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Post by baza on Jun 29, 2016 3:04:16 GMT -5
On June 6 I put up a poll about where people are in their process. Responses have now pretty much dried up, and though the poll is open until June 30, the polling is unlikely to change much. After discounting all those who responded as being out of their ILIASM shithole, here is how it all shook out. - - 36% of responders are planning on staying in their marriages, with leaving not even under consideration. 48% of responders are thinking about the leaving option, but have taken no active steps toward that end as yet 16% of responders are actively in the process of leaving their marriage - - What would be interesting (but I can't figure an accurate way of finding out) is how many - if any - members have altered their position since the poll. Are there people who have abandoned their active pursuit of a divorce ? Are there people who have gone from thinking about it to doing something about it ? Are there people who were stayers now thinking about leaving ? Are there people who were thinking about leaving who have stopped thinking about it ? - - Anyway, thought the membership might be interested in the results. - - Personal observation / thoughts are most welcome.
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Post by olofat on Jun 30, 2016 2:33:37 GMT -5
I oscillate between "staying" and "thinking about leaving," depending on how things are going at the moment. Having scheduled intimacy time has helped me spend a lot more time in the "staying" mode, but there are still "thinking about leaving" times. If I spent half or more of the time on the "thinking of leaving" side, I'd expect to transition to "actively working on leaving" (scary though that is to me).
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Post by baza on Jun 30, 2016 6:08:39 GMT -5
My experience was like yours Brother olofat. I was in the staying stage for years. I didn't have the to and fro stage you describe. I transitioned into the thinking about leaving in about 2003 and stayed there for ages. It was early 2009 when I entered the pro-actively doing something about leaving stage. (I found that once started, that stage developed a momentum all of its' own) The jump to "left" in Oct 2009.
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Post by olofat on Jul 1, 2016 0:30:06 GMT -5
I was briefly in the "actively working on leaving" mode 2-3 years ago. Kids were a factor in the delay / transition back to "staying." (I think kids have a lot to do with the timing. Staying together for the kids isn't necessarily the right answer, but it's often a major factor. Was that a factor for you?) Then things improved, partly because of the relative success of scheduling intimacy. Things are okay but not great. I don't want out, but I do want improvement "in." Like most marriages, I suppose.
Glad you found success via finally transitioning out and then to better relationship! After putting up with the bad so long, you sure deserved the good.
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Post by baza on Jul 1, 2016 0:58:05 GMT -5
By the time I left, only one of the kids was a minor Brother olofat. As far as my leaving went, the kids were "a" consideration, finances were "a" consideration, what people thought was "a" consideration, all sorts of things were "a" consideration, the paucity of sex was "a" consideration. And of these assorted "considerations", probably none of them - as a single issue - were enough to propel me out. But THE main consideration was the fact that the total picture - of all the assorted considerations - was making me deeply unhappy.
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Post by eternaloptimism on Jul 1, 2016 8:03:36 GMT -5
I'm still stuck in thinking about leaving. Nothing has changed
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Post by itsjustus on Jul 1, 2016 11:13:59 GMT -5
I am fortunate to share with someone today her first step in being fully in the Actively In The Process Of Leaving category. I say "fully", because the hardest part, the most difficult part that she faced, I faced, and anyone here faces, is the actual decision to leave, and to tell the SO that that decision....is final. With that, there can be a huge flood of relief. The secrets out. The thoughts of leaving are out in the open. The decisions finally....finally...been made, and done, out loud. Maybe you've said it before. Maybe you've talked about it before. But all your thoughts about it, the millions of thoughts and words that bounced around only in your mind about this moment, have been released. Sadness? Sure. Guilt? Probably. But...it's done. And she had already done that.
But what happens from there, from that moment on, can be....no....IS...scary. Making it real. All the things that HAVE TO HAPPEN!! Ton's and ton's of things! Literally thousands of decisions to be made, big and small. All the things you know you have to do. All the things you know you have to decide. Who moves? What happens to the house? How is the financial split going to happen? Where to move too? A new job? What new job? Where? How will you afford to live while you do all of this? Who gets the dog, the cat? What happens to the china that Aunt Millie gave you both as a wedding gift? OMG...LOOK!! You both LOVE that throw rug that you bought together. Who gets that?? And even then, with the life experiences you have, you know for a fact that with something this big, there are things you don't even KNOW you have to do or decide yet. Don't even start with what you're going to do about relationships in the future!!!! DATING?!?! OMG!!! NOOOOO!!!! IT'S ALL FREAKIN SCARY!!!! Some people can power thru that. Things as they are at the moment are so horrible, immediate escape is the only option, the only thought. But for some, most I'd say, me included, it's overwhelming.
