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Post by beachguy on Jan 27, 2017 10:44:12 GMT -5
That sounds like an accurate analysis of your wife where she valued sex as a tool and weapon in order to get what she wanted in life. Really that's the premise of reset sex, it's a tool to get us to stop nagging them for another month, 6 months, or a year. They know because of the kids, finances, etc we won't leave and when we hit rock bottom they can reset us. What's really sad is nobody wants to be alone in life but lonely is so much worse. Because of the incompatibility with the way they value sex, they made us feel lonely so now the consequences are being alone. The value of sex is clearly about connection but with people who are intimacy averse to some degree they aren't capable of that connection. Sex is just a release or a tool, physical touch is at the bottom of their love language and for us it's in the top three to feel loved so it boils down to incompatibility and why we chained ourselves to someone that didn't desire us the way we needed to be desired? (Kids, finances, etc.). I feel like I'm rambling now but it's so complicated yet with the right person it's not complicated. The sad thing is that as my marriage deteriorated, sex for me became more like just sex because the connection was nonexistent and I was no longer trying. The sex became less enjoyable, aside from the fact that I had to endure humiliating "corpseplay" to get anything going. As best I understand it, sex for her by the day we married was no different than what I experienced 10-12 years later when I gave up initiating more than once a year, and then eventually never again. |
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 27, 2017 10:56:13 GMT -5
That sounds like an accurate analysis of your wife where she valued sex as a tool and weapon in order to get what she wanted in life. Really that's the premise of reset sex, it's a tool to get us to stop nagging them for another month, 6 months, or a year. They know because of the kids, finances, etc we won't leave and when we hit rock bottom they can reset us. What's really sad is nobody wants to be alone in life but lonely is so much worse. Because of the incompatibility with the way they value sex, they made us feel lonely so now the consequences are being alone. The value of sex is clearly about connection but with people who are intimacy averse to some degree they aren't capable of that connection. Sex is just a release or a tool, physical touch is at the bottom of their love language and for us it's in the top three to feel loved so it boils down to incompatibility and why we chained ourselves to someone that didn't desire us the way we needed to be desired? (Kids, finances, etc.). I feel like I'm rambling now but it's so complicated yet with the right person it's not complicated. The sad thing is that as my marriage deteriorated, sex for me became more like just sex because the connection was nonexistent and I was no longer trying. The sex became less enjoyable, aside from the fact that I had to endure humiliating "corpseplay" to get anything going. As best I understand it, sex for her by the day we married was no different than what I experienced 10-12 years later when I gave up initiating more than once a year, and then eventually never again. [ It's very sad and all we can do is learn from our mistakes, find some sort of peace and move forward. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 27, 2017 11:03:14 GMT -5
As you know, my STBX appeared to have quite a libido when I first met her. That always confused me. When I came to understand the difference between libido and valuing sex in a relationship almost everything fell in place and I understood asexuality. I don't fully understand what happened to that libido but since this is a recurring theme here I just accept that a libido that doesn't understand the value of sex is just a weapon and a tool. I am sure my wife valued her libido as a weapon and a tool. That sounds like an accurate analysis of your wife where she valued sex as a tool and weapon in order to get what she wanted in life. Really that's the premise of reset sex, it's a tool to get us to stop nagging them for another month, 6 months, or a year. They know because of the kids, finances, etc we won't leave and when we hit rock bottom they can reset us. What's really sad is nobody wants to be alone in life but lonely is so much worse. Because of the incompatibility with the way they value sex, they made us feel lonely so now the consequences are being alone. The value of sex is clearly about connection but with people who are intimacy averse to some degree they aren't capable of that connection. Sex is just a release or a tool, physical touch is at the bottom of their love language and for us it's in the top three to feel loved so it boils down to incompatibility and why we chained ourselves to someone that didn't desire us the way we needed to be desired? (Kids, finances, etc.). I feel like I'm rambling now but it's so complicated yet with the right person it's not complicated. This reminds of a class called "Strengthening Your Marriage" held at the church I used to attend. (nothing against the church, just talking about people in general) I did not attend these classes. I wanted to but the controller chose something else. How would that look going there alone? Anyway.... A