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Post by snowman12345 on Jun 14, 2017 5:27:47 GMT -5
My H and I had a few discussions lately. I moved into the guest bedroom a few weeks ago. He told his mom and brother he'd treated me really badly by neglecting and withdrawing sex from for 17 years. He said he wants to stay married even after I told him that I couldn't go back and that I'd changed. I confess that the first time I read your post, I skimmed. It was when someone downthread quoted it that I realized that there is something different in this situation: public admission of wrong doing in the marriage. If I'm not mistaken, in most (if not all) reset attempts, public admission of being the bad partner doesn't happen. To all the others, does this merit examination? I see a pre-emptive strike. He knows she's leaving and so he is making a public appearance of "trying to save the marriage". This way she looks like the bad guy for walking out. I say - keep walking.
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Post by csl on Jun 14, 2017 11:13:08 GMT -5
csl , you are quite right, it does seem unusual, not that I am an expert. However, I think, even if warmways partner has addressed his failure, its all too late. She has lived with this way of being for far too long. 17 years. I cant imagine it. I'm in year 10 of no sex at all and around year 25 of not in the least interested (my w) and I must say from my side at least, your feelings for your partner gradually die inside. I reached the 'not wishing to touch at all' stage about 5 years ago. And we dont. I've currently reached a 'co-habitation' stage, where nothing means anything at all anymore. Actually it felt quite liberating at first, feeling I was finally ready to draw an end to it all. Things have been less volatile since that happened - she loves to start arguments, for several weeks now that just hasnt happened. We exchange strange looks, and I am not allowing myself to be drawn into 'her bs'. I'm done. No amount of retroactive behaviour is going to save it. I just dont fancy her at all, dont see her in that way anymore - the desire to create desire from my side to hers has been dead and buried for years now. So it cant be reversed. I'm sure we are reading about the same underlying behavioural pattern, if thats what you can call it. But theres the irony. We 'the refusees' are the ones who have to take the final step. We have lived with this shit for all these years, but still we arent just let off the hook. Perhaps warmways partner is trying to draw attention from outside sources hoping they will step in and try to salvage the relationship. You could call it, the divine intervention theory. But I think he has left it all far too late. "divine intervention theory" - otherwise known as the Damascus Road experience. On my blog, which I write from my Christian perspective, I have made it clear that sexual refusal is the equivalent of adultery, and in our lingo, "breaking the marital covenant." I write that just as the spouse who has been cheated on has every right to separate and divorce over the cheating, a refused spouse has the same right. I admit that in my circles, I am in a minority, but my reading convinces me that my minority will soon be a majority. Not that that impinges on your situation, but just letting you know that I don't have a problem with being fed up and done. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jun 14, 2017 11:22:24 GMT -5
the sexlessness is still there. The iphysical intimacy - hugs and kisses - ended because of me as it felt unnatural and forced when he requested it every morning as we left for work or upon arriving home. It just felt stupid and fake and made me resent him more. So I don't hug him anymore but I think he'd welcome any hugs or intimacy at this point. Well, that pretty much is that. It sounds like it's time to call it. I probably am missing a lot of the prior posts and history here. Is there any "LOVE" left? Do you want to try and save this marriage? This is what they told me. First take away every other reason from the analysis (take away the kids, take away the house, the money, the dogs, the anything you can think of). All that is left is You and your H? How do you feel? Me personally, I can rush to judgment and act impulsively so I tend at this age in my life to slow myself down before making a decision. So that is my bias. How does it feel? Make you feel to think ONLY of your H and only stay for your feelings towards him? Any attraction left at all? Any feelings? |
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Post by warmways on Jun 14, 2017 12:35:26 GMT -5
MxRoommate thanks for these great questions
For so long I wanted to save it and he didn't come through a t all. Now that he's throwing everything and the kitchen sink it's too late. Why didn't he try when it would have made a difference
There is only the love I feel for someone I know really well and have grown to care for more as a fellow human being. Someone struggling as we all are. I'm just tired after all these years of neglect and it's too tall an order - too big a leap to go from zero to recreating what we had in the very beginning
I feel stress mainly around him and a weirdness like this is unnatural. What are we doing together. This is wrong. It's fake there is only a little attraction but my emotional attraction isn't there because of the lack of the quality of connection I need.
