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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 9:17:55 GMT -5
Baz talks frequently about accepting the choices we make, and to do it without resentment, so I want to share a post SM experience of mine where overcoming resentment produced a more positive outcome. I don't have many positive experiences to share since being single (didn't have many while married either), so this is a treasure amongst the debris that may help others facing similar situations.
One year post SM, I was missing my home and my little dog terribly. He was the cutest, most lovable little creature, who provided great comfort to me. He would wait outside my bedroom door every morning, and as he sensed me, he would stand on hind legs wanting his morning hugs. We had many hugs between the bedroom door and the kitchen. They were my only hugs, and touch is extremely important to him as he is without sight. We both derived great comfort from our hugs, and my heart ached from missing him.
I had the idea to invite my ex-H to stay with me, and bring the dog. That way he gets to see a place he enjoys very much, and also one of our children who lives here (we used to visit every second year or so), and I get to see my dog. In my mind, it was a win-win situation. He wasn't sure about bringing the dog, but I pointed out how it would benifits both of us, and told him to think about it.
I didn't hear from him for a few weeks, until I received a text giving me the date he was arriving. This really lifted my spirits, knowing I'd see my dog again. I was happy until he sent his itinerary. He was going abroad first to visit our youngest, and flying directly to visit me afterwards. This meant no dog because of quarantine restrictions abroad. To say I was upset was an understatement. Once again, he was getting what he wanted, and my needs did not matter. I was livid.
In the weeks before his visit, I felt so much anger and resentment, and many times I was on the verge of calling him, telling him not to come and "F*ck Off, (and I'm not one for swearing, but the way he treated me for 25-year would make a saint swear). I kept regurgitating "it's all about him, and to hell with my needs," until one day I decided to take the high road. I had invited the man, and he would be my guest. It was my responsibility to make his stay as comfortable and as pleasant as possible, and once I'd made that decision the anger and resentment subsided.
Because of this different mindset where I put my focus on his needs and comfort, I ended up having a very pleasant week with him. Yes, it still hurt that I didn't see the dog, but at least I enjoyed our time together, except for one incident that cut me like a knife, but I didn't cry and maintained my composure because I reminded myself that this was about him, not me, and it was only for a week. In fact, it was so pleasant that I wanted him to visit again this year. There were places I'd mapped out that I wanted to show him.
In retrospect, I am so thankful I decided to be gracious instead of resentful because that was the last time we would see each other before his death. I never got the chance for him to visit again, and my last memories of our time together are good ones. God knows the guilt I'd feel if I had told him not to come, or been bad tempered during his visit. Instead, I have nice memories, and the knowledge that taking the high road was the right thing to do, and how can I be angry not seeing the dog, when he got to see his two children for the last time. At least, I'm at peace with this.
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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 9:42:06 GMT -5
One more thing: If you keep putting your own needs aside and only focus on the needs of another person, or others, this is not conducive to your own good mental health, if it's consistent, and for a prolonged period of time. It will destroy your self esteem and confidence. I put my own needs on the back burner for most of our marriage, and it destroyed my confidence as a woman.
Think about it...constantly putting others first while ignoring your own needs is sending a message to your subconscious mind that you don't matter. After a period of time, this self induced brainwashing becomes your personal truth. So, while taking the high road in some situations at some times, don't persistently put your own needs on hold. Consider yourself as much as you consider others, or as Jesus said, "love your neighbor as yourself."
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 10:22:50 GMT -5
I am so glad you have some peace with this. I will never feel that way about my refuser. She stole so much of my life and laughed about it, that I hope I never see her again.
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Post by bballgirl on Oct 4, 2017 10:37:46 GMT -5
CarisI'm glad you have that nice memory. Resentment and anger are such awful feelings. While I lived with my husband I felt that during my SM. Getting a divorce helped me release the anger and resentment and to in a way forgive him but all of that benefits me. Carrying anger and resentment is not healthy. Finding happiness, being content and thankful for what we do have is much healthier.
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Post by northstarmom on Oct 4, 2017 11:50:05 GMT -5
I'm glad you have peace with that. I'm very sorry you didn't get to see your beloved dog.
