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Post by greatcoastal on May 26, 2019 15:03:29 GMT -5
For now there are 4 issues.
1) Paying for and supplying all the food and drink ( they raid and empty my pantry, freezer and fridge in one night!)  2) Leaving a disaster of a mess in a freshly cleaned house.  3) last minute planning, no warning, and zero communication.  4) The alcohol. I had one bottle of champagne given to me as a housewarming gift. it was being saved for a possible special occasion. I found it open and mostly gone. My teen (and his friends, I am guessing, are under 21) I want no drinking going on in my house. This has been stated before. The other side of this 'predicament' is that my teens have rarely ever had friends over the house. This was something we ( me and my now ex) encouraged for years, but rarely happened. ( mostly because we did not allow our kids to have adult rated video games) So what is it like to be the host house for older teens who constantly want their friends over? What kind of boundaries do you set? And what has it been like enforcing it? Do you end up being labeled as mad and angry? My background, and upbringing was by parents who always offered my friends drinks and snacks, and /or a place at the dinner table when they came over. A large part of me wants to do the same. However ,I do plan food and drinks for the family, and do not appreciate days worth of meals being handed out to several others without my consent. And having my teens appetite suddenly triple and him thinking anything ,anywhere is all his for the taking. My son has been unemployed recently, due to mental issues beyond his control, and is back to living with me. I don't mind taking care of him and helping him out, but when it comes to the food, and cleaning up after yourself, we have a problem.  This from the same young man who is used to restaurant work which means lots of cleaning!! Thanks for the questions and the venting  |
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Post by northstarmom on May 26, 2019 15:31:40 GMT -5
It's best to lock up and hide the alcohol before hosting teen parties.
Your son should clean up before and after his parties or not be allowed to host the parties.
Being labeled angry is better than allowing a teen to grow up irresponsible and doing things that could endanger themselves and others.
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Post by sadkat on May 26, 2019 17:29:56 GMT -5
An honest and firm discussion with your son is probably in order. Lay out the ground rules once more and explain the reasons behind them. Underage drinking is a big issue and, if you are not into alcohol, I would consider removing it completely from the house. If you do like to consume alcohol on occasion, locking it up is a good idea. Expectations about cleaning up after oneself are essential. That’s a hot button of mine and I’ve been known to turn into a real witch if I find a mess- especially in the kitchen. My son tended to know my boundaries and was usually respectful of them.
As for raiding the pantry, I was actually ok with that. I enjoyed having the boys at my house and they knew they could have what they wanted out of the pantry. I just kept it stocked. My son had one friend who’s mom was very into health food. She apparently had no junk food whatsoever at her home. That boy would come to my house just to raid the pantry for junk food! I thought it was pretty funny! That being said, the guys only congregated at our house about once every 2 weeks or so ( more in the summer) so the financial burden wasn’t great. I would have to rethink things if the cost of replacing food was hurting my budget.
Good luck with this- raising teenagers can be challenging!
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Post by DryCreek on May 26, 2019 18:39:16 GMT -5
If you can afford it, try to indulge it. But... you’re responsible for what happens in your home, and that includes drugs and alcohol they bring in. While I might be lax with my own kids experimenting at home, no way would I facilitate others; I value life outside bars, and lawsuits & civil asset forfeiture by police are far too common.
If you’re clear with the ground rules, there should be no shock when your anger is earned. E.g., it might be one thing to raid the pantry, and another to vacuum up prepared dishes for the week. And cleaning up before & after should be a basic requirement - take pride in presenting a nice space, and leave it as you found it.
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Post by northstarmom on May 26, 2019 20:46:09 GMT -5
GC said: "last minute planning, no warning, and zero communication. "
This would not be acceptable. I understand how people devise plans at the last minute, but your son should call or e-mail you to find out if what he's planning is OK. Good guideline for him to follow as he'd be expected to do the same with roommates or a romantic partner he was sharing a home with.