And it's very easy to get stuck. Stuck in a cycle of thinking of all of it at once, letting it become a tornado of thoughts that spin your head, until you do the most natural, human thing. You stop thinking about it. It's just too much to handle. Where you're at now is so much easier to deal with, mentally and emotionally. The STBX ("Soon"?) has already been told. More than likely, you're now Official Housemates. You have your room.....he/she has theirs. You have your stuff....he/she has theirs. Maybe even the finances are now split (I hope so!!!) and you're leading essentially separate lives, but under the same safe, familiar, protective, umbrella/roof. It's not pleasant. It's no picnic. But because of your human nature, AND your STBX's human nature, it can soon become the status quo. The 800# gorilla of the SM now becomes the 1000# gorilla of leaving. It's just not discussed.
Two things can happen. You effectively put the rest of your life on hold. You're "leaving" (someday) because you had too, but when is that someday going to start? When are you going to have color back in your life, starting with pastels when you start that new life, to full color once you find that you HAVE a new life, to hopefully full techni-color if you find someone to share that new life with!! But....it remains a "someday". The other thing that I've seen happen is the STBX can settle into this new dynamic, certainly not happy at first, but they can grow used to it, receive a certain level of emotional sustenance from it, and worse....grow with the false hope that someday, probably any day now, it will change back, it will get better...you will get this crazy notion out of your head and come back into the relationship. We already know, just by being here on ILIASM, that their emotional needs for love and affection, intimacy and even sex, is very low. Just how low can it go is now an active part of your life. You're resolute, but they are going to need constant reminding of that, or they are going to happily or unhappily settle in to this new dynamic. And that's not fair, for either person.
So....what's the answer? What kicks starts the "Making It Real" process. The answer is age old. We all know it, it's an adage you see on posters all over. It's the answer that friends tell you all the time. It's the answer that even a counselor can vaguely give, with high sounding words and encouragement. Just do it! Well....thanks a f**king LOT! That was helpful!! (pure sarcasm). Did I really need a Nike ad to tell me that???
No, that's not the real answer. For me, the real answer was, what is the VERY NEXT THING THAT CAN BE DONE. Not even necessarily NEEDS to be done. CAN be done. Is it screwing up the nerve to finally call a lawyer to schedule an appointment (Even though Baz told us all to do it long ago! LOL. Don't worry, I didn't either....) Maybe it's finally Googling apartments or houses. Hell...maybe it's even grabbing Aunt Millie's china and taking it over to a trusted relative's house for safe keeping! Wrap it up in that favorite throw rug! Whatever.... Whatever it is for you, and this is the important part.....it's a step. A concrete step! A real action step that proves to YOU, that this is real, that this is going to happen, that you are finally on the path to a new life, a better life, a life where even if you're physically alone, you aren't stuck in a place with someone who should never have made you feel alone while they were right there having vowed to never let that happen. REVEL IN IT!! Be Happy about it!
Ant that's the point....that's what makes it all worth it to take that first step, that (yes, I'm going to say it) baby step. This is a good thing. A GREAT thing!! This is YOUR thing. Finally.
Then grab the cat/dog and cuddle, while you think of the next, and only next, step.
Time to look at what the end goal is....and what THE VERY NEXT MINUTUE STEP IS. DO SOMETHING....ANYTHING.
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Post by bballgirl on Jul 1, 2016 14:02:05 GMT -5
itsjustus - you described the mental and emotional process of freeing ourselves from a SM. Telling my H was the hardest thing I had to do in the entire process but it got to the point that I had to just rip that band aid off. I was so happy and felt so relieved. H went into denial and did not think I would do it. I did sneak a few sentimental things out of the house. There's nothing easy about divorce but it gets to a point in life when you realize it's my life and I deserve to be happy too. We are given one life on this Earth and we sacrifice a certain number of years for the kids, the finances, spouses, etc. but at a certain time we should be a little selfish and do something for ourselves so that when we are 65 or 75 we don't look back and say "I should have ---- in my forties or fifties, now it's too late".
