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Post by Apocrypha on Nov 7, 2019 17:07:08 GMT -5
At some point - hopefully - you figure out that you are chasing the wrong persons "why". And maybe you start looking at yourself, in particular your own why. Why you cop this bullshit ? And that question inevitably brings to light some pretty confronting answers, and oftentimes hi-lights that you have some of your own shit to sort out. "If you feel so unloved and unwanted, why do you keep pulling on this rope?" asked our third and final therapist, in one of our final sessions before I called time of death. "Because if I stop making an effort, there will be no marriage!" I blurted, accidentally revealing the truth to myself. Birthing that utterance was joyful, painful and embarrassing, like having a doctor extract some impressive and horrible piece of impacted ear wax and showing you. I turned it over and over in my mind for a few weeks. To this day, I don't know if the therapist meant for me to land there, orchestrating my own self-revelation, or if it was an accident.
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Post by elkclan2 on Nov 8, 2019 3:38:20 GMT -5
I became Cinderella. I waited on her hand foot and finger. Since all the books said this would stop her feeling overworked and unappreciated it felt the right move. Turned out I became overworked and under appreciated. I did this one. It's a recommended approach in the sex starved wife along with no pressure. So then you become sex starved and overworked and under appreciated. He only seemed to notice my extra effort when I stopped doing it. I'm now in a relationship where my partner does more than his fair share (I think) and also thanks me for every meal I make (I do most of the cooking). He did make me do most of the work in bed this morning though. ;-)
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Post by Handy on Nov 8, 2019 12:08:43 GMT -5
Elkclan2 He only seemed to notice my extra effort when I stopped doing it.
Same here and my W commented that "I USED TO BE a nice guy" before I cut back on most of the extra services.
Doing extra work in bed is good for you Elkclan2. WTG!
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Post by h on Nov 8, 2019 12:25:55 GMT -5
I became Cinderella. I waited on her hand foot and finger. Since all the books said this would stop her feeling overworked and unappreciated it felt the right move. Turned out I became overworked and under appreciated. I did the same thing, taking on most of the household chores on top of being the primary income earner. Turned out the same way too.
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Post by h on Nov 8, 2019 12:42:41 GMT -5
I became Cinderella. I waited on her hand foot and finger. Since all the books said this would stop her feeling overworked and unappreciated it felt the right move. Turned out I became overworked and under appreciated. I did this one. It's a recommended approach in the sex starved wife along with no pressure. So then you become sex starved and overworked and under appreciated. He only seemed to notice my extra effort when I stopped doing it. I'm now in a relationship where my partner does more than his fair share (I think) and also thanks me for every meal I make (I do most of the cooking). He did make me do most of the work in bed this morning though. ;-) I can relate to that. (The first part) She complained when I quit going above and beyond but never seemed to notice the things I did before I quit. She said I was lazy even though I still do more than half the weekly chores. She even told her parents that. She stopped that line of name calling when I told her that she could start cooking dinner 3 times a week and wash her own laundry.
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Post by Apocrypha on Nov 8, 2019 13:28:35 GMT -5
I did this one. It's a recommended approach in the sex starved wife along with no pressure. So then you become sex starved and overworked and under appreciated. He only seemed to notice my extra effort when I stopped doing it. I'm now in a relationship where my partner does more than his fair share (I think) and also thanks me for every meal I make (I do most of the cooking). He did make me do most of the work in bed this morning though. ;-) I can relate to that. (The first part) She complained when I quit going above and beyond but never seemed to notice the things I did before I quit. She said I was lazy even though I still do more than half the weekly chores. She even told her parents that. She stopped that line of name calling when I told her that she could start cooking dinner 3 times a week and wash her own laundry. There is an incredible amount of sexist bullshit advice out there that treats men as sloths or cavemen. One thing I learned from years of marital counselling and countless books, discussions and articles on the subject, you can solve real problems with your household work, personal attractiveness, the demeanor you present outwardly, your time management and much much more. These things may objectively improve the way you manage your household, your attractiveness, your demeanor etc. You might fight less, or get along better in general. Your life may improve. But I don't often see "finding you sexually desirable again" to correlate to any of those things. Indeed- when it occurred to me to ask my psychiatrist that question, after he'd helped us improve our personal relations, he admitted that a lack of improvement to the sex life was also a normal result, and I think, even the most common result.
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Post by baza on Nov 8, 2019 18:47:18 GMT -5
I agree with Brother Apocrypha - "you can solve real problems with your household work, personal attractiveness, the demeanor you present outwardly, your time management and much much more. These things may objectively improve the way you manage your household, your attractiveness, your demeanor etc. You might fight less, or get along better in general. Your life may improve". Yes, in some cases an ILIASM marriage may have the capability of improving quite a lot. In a best case scenario with two capable and motivated spouses you might be able to negotiate your way to where you might be able to produce a "workable room mate" situation. And that would be a HUGE improvement on an ILIASM set up ..... presupposing your ILIASM deal does have that potential. The two questions that arise are - (a) - does your ILIASM deal have the potential to be a workable room mate scenario ? (b) - would a workable room mate scenario be enough to hold you in the situation ?
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Post by Apocrypha on Nov 8, 2019 23:11:20 GMT -5
She said I was lazy even though I still do more than half the weekly chores. She even told her parents that. Contempt is the issue here, not chores. There maybe disagreements, arguments, misunderstandings, faux pas, misalignments, disappointments, and real problems to contend with - but contempt is like a fossilization of those. The expression of contempt within a relationship is like lighting your own house on fire. It's not interested in productive conflict - it's about humiliating your partner - tearing them down in front of - in this case - her parents. It's a peculiar one - because even if she wants to tell the world that you are a lazy oaf, what does that say about her for choosing you? John Gottman says in his clinical practice - the presence of contempt predicts with over 90% accuracy that you are going to get divorced. In single/dating life and in my post-marriage relationships, I pay a lot of attention to this one - the manner in which a partner contends with me and explores a disagreement. I've cut several short term (3-4 month) relationships in which my partner chose to salt the earth by emasculating or excoriating me, rather than offering grace, the benefit of the doubt, and exploring productively how we can articulate our needs and contend with each other. My present partner - going on two years and a bit now - is very different from me in many ways, but we are able to explore disagreement without contempt.
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