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Post by hopingforachange on May 26, 2019 21:05:07 GMT -5
Sounds like you needed to have all of them back over to clean your house from top to bottom or your telling the parents about them getting into the alcohol.
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Post by sadkat on May 26, 2019 21:34:58 GMT -5
To add onto what NSM said- we had one rule for bringing guests into the house- he couldn’t do it unless one of us was home. He tried breaking the rule (with his girlfriend 😂) and got caught by his dad when he got home from work earlier than expected. Thankfully, the two were fully clothed! Both were given a very firm lecture. To the point that the girlfriend was told that she would no longer be welcome in our home if she didn’t follow the rules. Just imagine two young teenagers sitting on a couch with a dad standing in front of them giving a lengthy lecture (a very persuasive one at that). It made an impression- it didn’t happen again (that we know of). H may not have been a great husband but he was one heck of a dad!
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Post by greatcoastal on Jun 30, 2019 14:54:18 GMT -5
A brief update.
I came home on a Sat.- June 15th- around 7:00pm. My 18 yr old son had 4 male friends in the driveway. My son said to me " dad, is it ok if my friends are here?"
I said , " sure" and was introduce to his 'friends' whom I'd never seen before. Then a teenage girl came walking down the street and came into the driveway and the house.
By 8:00 the number grew from 5 to 8 people. Then 12, then 16, and so on.
My girlfriend and I sat outside to watch all the cars starting to arrive. With it came 3 to 4 teens per car with some carrying a case of beer!
My son came up to me twice and said " I'm sorry dad, I don't know any of these people".
I told my son " by 10;30 you will be telling them to leave. I am going to bed at 11;00!"
That plan changed to 9:30 when the cars kept coming. One phone call to the Sheriff ended the party. it was like turning on a light and watching the cockroaches scatter.
They bent my fence and the deck collapsed.
I told my son" Be thankful that nothing was stolen , no one was arrested ( including me and you) it's over, You need to tell anyone else who arrives to go home there's no party, it's over.
Most of it went well, however... my son had one friend arrive who he insisted on allowing in the house, against everything that I had sternly, loudly, angrily, forcefully, told this boy!
The only thing I asked of my son was to call it a day and go to bed at 11;00pm. That I would be locking all the doors, I had to go to work the next morning. He had a choice. A pretty simple one in my opinion.
He chose to lie, and leave the house. ( fortunately he was not driving his car) He got arrested at 4;00am .
he has 5 charges against him. This is all new ground for me.
I have not been allowed to get him his medications ( bipolar) or speak to him. Going on 3 weeks now. I will be the one paying to get him an attorney. His mother (my ex) has done zero for him. I later found out that the entire family has been kept in the dark about it. I find this to be unacceptable. More manipulative controlling.
Another side to this is, how similar my story is compared to a tenant of mine. His daughter had 3 friends over, and the numbers grew to 150! He was out of town. Fortunately he knows many of the local police ( Marine friends of his) No one arrested, just bags of beer and cups to throw away !
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Post by DryCreek on Jun 30, 2019 15:25:44 GMT -5
They bent my fence and the deck collapsed. ... He got arrested at 4;00am . he has 5 charges against him. This is all new ground for me. ... I will be the one paying to get him an attorney. His mother (my ex) has done zero for him. I later found out that the entire family has been kept in the dark about it. Wow. Some random feedback... in hindsight, you probably should have shut things down before they got out of hand. Especially being on-site, I imagine you might have been charged with aiding and abetting underage drinking; this was not subtle. And you’re lucky nobody got hurt when the deck collapsed; that’d tee you up for medical bills and lawsuits. 5 charges is not trivial. He got himself in deep. It’s not clear why you aren’t able to get his medication to him, but it’s surely not legal for prescribed medications from being withheld from him if he’s still in custody. You should think hard about paying for his attorney, or even posting bail with your assets as collateral if it’s a significant amount. Your income as a truck driver doesn’t begin to cover the cost of lawyers; if anything, your ex is the one with resources. Your son’s an adult and his actions have consequences; you can’t save him forever; he can get a public defender assigned. Perhaps flashjohn can weigh in here with an opinion as well. As for secrecy, I have a mixed opinion. One one hand, it’s nobody’s business what the details of his offenses are unless he chooses to share with them or they’re public knowledge; he’s entitled to his privacy. On the other, it’s reasonable that the family knows that he’s gotten into trouble with the law and will be working through some things. |
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Post by hopingforachange on Jun 30, 2019 17:48:40 GMT -5
greatcoastal I believe you live in a state where all you need to look up court documents and cases is the person's full name, so he won't be able to hide anything from the family. This will definitely be one of those times where he will either learn and grow up, or you will find out how much he needs to grow up.