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Post by shamwow on Jun 14, 2017 14:31:42 GMT -5
I confess that the first time I read your post, I skimmed. It was when someone downthread quoted it that I realized that there is something different in this situation: public admission of wrong doing in the marriage. If I'm not mistaken, in most (if not all) reset attempts, public admission of being the bad partner doesn't happen. To all the others, does this merit examination? I see a pre-emptive strike. He knows she's leaving and so he is making a public appearance of "trying to save the marriage". This way she looks like the bad guy for walking out. I say - keep walking.
My gut says the exact same thing. But I also cannot recall an account of a public admission of being the bad guy. I know sure as hell it didn't happen in my situation. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Jun 14, 2017 14:49:19 GMT -5
I see a pre-emptive strike. He knows she's leaving and so he is making a public appearance of "trying to save the marriage". This way she looks like the bad guy for walking out. I say - keep walking.
My gut says the exact same thing. But I also cannot recall an account of a public admission of being the bad guy. I know sure as hell it didn't happen in my situation. Just how "public" is it? What? with his mom, and a relative? Sounds like manipulation for Pitty, or another false front to gain approval. Like a swing set, "You can't move forward until you've leaned back". |
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tori
Junior Member
Posts: 89 
Age Range: 41-45
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Post by tori on Jun 14, 2017 19:23:34 GMT -5
Too little too late....I question his motives. Sometimes people realize they're assholes and sometimes they deny it. Sounds like his eyes have opened and he now realizes he's on the outs. Sounds like a narcissist to me.
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Post by nolongerlonely on Jun 15, 2017 1:39:52 GMT -5
thanks csl, I'm going to find some time and read your blog. Your analysis about our partners' behaviour being the same as adultery, is very refreshing to hear, and a great perspective on what all of us here suffer. |
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Post by rdp62 on Jun 15, 2017 2:08:59 GMT -5
the sexlessness is still there. The iphysical intimacy - hugs and kisses - ended because of me as it felt unnatural and forced when he requested it every morning as we left for work or upon arriving home. It just felt stupid and fake and made me resent him more. So I don't hug him anymore but I think he'd welcome any hugs or intimacy at this point. Ahh...but his welcoming intimacy is for very different reasons than yours. You are giving he is taking. Those little pecks and forced hugs every morning and when he arrived home are all his method of taking, there all self centered with no giving. It's there way of keeping you in your place. Like a leash on a dog. How true this is you should have seen how pissed my wife was when I refused to kiss her goodbye this morning. She was totally shocked I have never done anything like that before she thought it was all better after an intense discussion after I said no more from me until bee were better. Thanks to the people here for the support. I am very lucky to have found this site after only a year or so of SM maybe not too late to save marriage she did text me at about 11am she lives near we will see.. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jun 15, 2017 3:15:08 GMT -5
He withdrew sex from her for 17 YEARS. Obviously, he has no sexual interest in her or he wouldn't have been able to go so long without having sex with her. I doubt, too, that she gets turned on thinking about having sex with him. It would feel incestuous. He can't will himself into having sexual feelings for her. He could force himself to go through the motions, but that is not likely to provide her with the kind of sex she longs for. The marriage is dead unless she wants to continue in a roommate, brother/sister marriage. 17 YEARS - Holy Sh----t. No sex for 17 freaking years. Can this turn around for real? The only way is some borderline MIRACULOUS deep change in the H's Psyche - Carl Jung mentioned that these deep spiritual type changes were possible but required a massive deep psychic change to occur. If I had a wooden nickel to bet, I would say very close to impossible - which leaves open a micro window of hope. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jun 15, 2017 3:19:42 GMT -5