couple stood before the congregation and gave a story about how well their different love languages worked together. Hers was acts of service, his was touch. The man talked about the services he does for her and how he "then" receives touch. I wanted to shout out, "that's not right!". WHERE'S THE VALUE OF SEX IN THEIR RELATIONSHIP? So he has to earn it. I can only imagine how little he gets ,compared to what he really wants, and how the dangling carrot gets smaller each time ,and gets moved further and further away. Can you imagine being in that group and saying, " tell your wife NO, HECK NO, you give me the touch I need first in a loving selfless manor and expect nothing in return." Now your a sex pervert. But she can tell him what "acts of service" to do, and give nothing in return, and that's perfectly acceptable. HUGE double standard, accepted and embraced by society. Sex as a tool and a weapon to get what she wanted in life. Continues to be taught as a lesson to strengthen your marriage? what a bunch of B.S. The next weapons are finance, children, religion, and the FOG is complete. |
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 27, 2017 11:41:34 GMT -5
That sounds like an accurate analysis of your wife where she valued sex as a tool and weapon in order to get what she wanted in life. Really that's the premise of reset sex, it's a tool to get us to stop nagging them for another month, 6 months, or a year. They know because of the kids, finances, etc we won't leave and when we hit rock bottom they can reset us. What's really sad is nobody wants to be alone in life but lonely is so much worse. Because of the incompatibility with the way they value sex, they made us feel lonely so now the consequences are being alone. The value of sex is clearly about connection but with people who are intimacy averse to some degree they aren't capable of that connection. Sex is just a release or a tool, physical touch is at the bottom of their love language and for us it's in the top three to feel loved so it boils down to incompatibility and why we chained ourselves to someone that didn't desire us the way we needed to be desired? (Kids, finances, etc.). I feel like I'm rambling now but it's so complicated yet with the right person it's not complicated. This reminds of a class called "Strengthening Your Marriage" held at the church I used to attend. (nothing against the church, just talking about people in general) I did not attend these classes. I wanted to but the controller chose something else. How would that look going there alone? Anyway.... A couple stood before the congregation and gave a story about how well their different love languages worked together. Hers was acts of service, his was touch. The man talked about the services he does for her and how he "then" receives touch. I wanted to shout out, "that's not right!". WHERE'S THE VALUE OF SEX IN THEIR RELATIONSHIP? So he has to earn it. I can only imagine how little he gets ,compared to what he really wants, and how the dangling carrot gets smaller each time ,and gets moved further and further away. Can you imagine being in that group and saying, " tell your wife NO, HECK NO, you give me the touch I need first in a loving selfless manor and expect nothing in return." Now your a sex pervert. But she can tell him what "acts of service" to do, and give nothing in return, and that's perfectly acceptable. HUGE double standard, accepted and embraced by society. Sex as a tool and a weapon to get what she wanted in life. Continues to be taught as a lesson to strengthen your marriage? what a bunch of B.S. The next weapons are finance, children, religion, and the FOG is complete. I understand what you are saying but I think to some degree our minds are a little biased or warped or mindfucked because of our SM. I kind of see both sides of it. So what if her love language is acts of service? As long as they are both getting their needs met. Our group here is a minority in marriage. Only 20% of marriages are sexless. That means 80% of marriages have a fair amount of sex. It may not be as much as one partner wants but 100% compatibility is probably rare. I guess my point here is I don't feel bad for that man, how do we know that he's not getting sex once a week? I guess the value of sex is that it works for them, they meet each other's needs. It's obviously working for them and that's really all that matters. I think the mindfuck that we get from our marriages makes us jaded to some degree. But if he wants to get love then he needs to make her feel loved. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too, nobody knows what happens behind closed doors. For me personally I need a man to initiate, take charge, be dominant, etc. most of the time. Not that I can't initiate or wouldn't. Sexuality is such a personal thing and I don't think that man wanted pity. I think he was happy and proud of his marriage and wanted to share to help others. To some degree sexuality is complicated in a personal way and at the same time it's so uncomplicated when it comes to compatibility. You either are or you're not. You are either attracted or your not. So simple. |
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Post by beachguy on Jan 27, 2017 12:56:54 GMT -5
"Touch in exchange for goods and services"
The problem with that is that it is the exact legal definition of prostitution.