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Post by hopingforachange on Jun 30, 2019 17:50:02 GMT -5
If he's still incarcerated by the state, then they should be providing him with the medication.
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Post by baza on Jun 30, 2019 23:18:56 GMT -5
So the bit where you had a modicum of control (the end of festivities) you controlled .... in a sensible manner. What happened then (the continuation of the shenanigans elsewhere with your kid as one of the leading players) you had no control over. I am inclined to the same view as hopingforachange - "This will definitely be one of those times where he will either learn and grow up, or you will find out how much he needs to grow up". It would be smart for your kid to consult a lawyer in your jurisdiction about these goings on - it would likewise be smart for you to accompany him on said consultation too, just so you are up to speed. What further involvement you want to have apart from that is at your discretion. The temptation for you to provide a bail-out will likely be overwhelming, but that might not be in the kids longer term best interests. Difficult position you are in here Brother greatcoastal . |
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Post by flashjohn on Jul 1, 2019 10:43:25 GMT -5
He chose to lie, and leave the house. ( fortunately he was not driving his car) He got arrested at 4;00am . he has 5 charges against him. This is all new ground for me. I have not been allowed to get him his medications ( bipolar) or speak to him. Going on 3 weeks now. I will be the one paying to get him an attorney. His mother (my ex) has done zero for him. Not sure how things work in your jurisdiction, but here, the only way you would not be allowed to visit him would be if you are NOT listed on his approved visitors list. If he has 5 charges, you need to find out what they are and get him a lawyer asap. He is probably not eligible for a court appointed lawyer because most jurisdictions consider the entire household income. So find a lawyer asap and see if you can get him bonded out. I really don't recommend leaving an 18 year old kid in jail long term. There are hardened criminals in there who could eat him alive. Let the lawyer guide you. Your best choice is a lawyer who used to be a prosecutor in that jurisdiction. He/she can tell you how strong the cases are AND are usually still friends with the prosecutors and can get you the best deal.
No some general advice...
1. Your son is going to find any alcohol in your house. Get it out of your house asap. Tell him that alcohol is not allowed in your house under any circumstances, no matter who brings it.
2. Tell him he is NEVER allowed any friends in your house at a time. If kids hear that they are welcome in your house with alcohol, your house becomes the "party house," and more kids will show up. If he complains, tell him that you let him do this once and he betrayed your trust. Now he needs to try to regain your trust, but you have no idea how long it will take.
3. Be grateful you are not charged with providing alcohol to a minor. I know you didn't give them the alcohol, but you watched them bring it into your house and did nothing about it.
4. Tell your son that this is the ONE and ONLY time you will be bailing him out and paying for his attorney. Whatever it costs, tell him that he needs to get a job and start paying you back. Hopefully, he will get deferred adjudication and get the cases dismissed. But as long as he has free time, he is probably going to do this kind of thing again.
I know this sounds harsh, and you may think that the divorce has been hard on him, but the truth is that if he gets away with this with little or no consequences, he is probably going to do something like this again.
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Post by northstarmom on Jul 1, 2019 12:58:39 GMT -5
Everyone I know who has more than one offspring has had some major legal problem with one of their kids. This includes me. Most people however hide the info so others erroneously believe their kids are perfect.