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Post by itsjustus on Jul 3, 2016 10:37:38 GMT -5
itsjustus - you described the mental and emotional process of freeing ourselves from a SM. Telling my H was the hardest thing I had to do in the entire process but it got to the point that I had to just rip that band aid off. I was so happy and felt so relieved. H went into denial and did not think I would do it. I did sneak a few sentimental things out of the house. There's nothing easy about divorce but it gets to a point in life when you realize it's my life and I deserve to be happy too. We are given one life on this Earth and we sacrifice a certain number of years for the kids, the finances, spouses, etc. but at a certain time we should be a little selfish and do something for ourselves so that when we are 65 or 75 we don't look back and say "I should have ---- in my forties or fifties, now it's too late". bballgirl, You've described that moment in time where your mind trips. That moment I had where it all boiled over, the thoughts, the resentments, the frustrations...especially the turmoil in my mind about "being selfish"!!! For me, the utmost thing that held me back for so many years!! Until the day it finally hit me... I DONT WANT TO DIE THIS WAY!! I DESERVE TO BE HAPPY TOO! (Guilt and selfishness...a WHOLE other forums worth!!!) But that's what drove me thru all the muddle in my head to finally pull the trigger. Its the afterwards that concerned me then. I guess I was very fortunate. My ex recognized, as did I, that if I didn't love her anymore, wasn't "in love with her" anymore, it was over. Our marriage was over. And she couldn't stay in the same house as me, couldn't stay under the same roof as me, and as our house needed so much work done by me to sell, she moved out. We actually lived in "Limbo Land" for the next year before the house sold, we went thru all the 32 years worth of "us", splitting everything (I got Aunt Millie's China and the dog. She got the rug) and finally filed for divorce. It was another legally mandated 60 days before it was final. That all went "smoothly", though her anger issues hit a high water mark through it all, but she did see the inevitability of it, and I finally crawled up on the shore of Opposit Land, beaten and battered, but alive. What I'm addressing above are those who are stuck on the island of Limbo Land between the raging waters of making and announcing the decision and the raging waters of actually going thru a divorce on the way to Opposit Land. Stuck thru economics, thru the legal system (a one year waiting period? REALLY?!?!) or just the overwhelming reality of it all, with a passive/aggressive spouse that has absolutely no interest in pushing the point...help make it move along, and are not only in complete denial, but are "happy" with the new dynamic. You can get trapped in the isolation of Limbo Land and spend another "life times" worth of being unhappy, unfulfilled, and feeling guilty or selfish. Those raging waters of divorce are scary, you know they are, and you know that you're going to have to hurt that person all over again doing it. Open the wounds, all over again. The longer you wait, the worse it gets....for you. And there goes more time....wasted time...until some kind of "push" comes along that pushes you into the raging waters of getting a divorce and you struggle to survive not drowning while you swim to the shores of Opposite Land. None of it's easy. There's various degrees of how difficult it is going to be, and you don't get to completely control it. I hated it. I hated being trapped there. But I was watching time...MY TIME..that I fought so hard for, against myself(!) to get....ticking by. But if you want to finally be happy...if you want to be out of the complete pain of the "old life"....you have to find the courage to jump in...and swim. For some, that's hard. Very hard. Throw something...anything...in, and jump in after it. Take the next step.
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Post by bballgirl on Jul 3, 2016 11:24:10 GMT -5
itsjustus - that was beautifully said. It's very scary, filled with so many emotions. Our divorce was amicable and quick. He even helped me pack. Lol. His anger had ups and downs but I stayed calm because I knew it was just the grief talking. I moved out. I had to leave and start a new life for myself. I moved out in the middle of the night, the first day I was able to get into my new place and he was screaming at me while I loaded up boxes, he threatened to unpack everything, I just kept going. Ex and I are amicable and life goes on after divorce, it's not the end of the world.
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Post by JMX on Jul 4, 2016 8:31:32 GMT -5
Argh. I need to do an update. Still wrapping my head around everything though.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jul 4, 2016 8:38:31 GMT -5
Argh. I need to do an update. Still wrapping my head around everything though. That would be nice. Many of us still care and are concerned about your situation. Hope you are coping, learning and healing as you go through your trial and tribulations. Feel free to express your questions and doubts as you go through things.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2016 8:49:09 GMT -5
If you ask me, the point at which leaving (or for that matter any process) becomes real is when lawyers get involved. Once you write that first check for a few thousand dollars, you'll know the ship has left the harbor.
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