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Post by doneanddone on Jun 28, 2017 15:08:23 GMT -5
Those same "obstacles" that she can't overcome where there when she agreed to marry you. Like most of us, you where mislead. So why should she have to change anything now? Well...not so much. After we got married the sex was still there and the frequency was still adequate to NOT be considered a SM but I did notice a slow decline in her willingness and approach to bedtime rituals. We still got our freak on when we wanted it real bad and when there were periods of no sex she would actually be the one to point it out which then quickly was resolved by the ol' quickie in the kitchen or deck or wherever we happen to be at that time. The real change came when we found out we were going to be parents. And ever since then we have not been on the same page. It has taken its toll on me so I'm just glad I am still able to drum up enough confidence in myself to pursue some level of sanity knowing I did or am willing to do whatever it takes to right the ship and leave the big D as the last resort. |
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Post by doneanddone on Jun 28, 2017 15:11:39 GMT -5
One can't accurately predict the future - particularly when it involves another person. But you can make some pretty obvious estimations based on what has gone on in the past. Based on the history you have divulged in your stories so far Brother doneanddone , by 28th September 2017, in 3 months time, your missus' "why" will be exposed for the bullshit it was / is, and you will have a sex life identical to what you have now. The only difference will be that you will by then be sterile. I am actually very anti gambling, but even I would be prepared to make a modest wager on that outcome. But, I would sincerely like to lose on that bet. The house always wins....and I am prepared for that. I just am taking the most effective road possible and that is I am addressing her concerns and issues head on. And I agree it is bullshit but hey......I'm prepped for the next chapter where ever that takes me.....  |
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Post by doneanddone on Jun 28, 2017 15:16:18 GMT -5
I would probably agree with @bbgirl and the others who say that it will probably not work. But it might. If I might suggest anything, try it and go slow. You have built up a lot of resentment towards her, and she probably has a lot of anxiety over you. If it's going to work, you are going to have to find out what attraction brought you two together. I tried it with my wife, and it didn't work out. When we first dated, we made out listening to Simply Red. I booked a nice weekend at a bed and breakfast complete with a hot tub in the bedroom. I put on Simply Red, then she told me that she didn't like their music. I should have ended our marriage then and there. Simply Red......brother you had me at Simply Red..... lol |
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Post by doneanddone on Jun 28, 2017 15:52:47 GMT -5
I have a few different topics to speak to: 1) I'm calling bullshit on your wife. The fear of pregnancy is an excuse not a reason. She doesn't like sex. I doubt your sex life is going to turn around with her. 2) you are a counter refuser if you don't want sex with her. 3) go after what you want for yourself and live an authentic life. I must be completely ignorant in the area of counter refuser because I am looking at this in a completely different light. The W made the decision to not have sex for multiple reasons right or wrong she made that decision for the both of us taking me out of discussion making it a one way or no way issue. My concerns and thoughts about moving forward are if and when the time comes that she is now revived and wants to take a more heighten interest in our sex life together, will it be because I am so accustomed to her rejection and refusals for so many years that my attitude will be....."mehh...I don't feel like it with you....but with (insert female who is a willing participant name here) I am" I guess I've looked at my wife being a refuser in the sense of: 1. A refuser has excuses and fictitious reasons other than they just don't want to have sex (no reasons needed, you don't want to have sex with someone you don't have sex with them). Sex is a state of mind and being. I don't have to have a reason not to have sex. If we aren't compatible or on the same page emotionally we aren't having sex. I think I'd be better off if she would just come out and tell me she doesn't want to have sex with me because she doesn't feel like it or that she isn't in love anymore. BUT she says all those things we refusee's hang onto like...... "I enjoy sex." "I enjoy sex with you, my husband." "I want to have sex with you, my husband." "I love when we have sex and are close and intimate together." blah blah blah blah...... So if there is another type of refuser out there, I am not accustomed to that type of refuser. Me being a counter refuser IMO for me and my twisted thought process, I would have to come up with some crazy ass reasons and excuses to justify not whipping it out when and if she truly wants to make a run at re-patching the gaping hole in our marriage. |