When he was 20, my older son, then living 3,000 miles away after dropping out of college, became addicted to meth, lost his job, became homeless and delusional and ended up attempting to rob a deli (no weapon. He just said “Give me your money.”” Police come, tasedhim and took him to jail. Son later said he deliberately did something to get arrested because he was so paranoid he wanted to be locked up to prevent others from killing him.
FWIW while growing up, son had been so anti drugs that he thought that pot users should be jailed. He also had been nose to the grindstone worker at part time jobs he had in high school. He never partied. By his choice, he only worked and went to school.
Anyway, we did not bail him out but let a public defender handle it. We did tell the defender of son’s history of job and academic success. Son was in jail 5 months before his case went to court. He was offered prison or go to inpatient treatment at state expense, and if he got a job and had clean drug screens for 6 months after treatment, his record would be expunged.
Son fulfilled all requirements and even set a sales record in the marketing job he got. He is now 35, has had no further legal problems. He has been self supporting since getting out of jail. Only thing we did for him was give him a couple of hundred dollars to buy clothes so he could get a job.
I fully believe in setting boundaries and holding our kids responsible for their behavior. Btw a boundary we always had was kids couldn’t live with us rent free unless they were too ill to work or were fullltimev students. Unfortunately after that son dropped out of college and eventually lost the well paying full time job he’d gotten, he moved in with my childless SIL who — despite my then h and me- telling her to charge son rent, refused to do that. Son then took full advantage of that lak of boundaries.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jul 1, 2019 19:35:30 GMT -5
Thank you to everyone for your advice and concern!!
Where to start? In short my son "T" was one of the last people you'd expect to get in trouble. Mr hard worker, saved his money for his own car , got jobs for many of his friends, always made the varsity team on any sport he ever tried from the beginning, straight A's etc....
Then came his bipolar. That really did a 180 on him!
The difficult part is knowing how much leeway, sympathy, tolerance, the effect of medications, you give to a young man ,just turning 18 who is enduring all this? Many times ,I truly did not have the answers.
A friend did say to me, " he did make decisions. Wrong ones. He certainly had enough frame of mind to ignore the right things and choose the wrong ones".
let's not forget peer pressure.
yes it is annoying that I will be the one shelling out the cash for an attorney. I say that due to my ex's income being 700% more. (that is just more confirmation about her, and her issues)
My attorney had several comments and advice for me.
She did recommend getting him an attorney.
That a public defender would be practically worthless.
She had NEVER heard that someone could NOT be allowed their medication. ( I was told this by a bail bond agent)
His charges are Breach of peace, bribing an officer, assault on an officer, and resisting arrest. ( I still have no idea what went on that night)
My attorney said " these sound like trumped up charges. He was drunk and 18, you can get these dismissed. He's never been charged with anything ever before".
She also could not understand why I could not see him.
So now my son has 2 different trial dates. 2 different judges.
I did not spend the $2800 for his bail. ( part of me thought- his mother should be paying for this, and maybe staying in jail could be good for him. Although I felt tremendous guilt.) Sadly this came at such a wrong time for me. Money needed for hail damage to the house, repairs and upgrades to the rental properties, months of no rental income, my sons medical expenses, ( lots of thousands of dollars) just starting a new job, etc..
My ex's financial problems? None that I know of. She laid low the whole time. Avoiding all of it. Once again... it comes down to money.
Years later I plan to hold my head high, knowing that I did my part, and that money and time will not deter me from being there for people when they need it the most. Then comes also looking out for my own self. This lesson has not been forgotten!
Believe it or not there is Joy in tribulations. As hard as it is to understand them while it is happening, I look forward to the future, and knowing it will all be okay.
"T" is my middle child. I f anything ,this will prepare me for handling such 'issues' if they come around again with my 2 younger daughters.
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This from the same young man who is used to restaurant work which means lots of cleaning!!
