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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 22, 2017 16:57:54 GMT -5
Today I met a woman at church, briefly. I answered questions for her, introduced myself and helped her. I also found myself sizing her up, like I haven't done in decades, now that I will soon be single again. I later had thoughts of what I would ask her and say to her the next time we meet. (if it even happens)
I am so, so, in the dark about meeting someone new. Thinking it would be anything but a surface acquaintance. I fear I have read, studied, prepared myself, talked about LIASM, to much! That the pendulum has swung so far that I would miss all the other qualities that come with a relationship with another woman. And that I would sound like a sex pervert. Like that accusation, "that's all you think about".
Is there validity in my concerns? Like so many things that are about to happen I know I will be learning from my mistakes. Just hearing about others who have been there makes it easier, to have the confidence to take the risks and not be a total screw up.
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Post by baza on Jan 22, 2017 17:30:54 GMT -5
You know how suggestions here for the spiralling marriage is often to - "see a lawyer in your jurisdiction to establish how a divorce would shake out for you, get an exit strategy and knock it in to do-able shape, attend to your support network and research everything you can about helping kids (if any) transition" ?? Well alternatively, a suggestion for a post ILIASM shithole might go something like this - "See a counsellor in your jurisdiction to establish how you want your life to look once you are out, start working on your re-entry strategy to re-join the real wider world and knock it in to do-able shape, plug in to your support network and your friends and family". GC, you seem pretty well plugged in to the real world via your church activities and suchlike, so I reckon you are going to go ok. You don't seem to have been as isolated as many spouses seem to be. Appears you have kept quite a lot of your life going along pretty normally despite your marital situation. And that, is very much to your credit, and should help a lot as you transition back into the real world.
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Post by itsjustus on Jan 22, 2017 20:27:18 GMT -5
GC, I don't think intimacy and sex become too important after leaving at all. In fact, in my experience, it became "less" important. But let's interpret the word "important" and how it does, or doesn't apply.
First off...sex and intimacy is VERY important to me, but it was when I was still in my SHSM (shit hole sexless marriage™) Now, afterwards, I know to make it a part of my requirements for a budding relationship. I know how to bring it up, and I'm not afraid too. I am in a relationship now, and guess what? It still is.
Now....for what I think you're really asking. And that starts with the word "too". I don't think that it applies in your question. Not in my experience. To whit:
While I was in my SHSM™, I thought of nothing but sex. SEX, SEX, SEX!! My ex's accusation that it was ALL I THINK ABOUT...became true. Every night, I slept next to the one person that I had vowed to make my exclusive partner in life, love, sex and intimacy....and that wasn't happening. So, maybe like you now, I looked at every woman with my knuckles dragging the ground, salivating and generally just making grunting sounds. I was a wreck. I wanted. Just wanted...anything, everything. At home I ached with desire. Movies, tv shows, out in public.... always sizing women up...sexually.
Then I escaped. And I found something pretty amazing. Don't get me wrong, I was still..uh...horny. But being away from the rejection, the constant temptation/rejection, changed the level of my inner Cro-Magnon Man desires. Right from day one!!
In fact, the very thing you're worried about..missing all the other qualities that come with a relationship with a woman, became the most important thing to me. I learned from EP-ILIASM that there were women that wanted sex (still blows me away...). That it was my ex's issues with intimacy and affection that blocked our sex life. That there were many, many other aspects to a real, adult relationship. So, if I could focus on and find a woman that had all the other attributes of what I thought a wonderful relationship should be, could be, sex would flow naturally. You're damn right I'd ask about it....but probably not right on the first date before appetizers! I had hope that that was possible. And I could express it's importance, in an adult way. (Thank you ladies of ILIASM!!! I can never repay that debt!!) My overriding thoughts of lust I had during my SHSM™ decreased dramatically.
Now...I am in a relationship where sex is not only assured, but wonderful! It's natural, organic, just a part of the overall relationship. An important part, for both of us (she is also a SHSM™ alum) but not an overwhelming part, even though at the moment it's a long distance relationship. I have a quiet assurance that has "tamed the beast" in me, making me feel peaceful and fulfilled. (though still horny....lol) I think it's a combination of the the release of the body's hormones that make sex so satisfying, the lesson's I/we learn here, and the feeling of simply being desired and wanted. Of knowing it's important to both of us, and isn't something I have to worry about. It just....is. It's the lesson's I learned here, about the overall dynamics of the relationship, that is important to me.