MxRoommate thanks for these great questions For so long I wanted to save it and he didn't come through a t all. Now that he's throwing everything and the kitchen sink it's too late. Why didn't he try when it would have made a difference There is only the love I feel for someone I know really well and have grown to care for more as a fellow human being. Someone struggling as we all are. I'm just tired after all these years of neglect and it's too tall an order - too big a leap to go from zero to recreating what we had in the very beginning I feel stress mainly around him and a weirdness like this is unnatural. What are we doing together. This is wrong. It's fake there is only a little attraction but my emotional attraction isn't there because of the lack of the quality of connection I need. I completely understand where you are coming from. I can tell you in my case, and I think it is fairly common, once the "D" word is mentioned a Hurricane Level 5 emerges in the human heart, swirling and changing and back again and swirls some more. Barring death and horrible physical trauma/disease there can be no greater emotional stress and storm creator than the dreaded "DIVORCE", once even in the mind-heart - here comes the swirling. I think the 17 YEARS of NO SEX is gargantuan in terms of a fact that is unavoidable. And we all know it is not just "Sexless" it is NO INTIMACY neither is my guess for 17 years - and not the peck on the cheek ritual stuff - but the heart to heart deep love type of intimacy. Can you repair this? I scoured the Internet for "Learn to Love Again" and "Rekindle the spark" etc. etc. etc. I am sorry but LOVE for me is not manufactured or manipulated but comes naturally and yes it must be nurtured but cannot be recreated once dead or in a coma for so long - that is my experience and thoughts on it at least. Once a decision is made then hold to it and keep moving forward. You are NOT alone and courage as you move forward - if my experience is any indicator - it will be a STORM to ride thru - hold steady and get thru it ! ! ! |
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Post by doneanddone on Jun 19, 2017 14:03:54 GMT -5
My H and I had a few discussions lately. I moved into the guest bedroom a few weeks ago. He told his mom and brother he'd treated me really badly by neglecting and withdrawing sex from for 17 years. He said he wants to stay married even after I told him that I couldn't go back and that I'd changed. He is now trying everything. He has never vacuumed or done house chores and he's doing everything now. My bday was yesterday and he brought coffee in bed and showered me with gifts. He hates to go out but he went to sing karaoke with me last night and is going canoeing with me He used to not take care of the cats and dog and now he's taking care of them and taking the dog out every morning for a long hike at 5:30 am. He told me he treated me like s:&? and he had been a d/;&. Now he's on the phone with his brother saying how he used to not want to do stuff with me that he'd rather smoke weed or watch tv but now he does everything I suggest. The problem is that I no longer feel anything besides friendship for him. He read a book called Resisiting Happiness and he's taken every single word to heart and it's like he's had a personality transplant. He says he knows what the right thing to do is and we naturally want to do the right thing and bringing someone joy is so impossible and that love is a verb and that he used to resist and feel like s:?& for doing that. He said he had self loathing and guilt when he would hear me crying myself to sleep some nights. The problem is that all this came to late. He is now talking to his brother about how I taught him so much. That stuff he's reading in this book I'd told him about a long time ago. It's painful to think of leaving him but I've become numb from the emotional abuse and no longer even feel anger towards him. I left my job Wednesday and am in the process of finding a new one. Things are so weird right now. I just needed to vent. Thanks for reading. Please read my comments with an open mind and open heart. I by no means am trying to point fingers or place blame on any one party of the relationship you are currently in. I hate to say this but you created this monster and now it's yours to deal with. If indeed it was truly over when he wasn't doing all the things you told him he should have been doing long ago then that is when you should have made more of convincing arrangements and either physically left the relationship - i.e. moved out, or divorced. But by staying and hanging around, even in another room it created a sense of attachment that never went away. So now that he is doing and saying all the things you wanted him to so long ago, and now it means nothing, this is yours to deal with. I feel for you more than I do him because he has shown he is capable of change even if it took longer than you were willing to wait. I've read through some other comments and they say people can't change or he'll flip back to the way he was.....so on so forth. I am the opposite. I believe people can change. Everyone responds differently to every situation even if there is a greater mass that responds exactly the same to one situation there will always be one that does not respond as the greater mass. There is no shame in how you feel now vs. how you felt back when you were wanting him to respond to the situation. It does make for a difficult circumstance to move on from because you do see the change in him. But it would have been a lot less traumatic back then to have ripped the band-aid off and let it heal. Now that it has had a chance to "heal" pulling that band-aid off now will make it worse. But again, that's just how I see the situation you have described. I don't mean to offend and by no means do I think you are wrong but this is one persons open and honest opinion. Good luck. |
