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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 8:49:50 GMT -5
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Post by baza on Jul 29, 2016 9:09:37 GMT -5
Yep.
I can see the reasoning.
Communication is key.
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For example -
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When someone communicates to you by their actions that they have no interest in rooting you, the communication is quite clear.
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If the recipient of the communication doesn't "get it", that ain't the fault of the communicator.
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I think a whole lot of people concentrate on their own talking and actions as being the key component of communication. That's only half true.
The 'listening' (to the words) and particularly observation (of the actions) of the other party is just as important.
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 9:50:37 GMT -5
I agree.
I also think that typically, sex is a part of a deeper issue, (when it's not a physical ailment) - often times these issues may be discussed and resolved before they drive one or both partners to apathy.
This is, of course assuming that the partner had a sex drive and "lost it" - If they simply didn't have one to start with - you married the wrong person.
Please keep in mind:
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Post by Dan on Jul 29, 2016 11:38:08 GMT -5
Funny.... I think the #1 reason folks in dysfunctional marriages STAY in the marriage is: the lack of good communication!
I think if good communication was happening -- clear, no blaming, lots of dispassionate, logical discussion -- then most unhappy couples or those in SMs would PROCEED WITH DIVORCE!
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 11:57:36 GMT -5
Yes @dan - I do see that point- but the question I'm posing, is "Would it BECOME dysfunctional in the first place?"
Yes, after the fact- proceeding with divorce is a viable option - but then what? Did we learn to prevent the NEXT relationship from failing?
Or do we we go through partners until we find one that has the faults as we can tolerate or overlook because the sex is there?
Simply put, I'm asking "Can we prevent this from repeating? Can we learn and grow? Can we salvage the marriage or are we too far gone?"
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Post by Dan on Jul 29, 2016 14:48:48 GMT -5
wewbwb : fair questions... but I still don't think it is simple as "good communication solves all" or "prevents all dysfunction". I mean, my wife could be a very articulate... but still a refuser! A good communicator does not necessarily have enough similar interests with you for a close relationship. A good communicator is not necessarily someone willing to change his or her ways for the benefit of the relationship. What I'm getting at is: I 100% agree that the ability to communicate is essential to a marriage... but for that matter, it is important in ANY relationship: with your spouse... or kid or parent or boss or subordinate or co-worker or friend. But I'm not sure if it is "THE" essential feature of a sound marriage any more than common interests, temperament, or views on child-rearing, religion, politics, sex, finances, downtime... And when I say "common" I should probably say "common (or at least compatible)". So in that light, I still beg to differ that "inadequate communication" is always the single "root cause" for any marriage failure.
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 15:19:11 GMT -5
@dan - I see your point - and I may be being naive when I say this:
With good communication skills we would know these things BEFORE we married.
I for one know that I didn't even THINK about these issues before I got married.
I also know that people change and grow, develop different views and outlooks and needs.
All granted, and while you very well may be right - it's NOT the end all and be all - I believe it's a great place to start.
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Post by Rhapsodee on Jul 29, 2016 16:29:52 GMT -5
wewbwb : fair questions... but I still don't think it is simple as "good communication solves all" or "prevents all dysfunction". I mean, my wife could be a very articulate... but still a refuser! A good communicator does not necessarily have enough similar interests with you for a close relationship. A good communicator is not necessarily someone willing to change his or her ways for the benefit of the relationship. What I'm getting at is: I 100% agree that the ability to communicate is essential to a marriage... but for that matter, it is important in ANY relationship: with your spouse... or kid or parent or boss or subordinate or co-worker or friend. But I'm not sure if it is "THE" essential feature of a sound marriage any more than common interests, temperament, or views on child-rearing, religion, politics, sex, finances, downtime... And when I say "common" I should probably say "common (or at least compatible)". So in that light, I still beg to differ that "inadequate communication" is always the single "root cause" for any marriage failure. I agree. You can both communicate until the cows come home, but if the person you're communicating with disregards your communication then things are going to fail. |
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 16:47:01 GMT -5
If the information is disregarded, that is another issue entirely.
And yes again - I am NOT throwing a blanket over ALL relationships and about everything, BUT I still believe good partner communication EARLY and OFTEN can solve many of the issues that lead up to a SM.
Understanding your partner and THEIR point of view and a willingness to compromise are very important.
But (again - NOT a blanket statement) sometimes the partner is just an asshole.
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Post by baza on Jul 29, 2016 20:21:18 GMT -5
Invariably in here, stories tell a tale of refusive spouses behaviours, as observed through the perspective of the refused spouse.
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Invariably, viewed from an outside perspective, the refusive spouse's actions are quite clear.
It is invariably the refused spouse - the one who has an emotional stake in the situation - who just isn't getting the message the refusive spouse is sending.
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Now when (and if) the refused spouse does start getting the message the refusive spouse is sending, things change.
A look at the stories of bbgirl, JMX, elle, and others, shows this in action.
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I think that for the most part, refusive spouses DO send pretty clear messages by their actions.
It is the refused spouse who doesn't get the message - or doesn't want to get the message.
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And that's just as true with the traffic going the other way.
The refused spouse oftentimes has communicated their dis-satisfaction quite clearly, but the refusive spouse doesn't get it - or doesn't want to get it.
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Post by Rhapsodee on Jul 29, 2016 21:47:25 GMT -5
If the information is disregarded, that is another issue entirely. And yes again - I am NOT throwing a blanket over ALL relationships and about everything, BUT I still believe good partner communication EARLY and OFTEN can solve many of the issues that lead up to a SM. Understanding your partner and THEIR point of view and a willingness to compromise are very important. But (again - NOT a blanket statement) sometimes the partner is just an asshole. Or like my hub, they hope you'll simply get over it. He takes pride in the fact that he listens to me. My time would be better served slamming my head against a wall. |
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 22:21:56 GMT -5
Or slamming his.
Did I say that out loud?
Sorry.don't listen to me.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 29, 2016 23:36:17 GMT -5
Very true. This is why sunny optimistic articles about how to fix your sexless marriage are pointless. The handful of couples on EP who turned it around had in common that both took responsibility for the relationship. The rest, tens of thousands of marriages, all walks of life, all kinds of stories and personalities, all had one thing in common: one spouse had things the way they wanted them and was not willing to let anything change.
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Post by wewbwb on Jul 29, 2016 23:59:42 GMT -5
Right both partners wanting the same thing and making it work. Sadly, I know first hand that most of our partners don't even care enough acknowledge anything is even wrong, as long as they get what they want.
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Post by petrushka on Jul 30, 2016 2:29:54 GMT -5
Inappropriate misnomer. For the members of this community that should be the "no-root cause of marriage breakdown".
(sorry, could not resist)
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