Was it important? Yes. Too important now? Nope. Not even close.
p.s. - btw, you seem to me to be very thoughtful and very aware of your emotions, feelings and what you need in life. It's the current SHSM™ that has you so worried, IMHO. Go ahead...take the risks. You won't screw it all up.
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Post by lostsomething on Jan 23, 2017 3:12:27 GMT -5
I fear I have read, studied, prepared myself, talked about LIASM, to much! That the pendulum has swung so far that I would miss all the other qualities that come with a relationship with another woman. And that I would sound like a sex pervert. Like that accusation, "that's all you think about". Is there validity in my concerns? Like so many things that are about to happen I know I will be learning from my mistakes. Just hearing about others who have been there makes it easier, to have the confidence to take the risks and not be a total screw up. I'm worried about myself having adopted the behavior and not desiring anyone ever again. My libido went from desiring sex once or more per day to wanting to put my attention elsewhere. I think before I was preoccupied with when I would have my next orgasm. Now I'm occupying my time working towards being successful and moving on. Someday, I may want to find a balanced relationship where sex and intimacy as well as communication are healthy parts of the relationship. Yet, in the back of my mind is the fear that I've become what I hate. Maybe it's just a coping mechanism. Maybe this has been a way to balance out my desires. Someday this curse may seem like a blessing. Save
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Post by worksforme2 on Jan 23, 2017 8:14:42 GMT -5
My early post ISIASM experience... After my now X moved out I decided to ease back into the dating and hopefully sexually active side of life. I took some time thinking it would allow me to mentally adjust to the heady freedom resulting from the separation. About 6 months later I felt I was ready. I wasn't. Fortunately for me my 1st date with a woman turned out to be with a widow who had spent the last 8 yrs. in a SM. She was soon in my bed and I reveled in how simple my transition back to normal sexual activity seemed. Unfortunately we didn't last. I went through a stream of 1 or 2 date attempts that frustrated me. After the 4th short dating letdown I sat down and analyzed what was going on with me. I realized I was way too eager and was finding myself enamored with any woman that paid me some attention. So I had a long talk with myself. I reset my priorities and expectations. I don't know that this was the right fix as I have been much more selective in the women I reach out to. It has also resulted in less success re: my social life. But I'm taking too long to say what I want to say. You are going to have some success and some failures. Just like before you fell into unfortunate circumstances. You are going to make some mistakes. Some of the ladies you meet will be decent matches for you, most probably will not. You won't be a good fit for some of them. In short it really is a roll of the dice. But if you are a normal human being the normal stuff will sort itself out leaving just the particulars for you to concentrate on. I've seen you in action here. You can handle the details and that's where the rubber really meets the road.
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 23, 2017 9:12:01 GMT -5
My post SM just had its one year anniversary this past Friday night.
I started dating (and I use that term loosely) in March, it is more like a meet up for coffee or a drink. I received messages from hundreds of men but I only respond if I'm interested. I've met about 25 men this past year and there's only one man that I've met more than twice.
Most men in the age group I'm attracted to (41-53), are newly divorced and trying to recover from divorce. I also find that they are not so honest except in saying that they want to fuck you. It doesn't seem like online dating apps are the best way to meet someone except that they are convenient. It's just not an organic method of meeting like the old days. For me it's more of an outlet, something to do. I keep my expectations low and move on to the next one whenever he comes along. On the dating apps the men want to meet you once and then just have a fuck buddy. It really is like finding a needle in a haystack.
From what the men have told me, the women are free loaders. They just want a free meal or to find someone to be the fillin baby daddy. There's even someone that are running a business and will say if you pay my bills you can have some fun.
Then sometimes I go out with my ex and the kids and we have a lovely time together but the reality is he didn't want sex or intimacy with me so it still makes me sad.
I do still have my FWB and the sex is amazing still. We love fucking each other. So I am no longer celibate and I go out on a "date" here and there but I have not made a mutual connection with any of the men after one year.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 23, 2017 10:49:25 GMT -5
When I saw this lady she had been talking with another young man. Not just anyone, this young man is mentaly ill, he wanders from seat to seat 5 or 6 times before service, he stutters,is very quircky , hard to understand, and sits alone most all the time. He sat next to her. Well she treated him like a king! Service was over, they were one of the last to leave, I'm standing at the back straightening things, stacking chairs, when they come up to me and he says, "this man will help you". She thanked him and told him how nice he was! I've seen no one treat him this way before. My heart filled with joy, as I thought, "here is a very giving, person, another giver! She told me it was her first time here, she told me her name, and that she wanted to know about our woman's group?