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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 11:55:56 GMT -5
I am so glad you have some peace with this. I will never feel that way about my refuser. She stole so much of my life and laughed about it, that I hope I never see her again. I understand. Letting go of that is not easy. Maybe with time, it will become easier. The reason I didn't hold resentment during the marriage is because I knew I was responsible for staying with him, so I owned that part of it. That didn't mean I wasn't miserable, I was. I felt rejected, neglected, and like I didn't matter. I felt awful, but it may be because I have an "agreeable" personality. I forgive easily, and don't hold grudges. It sounds like a virtue, but it's really been a weakness in my opinion. It's only helped others take advantage of my good nature, so I wish I'd been more shrewd and mercenary. |
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Post by shamwow on Oct 4, 2017 12:10:19 GMT -5
One more thing: If you keep putting your own needs aside and only focus on the needs of another person, or others, this is not conducive to your own good mental health, if it's consistent, and for a prolonged period of time. It will destroy your self esteem and confidence. I put my own needs on the back burner for most of our marriage, and it destroyed my confidence as a woman. Think about it...constantly putting others first while ignoring your own needs is sending a message to your subconscious mind that you don't matter. After a period of time, this self induced brainwashing becomes your personal truth. So, while taking the high road in some situations at some times, don't persistently put your own needs on hold. Consider yourself as much as you consider others, or as Jesus said, "love your neighbor as yourself." I think you are right when you look at it from the perspective of Jesus. We are commanded to love your neighbor as you would love yourself (placing love of God above both). From a Buddhist tradition, needs of self and needs of others are considered co-equal (God doesn't really enter the picture). Doing harm to others and doing harm to yourself are both considered unskillful. You and your partner (and everything else) are bound together. I think these are both good perspectives to look at things from. During my SM, I put the needs of my wife ahead of my own. I wasn't following the teachings of either of these wise traditions, and suffered for it accordingly. We are taught from early childhood to consider the needs of others. The purpose of this is to combat our human nature (being a selfish bastard). The problem with most of us here is that as a group, we tend to put the needs of others ahead of our own in general. Combine that with being married to someone who will take as much as you give and not give back in return? Well you wind up with a hot mess. I'm curious what thoughts darktippedrose has about this from a Muslim perspective. The same goes out to anyone from a different faith tradition who can shed light on the subject. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 13:05:41 GMT -5
I am so glad you have some peace with this. I will never feel that way about my refuser. She stole so much of my life and laughed about it, that I hope I never see her again. I understand. Letting go of that is not easy. Maybe with time, it will become easier. The reason I didn't hold resentment during the marriage is because I knew I was responsible for staying with him, so I owned that part of it. That didn't mean I wasn't miserable, I was. I felt rejected, neglected, and like I didn't matter. I felt awful, but it may be because I have an "agreeable" personality. I forgive easily, and don't hold grudges. It sounds like a virtue, but it's really been a weakness in my opinion. It's only helped others take advantage of my good nature, so I wish I'd been more shrewd and mercenary. I understand your perspective. I also had the choice, but the idea of being a part time dad to my daughters was devastating. Also, my W was extreme with her verbal abuse and I was very concerned that her full venom would be released on them. There were many occasions when I have had to get between them and tell her that it was enough. Then she would turn her rage on me. |
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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 14:06:41 GMT -5
One more thing: If you keep putting your own needs aside and only focus on the needs of another person, or others, this is not conducive to your own good mental health, if it's consistent, and for a prolonged period of time. It will destroy your self esteem and confidence. I put my own needs on the back burner for most of our marriage, and it destroyed my confidence as a woman. Think about it...constantly putting others first while ignoring your own needs is sending a message to your subconscious mind that you don't matter. After a period of time, this self induced brainwashing becomes your personal truth. So, while taking the high road in some situations at some times, don't persistently put your own needs on hold. Consider yourself as much as you consider others, or as Jesus said, "love your neighbor as yourself." I think you are right when you look at it from the perspective of Jesus. We are commanded to love your neighbor as you would love yourself (placing love of God above both). From a Buddhist tradition, needs of self and needs of others are considered co-equal (God doesn't really enter the picture). Doing harm to others and doing harm to yourself are both considered unskillful. You and your partner (and everything else) are bound together. I think these are both good perspectives to look at things from. During my SM, I put the needs of my wife ahead of my own. I wasn't following the teachings of either of these wise traditions, and suffered for it accordingly. We are taught from early childhood to consider the needs of others. The purpose of this is to combat our human nature (being a selfish bastard). The problem with most of us here is that as a group, we tend to put the needs of others ahead of our own in general. Combine that