No matter how you sugar coat it or bury it in the sand.
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Post by eternaloptimism on Jan 27, 2017 12:59:36 GMT -5
"Touch in exchange for goods and services" The problem with that is that it is the exact legal definition of prostitution. No matter how you sugar coat it or bury it in the sand. Bloody hell you are right! Its all just bloody weird isn't it. They need to keep to their own kind and leaves us lot to shag ourselves to a very happy death! soooooooo sick of their twisted ways. |
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Post by beachguy on Jan 27, 2017 13:18:04 GMT -5
"Touch in exchange for goods and services" The problem with that is that it is the exact legal definition of prostitution. No matter how you sugar coat it or bury it in the sand. Bloody hell you are right! Its all just bloody weird isn't it. They need to keep to their own kind and leaves us lot to shag ourselves to a very happy death! soooooooo sick of their twisted ways. My wife once accused me of thinking about her as a prostitute. I thought to myself, but kept to myself... "Well, if you are, you're not a very good one, are you?" The difference between my wife, who took acts of service without ever or at best rarely delivering in kind, and that church woman, is that she probably delivers more regularly, and maybe with a smile. But under the covers, "acts of service" is just a code word for asexuality, or sex aversion, or sexual disinterest, or however you fashion a label for it. |
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 27, 2017 13:20:29 GMT -5
It boils down to a break down of communication and avoidance by both parties, both are to blame.
The refusers fault for their dishonesty and using us to meet their needs full well knowing they are not meeting ours.
The refused for avoiding the reality of the situation and not holding the refusers accountable sooner for their poor behavior. We are all too kind but that's also what makes us all very special.
If my H would have been honest and said I don't like fucking you then my life would have turned out differently but that's the past and you just have to move forward and play your hand with the cards you are dealt.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 27, 2017 20:43:10 GMT -5
This reminds of a class called "Strengthening Your Marriage" held at the church I used to attend. (nothing against the church, just talking about people in general) I did not attend these classes. I wanted to but the controller chose something else. How would that look going there alone? Anyway.... A couple stood before the congregation and gave a story about how well their different love languages worked together. Hers was acts of service, his was touch. The man talked about the services he does for her and how he "then" receives touch. I wanted to shout out, "that's not right!". WHERE'S THE VALUE OF SEX IN THEIR RELATIONSHIP? So he has to earn it. I can only imagine how little he gets ,compared to what he really wants, and how the dangling carrot gets smaller each time ,and gets moved further and further away. Can you imagine being in that group and saying, " tell your wife NO, HECK NO, you give me the touch I need first in a loving selfless manor and expect nothing in return." Now your a sex pervert. But she can tell him what "acts of service" to do, and give nothing in return, and that's perfectly acceptable. HUGE double standard, accepted and embraced by society. Sex as a tool and a weapon to get what she wanted in life. Continues to be taught as a lesson to strengthen your marriage? what a bunch of B.S. The next weapons are finance, children, religion, and the FOG is complete. I understand what you are saying but I think to some degree our minds are a little biased or warped or mindfucked because of our SM. I kind of see both sides of it. So what if her love language is acts of service? As long as they are both getting their needs met. Our group here is a minority in marriage. Only 20% of marriages are sexless. That means 80% of marriages have a fair amount of sex. It may not be as much as one partner wants but 100% compatibility is probably rare. I guess my point here is I don't feel bad for that man, how do we know that he's not getting sex once a week? I guess the value of sex is that it works for them, they meet each other's needs. It's obviously working for them and that's really all that matters. I think the mindfuck that we get from our marriages makes us jaded to some degree. But if he wants to get love then he needs to make her feel loved. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too, nobody knows what happens behind closed doors. For me personally I need a man to initiate, take charge, be dominant, etc. most of the time. Not that I can't initiate or wouldn't. Sexuality is such a personal thing and I don't think that man wanted pity. I think he was happy and proud of his marriage and wanted to share to help others. To some degree sexuality is complicated in a personal way and at the same time it's so uncomplicated when it comes to compatibility. You either are or you're not. You are either attracted or your not. So simple. About a year ago i took the love language test again. My results were touch. I also took the test from my wife's perspective, (answering the way i thought she would answer it) and came up with Acts of service. I then studied those questions.Many of the answers are selfish answers. They involve receiving, taking, hardly anything about giving. That is where I have a problem with that being considered a love language. You could say the same for receiving touch and not giving it back. However many of us,(myself included) give touch to get touch. And/or as soon as we get touch we give it right back,even stronger. Acts of service? I give acts of service many, many, times needing little in return. Their is gratification in being a giver, rewards come in different times , means, places etc.. But a taker of acts of service can keep on taking to where those acts of service become random expected chores with no giving on the takers part. Scrubbing a floor for someone does not require, trust, openness, and vulnerability like touch does. I guess they can tell you what a lousy job you did and ruin the trust that way, but that's a lot easier to walk away from that and say, "Thank you I'll do better next time, or okay, you do it instead". They just seem to be in totally different categories. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too. But the answers that go with acts of service have a lot to do with receiving non intimate acts. Second behind that is receiving gifts. Not giving them. How many of us want to recieve touch and not give back? I think I am correct to say, it sounds like you would have to be really abnormal, like you would have to work really hard to not want to do that. I did speak with this man, about a month later. He is younger than me. His kids are about 10 more years younger than mine. I told him some insight about a SM. He sure seemed to relate and understand it. He had a me too attitude towards me ending things. I wondered how deep a FOG he was in. He didn't sound very proud, he acted more like a light bulb went off for him. Probably a perspective that he was un -aware of. Can the two work together? Maybe? I'm not there yet. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 27, 2017 21:00:20 GMT -5
My guess is he - And these are GUESSES (I am a Man - this sort of sounds familiar)
1) May have Erectile Disfunction and is embarrassed (obvious did he try Viagra or Cialis?)
2) He has a porn or sex addiction or "outsourcing" with a lover, etc. (any other sex on the side possibilities) and feels guilty or something and does this as "compensation" in his mind.
3) He really is asexual (which seems like not even a possibility - I cannot imagine me not wanting Sex ever- but that is just me).
4) He is faking it - he really is not attracted to you (for whatever reason among so many) and is just doing this because he is "supposed to" or thinks it will placate you.
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 27, 2017 21:27:02 GMT -5
I understand what you are saying but I think to some degree our minds are a little biased or warped or mindfucked because of our SM. I kind of see both sides of it. So what if her love language is acts of service? As long as they are both getting their needs met. Our group here is a minority in marriage. Only 20% of marriages are sexless. That means 80% of marriages have a fair amount of sex. It may not be as much as one partner wants but 100% compatibility is probably rare. I guess my point here is I don't feel bad for that man, how do we know that he's not getting sex once a week? I guess the value of sex is that it works for them, they meet each other's needs. It's obviously working for them and that's really all that matters. I think the mindfuck that we get from our marriages makes us jaded to some degree. But if he wants to get love then he needs to make her feel loved. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too, nobody knows what happens behind closed doors. For me personally I need a man to initiate, take charge, be dominant, etc. most of the time. Not that I can't initiate or wouldn't. Sexuality is such a personal thing and I don't think that man wanted pity. I think he was happy and proud of his marriage and wanted to share to help others. To some degree sexuality is complicated in a personal way and at the same time it's so uncomplicated when it comes to compatibility. You either are or you're not. You are either attracted or your not. So simple. About a year ago i took the love language test again. My results were touch. I also took the test from my wife's perspective, (answering the way i thought she would answer it) and came up with Acts of service. I then studied those questions.Many of the answers are selfish answers. They involve receiving, taking, hardly anything about giving. That is where I have a problem with that being considered a love language. You could say the same for receiving touch and not giving it back. However many of us,(myself included) give touch to get touch. Acts of service? I give acts of service many, many, times needing little in return. Their is gratification in being a giver, rewards come in different times , means, places etc.. But a taker of acts of service can keep on taking to where those acts of service become random expected chores with no giving on the takers part. Scrubbing a floor for someone does not require, trust, openness, and vulnerability like touch does. I guess they can tell you what a lousy job you did and ruin the trust that way, but that's a lot easier to walk away from that and say, "Thank you I'll do better next time, or okay, you do it instead". They just seem to be in totally different categories. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too. But the answers that go with acts of service have a lot to do with receiving non intimate acts. Second behind that is receiving gifts. Not giving them. How many of us want to recieve touch and not give back? I think I am correct to say, it sounds like you would have to be really abnormal, like you would have to work really hard to not want to do that. I did speak with this man, about a month later. He is younger than me. His kids are about 10 more years younger than mine. I told him some insight about a SM. He sure seemed to relate and understand it. He had a me too attitude towards me ending things. I wondered how deep a FOG he was in. He didn't sound very proud, he acted more like a light bulb went off for him. Probably a perspective that he was un -aware of. Can the two work together? Maybe? I'm not there yet. I guess it boils down to compatibility. If touch is number one for open person and number five for the other then it's not going to work. Touch is actually number 3 for me. There are 2 love languages that are more important to me. Words of affirmation and quality time. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 27, 2017 21:37:28 GMT -5
About a year ago i took the love language test again. My results were touch. I also took the test from my wife's perspective, (answering the way i thought she would answer it) and came up with Acts of service. I then studied those questions.Many of the answers are selfish answers. They involve receiving, taking, hardly anything about giving. That is where I have a problem with that being considered a love language. You could say the same for receiving touch and not giving it back. However many of us,(myself included) give touch to get touch. Acts of service? I give acts of service many, many, times needing little in return. Their is gratification in being a giver, rewards come in different times , means, places etc.. But a taker of acts of service can keep on taking to where those acts of service become random expected chores with no giving on the takers part. Scrubbing a floor for someone does not require, trust, openness, and vulnerability like touch does. I guess they can tell you what a lousy job you did and ruin the trust that way, but that's a lot easier to walk away from that and say, "Thank you I'll do better next time, or okay, you do it instead". They just seem to be in totally different categories. Maybe she does initiate sometimes too. But the answers that go with acts of service have a lot to do with receiving non intimate acts. Second behind that is receiving gifts. Not giving them. How many of us want to recieve touch and not give back? I think I am correct to say, it sounds like you would have to be really abnormal, like you would have to work really hard to not want to do that. I did speak with this man, about a month later. He is younger than me. His kids are about 10 more years younger than mine. I told him some insight about a SM. He sure seemed to relate and understand it. He had a me too attitude towards me ending things. I wondered how deep a FOG he was in. He didn't sound very proud, he acted more like a light bulb went off for him. Probably a perspective that he was un -aware of. Can the two work together? Maybe? I'm not there yet. I guess it boils down to compatibility. If touch is number one for open person and number five for the other then it's not going to work. Touch is actually number 3 for me. There are 2 love languages that are more important to me. Words of affirmation and quality time. YES!! Touch was at the lowest bottom for my W. maybe two questions? So it didn't work. Words of affirmation was a close second for me, quality time was third. Now don't those three sound like intimacy and sex? While scrubbing floors, and taking kids everywhere fall right into acts of service, and receiving gifts. Words of affirmation are something I give away on here, a lot. It builds me up! I can't do that to my spouse. They have to be honest. When their honest,and their is no fear of them being rejected, they flow like wine! The rejection has squashed those words. It's going to be so important to have someone I can honestly say those things to, it's been taken from me for years now. I get to affirm my daughters a lot! Another important one for me are my spiritual gifts. Mercy and service. Proving I am a giver, and even struggle with taking. |
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