Remember I said I was sizing her up? I'm speaking to her and I am noticing, she has nice long, brown hair, she is petite, 5'4" maybe 100lbs, in her late 40's, no ring, alone, no kids with her,very white teeth, well spoken, and wearing a tight, classy dress!
I tell her "you need to speak to our pastors wife, she is in charge of our woman's group . Come with me I'll introduce you. I introduce her, and right away our pastors wife is complimenting her about her pretty dress. I step back a few seats, turn around, and notice, "there's a whole lot more going on there , than just that dress!!
Before she left I got to ask her,"was that helpful? If anyone could answer your questions I knew she could". She said,"Oh yes very helpful, and I will see you next week!" About all I could say was "okay."
It was just a brief meeting, and me helping her. Probably a lot better than what happens on a dating sight. I have no experience with any dating sights.
It's later in the day, as I'm cleaning the leaves out of the pool, I'm still thinking about her. Right away my mind goes to, "I hope she likes intimacy, and sex...... She better like intimacy, and sex........ I'm going to make sure she likes intimacy, and sex. ......I'm not falling for that again. If it ends up that she wants a friend, or someone to spend money on her, forget it.
Then I'm thinking, "listen to yourself, your so much more than that, a woman is so much more than that. If she has children, you know your going to go crazy over them. If she has needs, you know you are going to want to give, give, give. I just wonder how much stumbling i will do getting to the importance of intimacy, when that time arrives. Bringing it up, and not dwelling on it.
I've had many a surface relationship with women, small talk, sharing about hobbies, backgrounds, careers, families, kids, etc... But mention intimacy, and hearing, I'm not ready for that,( rejection) or whatever the turn off may be... I hope that won't hold me back from the search, and being my true self.
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Post by bballgirl on Jan 23, 2017 11:01:04 GMT -5
Meeting someone in a real organic manner is so much better than dating apps. You should definitely get to know that woman better.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jan 23, 2017 19:27:58 GMT -5
I fear I have read, studied, prepared myself, talked about LIASM, to much! That the pendulum has swung so far that I would miss all the other qualities that come with a relationship with another woman. And that I would sound like a sex pervert. Like that accusation, "that's all you think about". Is there validity in my concerns? Like so many things that are about to happen I know I will be learning from my mistakes. Just hearing about others who have been there makes it easier, to have the confidence to take the risks and not be a total screw up. I'm worried about myself having adopted the behavior and not desiring anyone ever again. My libido went from desiring sex once or more per day to wanting to put my attention elsewhere. I think before I was preoccupied with when I would have my next orgasm. Now I'm occupying my time working towards being successful and moving on. Someday, I may want to find a balanced relationship where sex and intimacy as well as communication are healthy parts of the relationship. Yet, in the back of my mind is the fear that I've become what I hate. Maybe it's just a coping mechanism. Maybe this has been a way to balance out my desires. Someday this curse may seem like a blessing. SaveThanks for your response, and welcome! I can't really relate to comparing, or even thinking about my libido. My libido has stayed the same. I can relate to adapting, and compensating for my environment. To much of my environment was allowed to be controlled by my wife, and my passivity to make any waves. All in the name of, "happy wife= a happy life". (still hear that in commercials today.) A good steady ten years of accepting that intimacy and sex wasn't going to happen any where close to my standards,, and being satisfied with occasional porn, and being super busy with raising 3 toddlers. Then a forth, then two more, then raising, and homeschooling all six. It took several tipping points to realize that our marriage was DOA. I too have concerns that I will be too cautious, to skeptical, as I form new relationships. My hope is that I can take what I have learned, dust myself off, pick myself up (using the strength of others, as well as my own) and take new risks with an much tougher strength, and a clearer understanding of what's best for me. A whole different approach than the person I was 26 yrs ago. I hope you can do the same.
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Post by shamwow on Jan 23, 2017 22:15:53 GMT -5
I just told my wife we are getting divorced yesterday. I have a long time and many things we need tto work out before it happens.
But it is just starting to dawn on me that by having my discussion with her, I've kind of "graduated" into these discussions.
And frankly, they scare the hell out of me.