with being married to someone who will take as much as you give and not give back in return? Well you wind up with a hot mess. I'm curious what thoughts darktippedrose has about this from a Muslim perspective. The same goes out to anyone from a different faith tradition who can shed light on the subject. As a former Christian, then Buddhist, I agree that there is much wisdom in these traditions. In fact, I find wisdom everywhere. My problem (in the beginning) was adhering strictly to Christian teachings. I was already carrying guilt for remarrying after my first divorce, and my pastor validated my belief that it would be wrong for me to remarry. It was like adding one more sin on top of another. It would be adultery in the eyes of God, or so I was told. I was so lonely being single, and I had a healthy libido that I couldn't bear the thought of being alone for the next 50-60 years like that, so I married him. Within weeks, it was evident that this marriage was a mistake, but now I figured it was God's punishment for remarrying. Yes, I truly believed this, so I thought I'm just going to have to bear this punishment (ironic considering my H told me he was punishing me 5-years into the marriage). The other reason was not wanting to lose face. It would be humiliating to say my marriage was over within weeks, so I thought I would keep trying to make it work. Fast forward 27-years, and we know how that ended. I didn't lose my Christian faith because of this, it was something else, over the course of several years, but in retrospect, I see how damaging faith in an ideology/religion can be. I went through an existential crisis as I was losing my faith. I was tormented because I loved Jesus, but one day, after several years of fighting against it, I woke up, and my faith was gone, and there was peace (at least in that area of my life). I no longer believed, and for the first time in my life, I wasn't waiting on God's approval, I depended on my own judgement, and I went out and did something instead of dithering about," is it God's will or not?" Several years passed as an agnostic until I came across Buddhism, and I knew I'd found my home. I'm not a strict Buddhist, in fact I do believe in God, just not the God of the Bible...some old guy sitting on a throne judging us. I don't know what God is, but there is some power that created this existence that's all I know, but ultimately I'm responsible for my own life and choices. The Buddha said to be our own light and depend on our own judgment and reason, so I do, and I'm not attached to Buddhism, but the teachings hold much wisdom. While it sounds wonderful to be so selfless that we always put others ahead of ourselves, as we have found, it is unskillful and detrimental to our own wellbeing. Care for others, but not at the expense of our own health. It's about give and take, and finding middle ground. |
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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 14:15:15 GMT -5
I understand. Letting go of that is not easy. Maybe with time, it will become easier. The reason I didn't hold resentment during the marriage is because I knew I was responsible for staying with him, so I owned that part of it. That didn't mean I wasn't miserable, I was. I felt rejected, neglected, and like I didn't matter. I felt awful, but it may be because I have an "agreeable" personality. I forgive easily, and don't hold grudges. It sounds like a virtue, but it's really been a weakness in my opinion. It's only helped others take advantage of my good nature, so I wish I'd been more shrewd and mercenary. I understand your perspective. I also had the choice, but the idea of being a part time dad to my daughters was devastating. Also, my W was extreme with her verbal abuse and I was very concerned that her full venom would be released on them. There were many occasions when I have had to get between them and tell her that it was enough. Then she would turn her rage on me. Dealing with an abusive spouse adds another dimension to the SM. I suffered this too. I get it, and don't blame you at all for staying. I can't blame anyone. I stayed for 25-years. It's a terrible situation. |
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Post by darktippedrose on Oct 4, 2017 16:20:11 GMT -5
One more thing: If you keep putting your own needs aside and only focus on the needs of another person, or others, this is not conducive to your own good mental health, if it's consistent, and for a prolonged period of time. It will destroy your self esteem and confidence. I put my own needs on the back burner for most of our marriage, and it destroyed my confidence as a woman. Think about it...constantly putting others first while ignoring your own needs is sending a message to your subconscious mind that you don't matter. After a period of time, this self induced brainwashing becomes your personal truth. So, while taking the high road in some situations at some times, don't persistently put your own needs on hold. Consider yourself as much as you consider others, or as Jesus said, "love your neighbor as yourself." I think you are right when you look at it from the perspective of Jesus. We are commanded to love your neighbor as you would love yourself (placing love of God above both). From a Buddhist tradition, needs of self and needs of others are considered co-equal (God doesn't really enter the picture). Doing harm to others and doing harm to yourself are both considered unskillful. You and your partner (and everything else) are bound together. I think these are both good perspectives to look at things from. During my SM, I put the needs of my wife ahead of my own. I wasn't following the teachings of either of these wise traditions, and suffered for it accordingly. We are taught from early childhood to consider the needs of others. The purpose of this is to combat our human nature (being a selfish bastard). The problem with most of us here is that as a group, we tend to put the needs of others ahead of our own in general. Combine that with being married to someone who will take as much as you give and not give back in return? Well you wind up with a hot mess. I'm