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Post by warmways on Jun 19, 2017 17:33:05 GMT -5
the sexlessness is still there. The iphysical intimacy - hugs and kisses - ended because of me as it felt unnatural and forced when he requested it every morning as we left for work or upon arriving home. It just felt stupid and fake and made me resent him more. So I don't hug him anymore but I think he'd welcome any hugs or intimacy at this point. After years of counselling, Mrs Apocrypha and I got back to a really good place as partners, minus the sex. We had date night, talked problems through, changed ourselves and behavior in significant ways. If we were coworkers, or buddies or ex-spouses, it would have been a much improved, more healthy relationship - but dropping sex into the equation was a disaster. Regardless of how he feels or acts - desire isn't there. It isn't there on your side either. You can both enact the tropes of a romantic relationship in order to embalm whatever is left in the association, but there is no romantic heartbeat there. At some point, if you are alive, you will feel that yearning for someone else, and so will he. Exactly-- we just talked - he was upset I moved all clothes out of my closet in the bedroom we shared. He said he was still attracted to me and didn't touch me because he thought it would be presumptuous. I told him the gulf between us caused by his neglecting me is too big. I can't see myself with him. There's just no way. |
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Post by warmways on Jun 19, 2017 17:35:19 GMT -5
My H and I had a few discussions lately. I moved into the guest bedroom a few weeks ago. He told his mom and brother he'd treated me really badly by neglecting and withdrawing sex from for 17 years. He said he wants to stay married even after I told him that I couldn't go back and that I'd changed. He is now trying everything. He has never vacuumed or done house chores and he's doing everything now. My bday was yesterday and he brought coffee in bed and showered me with gifts. He hates to go out but he went to sing karaoke with me last night and is going canoeing with me He used to not take care of the cats and dog and now he's taking care of them and taking the dog out every morning for a long hike at 5:30 am. He told me he treated me like s:&? and he had been a d/;&. Now he's on the phone with his brother saying how he used to not want to do stuff with me that he'd rather smoke weed or watch tv but now he does everything I suggest. The problem is that I no longer feel anything besides friendship for him. He read a book called Resisiting Happiness and he's taken every single word to heart and it's like he's had a personality transplant. He says he knows what the right thing to do is and we naturally want to do the right thing and bringing someone joy is so impossible and that love is a verb and that he used to resist and feel like s:?& for doing that. He said he had self loathing and guilt when he would hear me crying myself to sleep some nights. The problem is that all this came to late. He is now talking to his brother about how I taught him so much. That stuff he's reading in this book I'd told him about a long time ago. It's painful to think of leaving him but I've become numb from the emotional abuse and no longer even feel anger towards him. I left my job Wednesday and am in the process of finding a new one. Things are so weird right now. I just needed to vent. Thanks for reading. He is going to want validation for his actions and as time goes on his conversations with his brother will turn to him trying to save the marriage and you are trying to destroy it and this will become your fault. Sure that could happen but at this point I don't care that much. I know what happened and have no control over what they think. I don't really see that happening though I'm sure in any divorce there will be lots of people who see it the way they want to. |
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Post by warmways on Jun 19, 2017 17:40:05 GMT -5
the sexlessness is still there. The iphysical intimacy - hugs and kisses - ended because of me as it felt unnatural and forced when he requested it every morning as we left for work or upon arriving home. It just felt stupid and fake and made me resent him more. So I don't hug him anymore but I think he'd welcome any hugs or intimacy at this point. I'm with you there - I had a brief kiss on the cheek when I returned from my trip but I have absolutely no compunction to show any degree of affection. I have totally detached emotionally. It feels awkward and fake and just ugh! So, no more hugs and just being "polite" is the limit. I keep it civil and as upbeat as possible and don't let conversations go into total darkness when he starts on the path of manipulation. |
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