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Post by bballgirl on Jun 28, 2017 16:04:23 GMT -5
I have a few different topics to speak to: 1) I'm calling bullshit on your wife. The fear of pregnancy is an excuse not a reason. She doesn't like sex. I doubt your sex life is going to turn around with her. 2) you are a counter refuser if you don't want sex with her. 3) go after what you want for yourself and live an authentic life. I must be completely ignorant in the area of counter refuser because I am looking at this in a completely different light. The W made the decision to not have sex for multiple reasons right or wrong she made that decision for the both of us taking me out of discussion making it a one way or no way issue. My concerns and thoughts about moving forward are if and when the time comes that she is now revived and wants to take a more heighten interest in our sex life together, will it be because I am so accustomed to her rejection and refusals for so many years that my attitude will be....."mehh...I don't feel like it with you....but with (insert female who is a willing participant name here) I am" I guess I've looked at my wife being a refuser in the sense of: 1. A refuser has excuses and fictitious reasons other than they just don't want to have sex (no reasons needed, you don't want to have sex with someone you don't have sex with them). Sex is a state of mind and being. I don't have to have a reason not to have sex. If we aren't compatible or on the same page emotionally we aren't having sex. I think I'd be better off if she would just come out and tell me she doesn't want to have sex with me because she doesn't feel like it or that she isn't in love anymore. BUT she says all those things we refusee's hang onto like...... "I enjoy sex." "I enjoy sex with you, my husband." "I want to have sex with you, my husband." "I love when we have sex and are close and intimate together." blah blah blah blah...... So if there is another type of refuser out there, I am not accustomed to that type of refuser. Me being a counter refuser IMO for me and my twisted thought process, I would have to come up with some crazy ass reasons and excuses to justify not whipping it out when and if she truly wants to make a run at re-patching the gaping hole in our marriage. Well I said you are a counter refuser IF you don't want sex with her but the fact that if she is willing to work on it then you are still attracted to her and desire her tells me that you are NOT a counter refuser. |
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Post by Apocrypha on Jun 29, 2017 12:57:39 GMT -5
" would it be counter refuser if I just wasn't interested in sex with W but was interested in sex with others?"
This all seems needlessly complicated.
Forget about "what" you would be - the labels and ethics etc.
Your wife doesn't want to have sex with you, for reasons. The result of that, over time, is that she doesn't have sex with you.
You don't feel all that enthusiastic about having sex with her, for reasons. The result of that, over time, is also predictable.
Whether that makes you, or her, a refuser or a counter-refuser in the eyes of... of who?... us? Doesn't matter and doesn't change anything.
Does it?
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Post by baza on Jun 29, 2017 20:28:56 GMT -5
Endorsing Brother Apocrypha here. Comes a time in ILIASM shitholes when it is no longer relevant or helpful to pursue who is *right/wrong*, who is *refuser/refused*, who is *blameless/blameful*, who has the *moral highground/lowground*. And at that time appears to have arrived in your deal. |
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Post by Anonymous Steve on Jun 29, 2017 20:48:18 GMT -5
This is interesting timing. I just got back from a vacation last weekend and in the last two weeks, my wife and I probably had more sex than in the previous 6 months. Come to think of it, we probably had more sex than we did on honeymoon 10 years ago. This is not likely to be a long term change in our relationship: for a number of (mostly legitimate) reasons, real life is about to hit again pretty hard. She will likely fall back into her patterns pretty quickly and I will fall back into mine. On the other hand, I don't think you should be unduly pessimistic. This board is a great resource for hearing about people going through the same thing as you, but you should remember that your marriage is probably also different in important ways. My marriage may have been sexless for a very long time, but it is not dead yet, unlike many of the people posting here. If circumstances allow (and this is a big if), there is a possibility that our marriage could get back on track. Of that I am fairly confident.
However, the only person who can answer the question as to whether you can move past the past and rebuild your marriage is you. And you'll probably only find out the answer by trying (you'll also only find out whether she can move on and rebuild by trying). Take it slowly and don't be overly disheartened by early setbacks, but do put some time limit on by which you want something substantive to have changed.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2017 8:27:25 GMT -5
wife wont have sex so I will get a vasectomy...
Sort of like going to the desert and wearing a life preserver.