curious what thoughts darktippedrose has about this from a Muslim perspective. The same goes out to anyone from a different faith tradition who can shed light on the subject. The Islamic opinion is kind of complicated, depending on how deep you go. So, there are marital guidelines that should be respected. Some men can warp them and twist the Islamic guidance for their own agenda. But thats nothing special to Muslim men, per se. I am a Shi'a muslim, and oppression is a huge deal. It doesn't matter who does it, and who receives it. When you opress another human being or animal, you are abusing rights. And for that, you can't seek God's forgiveness. Another human being does NOT have to forgive you. One description of forgiveness is that they don't seek legal justice, but they can still hate you. Unless you seek them out sincerely for amends. But then again, no one has to forgive you for anything. Putting someone else's needs above their own. Well many martyrs have a super human level of selflessness. But everyday people are not always capable of this level of selflessness and it can lead to your doom. I took care of myself since I was 3. I've been taking care of other people since I was 3 (my mom had leukemia, then she leukemia again years later, and then alcohol/drug problems). So I guess I have a high tolerance for taking care of others and abandonment/neglect. I suspect that my co-dependent relationship with my mother set me up easy pickings for a sociopath. fun stuff that. My mom did NOT feel guilty for abandoning me because I had a good "head" on my shoulders. Lovely. My husband doesn't feel guilty for what he does. He acts like a born again Christian - nothing against Christians, just the "I'm born again, nothing bad I've done matters now" attitude. Issues that can influence this is childhood, culture and customs, etc etc. So Islamically, sex is a requirement to legalize the marriage. Unless you put in the contract that there's going to be no relations. Men are supposed to be nice, to provide, etc etc. Lots of them don't. Being harsh with your family can put you in a bad place, literally. For resentment, there are certain months in the Islamic calender, where prayers are answered more than others. There are certain prayers you can make against those who've wronged you. You can make prayers for anxiety or to overcome bad feelings with family, etc. Personally, I consider resentment to be a part of the cycle of healing. the point is to NOT stay stuck there. As long as you don't do something bad and wreckless when you're feeling resentful. I Feel that anger, fear, pain, resentment, etc or all stages of healing. I think many people in sexless marriages, the biggest problem is forgiving yourself. I know sometimes I'm mad at myself for being stupid and young and not seeing things earlier. My relatives say I don't speak up for myself, but they don't either. He's very intimidating to more than just me. So its not just in my head. But anyways thats my opinion, and an Islamic perspective, per my research. |
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Post by Caris on Oct 4, 2017 20:26:27 GMT -5
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Post by baza on Oct 4, 2017 20:26:50 GMT -5
I did my level best to manage, control, handle my resentment whilst I was in my ILIASM deaL.
Despite my best endevours I was unsuccessful in this aim.
It was beyond my capabilities.
I couldn't do it.
The required high mindedness needed - to accept without resentment - was not in me, though Lord knows I really really tried to find it.
After I got out, that changed.
A bit of time and space did wonders for me and my attitude toward my ex missus.
And ever so steadily, my resentment levels fell away.
Probably because I was no longer in that environment that fed my resentment, probably because I was in a more positive environment, and possibly because I pretty much stopped thinking / worrying about it.
After a while I could see way more clearly what had happened, and understood my ex missus (and myself) and our contributing roles in running our deal into the ditch.
And my resentment over what had happened basically evaporated.
It was wonderfully freeing.
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Post by Caris on Oct 5, 2017 6:55:07 GMT -5
I did my level best to manage, control, handle my resentment whilst I was in my ILIASM deaL. Despite my best endevours I was unsuccessful in this aim. It was beyond my capabilities. I couldn't do it. The required high mindedness needed - to accept without resentment - was not in me, though Lord knows I really really tried to find it. After I got out, that changed. A bit of time and space did wonders for me and my attitude toward my ex missus. And ever so steadily, my resentment levels fell away. Probably because I was no longer in that environment that fed my resentment, probably because I was in a more positive environment, and possibly because I pretty much stopped thinking / worrying about it. After a while I could see way more clearly what had happened, and understood my ex missus (and myself) and our contributing roles in running our deal into the ditch. And my resentment over what had happened basically evaporated. It was wonderfully freeing. This makes sense because how can you see things clearly when you are still in the woods. Being in the same environment that is crushing your soul, and trying to heal is akin to treating a burn on your hand while your hand is still in the fire. It won't work. |
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Post by novembercomingfire on Oct 5, 2017 13:57:15 GMT -5
Caris, your post really resonated with me today. Thank you for your posts. I have become aware that, notwithstanding some of my previous posts where I projected a spirit of gloom and defeat, I am willing to endure what I need to endure at present if only in order to release my resentment. And I find that I have a great deal of resentment. I think that when I have found a way to let this resentment pass away from me, I will have completed this stage and I will then (and likely only then) be ready to move forward.
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