I'm not responsible for your happiness

Separation is not the answer to abuse. A complete and permanent end of the relationship is.

I present a unitary option.

What are the odds of that happening, though? We hear about the success stories, like your Debbie and Marshall. But for every Marshall, there are probably 1000 people who cannot manage to stay sober (even with AA) *and* learn to stop f---ing abusing people. Overcoming substance abuse, and retraining your brain not to be an abusive asshole - those are damn difficult tasks.

And for every Debbie, there are probably 1000 people whose love for the abuser was permanently killed by the abuse.

I'm most surprised that she left the kids with him. A lot of people are so addicted to their kids that they won't do that. But it just might be that having to deal with 3 kids all by himself, without a maid/cook/nanny/punching bag/wife, was the thing that really got Marshall's attention.

That's right. She didn't know how that would turn out. She walked back into a situation where it was highly likely that she would get the shit beaten out of her. I forget the stats but a man who hits his wife once is highly likely to do it again.

Like when your spouse reads those books and has no desire to attempt any change in their behavior, but sees it as a guide to sharpen their controlling skills on how to enforce their "no" with a continuing, one sided argument or rationale, of "that's not my problem."

That's when a therapists tells you," your spouse has put forth zero effort, there is nothing left to save here, you are setting a terrible example for the children of what a marriage should be." 

Time for ending a relationship, that separated a long time ago.

And you know that… how? Is there a statistic that actually supports that, or are you just responding emotionally? I would also ask if there is any study that you can cite, or anyone for that matter, that has tracked abusers throughout their lives? I’d be interested in seeing anything that can actually address abuse as a continuous, life-long habit or if age modifies behavior. If anyone knows of literature on this, I’d be interesting in hearing of it.


Again, not sure of stats, but sure you’re right. Marshall did hit Deb, many times. But she finally said enough is enough, took the kids and left. Since you didn’t know what changes Marshall had or had not gone through, I don’t think you can speak to the probability of it continuing. Since you don’t know what support network was in place for Marshall or for Deb, nor cite a relevant statistic, I can only assume yours is a knee-jerk response. I do know that after the AA, Marshall never hit Deb again.

There’s a lot of shibboleths that we like to throw around and they are used so often that their continuous citation becomes their own validation, like:

Once an abuser, always an abuser
Once a cheater, always a cheater (or should that be ‘outsourcer?)
Refusers never change

But the fact is that these statements are rubbish. Abusers can change, cheaters can become faithful, and refusers can learn to see the error of their ways.


Mea culpa - my quick response was confusing. Debbie took the three kids with her. The sudden loss of his family shook Marshall, he got in touch with the pastor of the church who set him on his AA recovery.