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Post by beachguy on Jul 8, 2017 9:21:00 GMT -5
wife wont have sex so I will get a vasectomy... Sort of like going to the desert and wearing a life preserver. Or perhaps, living in an SM desert but planning for a future cruise, without the spouse. Or planning for a new life aboard said cruise ship. |
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Post by bluebirdday on Jul 8, 2017 19:04:11 GMT -5
Everyone has a different journey. Our sex life BC (before children) was not great/frequent/satisfying enough. After our first child, there was no sex, except just one small week window while she was ovulating for our 2nd child. After that, no sex for 12 years....nada. And I tried just about everything to get her attention and interest....scented candles, household logistics/cooking/laundry, while being the primary wage earner. We talked about a vasectomy early on, but she wanted to wait....and I saw no reason to go there if there was no sex. Two years ago I found EP and that totally changed my life...for the good.....I felt informed and empowered. I told my wife that I couldn't handle being sexless any longer and would outsource...quietly. Outsourcing was awesome for me for a year, then I fell head over heels in love with my last AP....and after an incredible summer of love with AP, I wanted to spend more time with her and thus told my W about her. My wife freaked....it really got her attention....she didn't think I would actually go through with outstourcing....especially to the point of falling in love. So, this last Fall, I put the brakes on with my AP, got tested for STD's, got a vasectomy, went into couples therapy....and we've totally rekindled our sex life.....for the last six months, 4-5 times/week. And it has been way more passionate then what we had BC. In some ways, we are completely restarting our relationship....learning to have mutual/passionate sex. And we have a long ways yet to go....but feel that this isn't reset sex...it's there to stay, along with better communication, and emotional connection.
Outsourcing really got my wife's attention and turned her around along with the perfect timing of a vasectomy....the fear of getting pregnant really got in her way of truly enjoying sex.
Good luck!
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Post by DryCreek on Jul 8, 2017 19:39:52 GMT -5
Outsourcing really got my wife's attention and turned her around along with the perfect timing of a vasectomy....the fear of getting pregnant really got in her way of truly enjoying sex. That turnaround is beyond miraculous. From absolutely zero for a decade, to a pace that's several times the national average. It wouldn't be the first time a refuser rediscovered their sexuality, but I've only ever heard of a sincere change happening with a new relationship. What does your therapist have to say about this sudden and dramatic change in behavior? I'm dubious, but I'd rather be wrong. I hope her change is genuine and very long-lasting. 6 months is a pretty good track record. |
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Post by bluebirdday on Jul 9, 2017 22:36:00 GMT -5
...and here I was rooting for the AP, poor thing. So was I at the time. If I didn't have young children, I would've left my wife for my AP. Closing that door of intimacy with my AP, was a super tough move. Although I'm still in touch daily with my AP. |
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Post by bluebirdday on Jul 9, 2017 23:12:43 GMT -5
Outsourcing really got my wife's attention and turned her around along with the perfect timing of a vasectomy....the fear of getting pregnant really got in her way of truly enjoying sex. That turnaround is beyond miraculous. From absolutely zero for a decade, to a pace that's several times the national average. It wouldn't be the first time a refuser rediscovered their sexuality, but I've only ever heard of a sincere change happening with a new relationship. What does your therapist have to say about this sudden and dramatic change in behavior? I'm dubious, but I'd rather be wrong. I hope her change is genuine and very long-lasting. 6 months is a pretty good track record. Therapy has helped us tremendously....we should've done it years ago; but we didn't because we both were scarred from previous shrink experiences dealing with non relationship issues. We are also both highly committed and motivated to work through our junk. I think my wife also really understood for the first time how important sex is to a relationship; and is only now fully embracing it. And we both really like our therapist, and feel so much headway and ground covered after each session. The hard part: having drunken from the golden goblet with my AP. I have big doubts that sex with my wife will ever reach the same level as with my AP. Plus, I have so much in common with my AP: both adrenaline junkies, she fights fires with flying, I fly floats professionally, fast motorcycles, art, cooking, exercise, 18 yrs of knowing each other. I think the quality of sex with my wife will continue to improve, but I can't imagine to the same level as what I had with my AP......the pitfalls of outsourcing and making the mistake of falling in love. At least I got to experience fantastic love: passionate screwing for 20-30 hrs in multiple sanctuaries, on any horizontal surface, or furniture, every room of the house. Sigh....who knows if that incredible level would be sustainable? |
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Post by DryCreek on Jul 10, 2017 2:02:34 GMT -5
Sigh....who knows if that incredible level would be sustainable? One would wish. One of the illusions of an affair is that most of the time spent together is focused on the two of you. Meanwhile, home life carries the baggage of reality - bills, shopping, kids, yardwork. The illusion can't be so so grand once all the mundane things pile on; it would take conscious effort to keep the mundane from taking over. Or maybe, with all the hard lessons learned in marriage, one could be successful the second time around by keeping each other as a top priority and avoid being dragged down by life. |
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