly common theme in those that ended in a celibate deal. That is - usually going way back in the marriage, sometimes even to before the marriage - something happened that changed the way they thought about their partner and it was never brought up or resolved. Or, they agreed to marry when they really didn't want to, and so felt trapped. Note, in either of those cases, there doesn't appear to be anything anyone can do to change the feeling. The result of that feeling may be complicated. It could possibly be mixed with love - is possible to love all kinds of people who we don't want to sleep with - but one thing remains clear: they don't desire their partner (though they might squeak out a root if they get desperate or horny enough and they can block their partner out). So, ya. The lack of sex is evident that your partner views you as a person they wouldn't want to have sex with, despite whatever other benefits are genuinely enjoyed by the relationship. And, the more you focus on the sex as an issue, the more it detracts from the other benefits.
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