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Post by itsjustus on Jan 24, 2017 2:45:50 GMT -5
I just told my wife we are getting divorced yesterday. I have a long time and many things we need tto work out before it happens. But it is just starting to dawn on me that by having my discussion with her, I've kind of "graduated" into these discussions. And frankly, they scare the hell out of me. shamwow, congratulations, and....my heartfelt sympathy. You've done the hardest part, saying the 'D' word, and meaning it. That truly is the hardest thing, and part of "graduating" to these discussions. The rest from here, is no cake walk, but that first hurdle was the peak. After you've gone thru the many things you both need to work out, and everything is final, you'll be here in the POst SM group. You'll be in opposite land. Everything will look and feel different. And somethings will be frustrating. But here in opposite land, you'll find that you now have the maturity and (unfortunately) the knowledge of what you DONT want in a relationship, and the will to make sure you don't end up there again. If you combine that with learning to be the best you you can be, and believe in the hope that you can, and will, find a relationship that can be fulfilling, you'll be fine. The stories are sometimes scary, but look where you're coming from. That was always scary. You'll do fine.
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Post by shamwow on Jan 24, 2017 3:20:00 GMT -5
Jumping out of an airplane for the first time was scary as hell, too. I can't wait to do it again.
I've got this.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2017 13:22:50 GMT -5
Meeting someone in a real organic manner is so much better than dating apps. You should definitely get to know that woman better. This! In my ideal fantasy of how my life goes, there is a point at which I and one of my good male friends realize we are actually more than friends...and become lovers and partners. That has never happened for me IRL; generally men either see me as a woman, or they don't, with no slide from friends-to-lovers. So I deal with the dating bullshit. But I can dream, right?
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Post by obobfla on Jan 25, 2017 18:17:48 GMT -5
When I saw this lady she had been talking with another young man. Not just anyone, this young man is mentaly ill, he wanders from seat to seat 5 or 6 times before service, he stutters,is very quircky , hard to understand, and sits alone most all the time. He sat next to her. Well she treated him like a king! Service was over, they were one of the last to leave, I'm standing at the back straightening things, stacking chairs, when they come up to me and he says, "this man will help you". She thanked him and told him how nice he was! I've seen no one treat him this way before. My heart filled with joy, as I thought, "here is a very giving, person, another giver! She told me it was her first time here, she told me her name, and that she wanted to know about our woman's group? Remember I said I was sizing her up? I'm speaking to her and I am noticing, she has nice long, brown hair, she is petite, 5'4" maybe 100lbs, in her late 40's, no ring, alone, no kids with her,very white teeth, well spoken, and wearing a tight, classy dress! I tell her "you need to speak to our pastors wife, she is in charge of our woman's group . Come with me I'll introduce you. I introduce her, and right away our pastors wife is complimenting her about her pretty dress. I step back a few seats, turn around, and notice, "there's a whole lot more going on there , than just that dress!! Before she left I got to ask her,"was that helpful? If anyone could answer your questions I knew she could". She said,"Oh yes very helpful, and I will see you next week!" About all I could say was "okay." It was just a brief meeting, and me helping her. Probably a lot better than what happens on a dating sight. I have no experience with any dating sights. It's later in the day, as I'm cleaning the leaves out of the pool, I'm still thinking about her. Right away my mind goes to, "I hope she likes intimacy, and sex...... She better like intimacy, and sex........ I'm going to make sure she likes intimacy, and sex. ......I'm not falling for that again. If it ends up that she wants a friend, or someone to spend money on her, forget it. Then I'm thinking, "listen to yourself, your so much more than that, a woman is so much more than that. If she has children, you know your going to go crazy over them. If she has needs, you know you are going to want to give, give, give. I just wonder how much stumbling i will do getting to the importance of intimacy, when that time arrives. Bringing it up, and not dwelling on it. I've had many a surface relationship with women, small talk, sharing about hobbies, backgrounds, careers, families, kids, etc... But mention intimacy, and hearing, I'm not ready for that,( rejection) or whatever the turn off may be... I hope that won't hold me back from the search, and being my true self. A woman that nice to a mentally ill man is someone I would like to meet. I suggest you get her number next time you see her.
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Post by obobfla on Jan 25, 2017 18:19:38 GMT -5
Meeting someone in a real organic manner is so much better than dating apps. You should definitely get to know that woman better. This! In my ideal fantasy of how my life goes, there is a point at which I and one of my good male friends realize we are actually more than friends...and become lovers and partners. That has never happened for me IRL; generally men either see me as a woman, or they don't, with no slide from friends-to-lovers. So I deal with the dating bullshit. But I can dream, right? I did the "Harry Met Sally" thing, broke up, and remained friends. She was my barber.
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