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Post by baza on May 24, 2019 2:22:23 GMT -5
If you join this group it is a given that you are only too well aware what living in an ILIASM deal is like. You are probably something of an expert in this field.
What you probably don't usually know a real lot about, is what the alternative - not being in an ILIASM deal - might look like., or how you might get there. So if you are to make a fully informed choice about your way forward, it is the "not being in an ILIASM deal" area where you are probably not particularly well informed.
Consequently, many comments on your post might attract ask some very pointed questions about the advisability of the "staying" option. And put forward the "leaving" option for consideration. That might come across as endorsing the "leave" option as the path that ought be followed by everyone. Or perhaps it might come across as "stuffing the leave option down your throat". That's not really the message.
I think that the underlying message here is, that you need to make a fully informed choice. And just about any member here is - or was once - an expert in being fully informed about what living in an ILIASM deal is like. And there are a number who are fully informed about what not being in an ILIASM deal is like too. So consequently, a lot of comment/suggestion/advice is slanted toward the leave option .... the option that a newbie may not know a real lot about.
See, if you fully check out the leave option, and add it to your first hand knowledge of what the stay option involves, then, you can make a fully informed choice. Without that information, you are not fully informed. "What" you choose is entirely down to you .... but as long as you make a fully informed choice, you really can't go too far wrong.
And it seems that those who have made a fully informed choice are the happier people on here - whether they made a fully informed choice to leave or to stay.
On the other hand, if you make a choice based on only half the information .... only half the options .... the chances of that working out in your longer term best interests are not real good.
Again, this is NOT pushing the line that the "leave" option is the way to go for all. Nor is it pushing the line that the "stay" option is the answer for all either. But it IS certainly pushing the line that you need to make a fully informed choice, own it, and live it.
What that choice ultimately is, is entirely your business, and no-one else's.
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Post by ironhamster on May 24, 2019 5:33:44 GMT -5
Anyone that shows up here is likely here to find a solution to their sexless marriage. I am here, and other sites. Occasionally, I see a post from one of us refused, or even a refuser, and I think, if only my ex had been like that, we could have made it work. That is just me, though, and only based on what the post reveals.
Unfortunately, the vast majority are not like that. Most people know there is something wrong, but focus on the most obvious symptom. The sex. I know I was in this camp, too. Everything was great, except the sex. How blind I was.
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Post by sadkat on May 24, 2019 9:03:53 GMT -5
I would agree with you @ Baza- I consider myself an expert on accepting life in a SM. After all, I lived it for over 20 years. I’m at the point now of learning about “oppositeland”- it fills me with hope for a happier life but the process of getting there is very painful. Right now, I have a lot of self doubt and I’m scared of what I’ll be facing. I’ve become a lot stronger and have learned to stand up for myself. When I came to ILIASM, I knew my marriage wasn’t great and I knew that I needed to get out or I’d continue to suffer mentally and emotionally. I too received some hard truths from members here. I didn’t like to hear them (who does?) but I used them to help me get to where I am today. For me, it’s important to pay it forward so I will not shy away from telling people hard truths based on my perspectives gained from very tough experiences.
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Post by iceman on May 24, 2019 11:28:22 GMT -5
Anyone that shows up here is likely here to find a solution to their sexless marriage. I am here, and other sites. Occasionally, I see a post from one of us refused, or even a refuser, and I think, if only my ex had been like that, we could have made it work. That is just me, though, and only based on what the post reveals. Unfortunately, the vast majority are not like that. Most people know there is something wrong, but focus on the most obvious symptom. The sex. I know I was in this camp, too. Everything was great, except the sex. How blind I was. Completely agree. Sexlessness is both one of the symptoms and one of the causes of a bad marriage. Not the sole symptom or cause, but one of many symptoms and causes. Understanding that is crucial. if one focuses just on the sex IMHO one is not going to make much progress. i know for me I too focused on sex initially and then I realized there was so much more wrong with my marriage, so much that it boggled my mind. At this point I don’t really think much at all about sex with my wife, or sex in general for that matter. Sure I’d like to have sex. Some of you may recall that I had a FWB arrangement with my ex for a while but it it has ended. The sex was nice but beyond the sex there was nothing else in the relationship and that was just unacceptable to both of us so we agreed to stop on good terms. That’s about where things are between my wife and me. Even if we agreed to start having sex again our marriage would still be utterly broken.
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Post by worksforme2 on May 24, 2019 11:35:17 GMT -5
i know for me I too focused on sex initially and then I realized there was so much more wrong with my marriage, so much that it boggled my mind. At this point I don’t really think much at all about sex with my wife, or sex in general for that matter. Sure I’d like to have sex. Some of you may recall that I had a FWB arrangement with my ex for a while but it it has ended. The sex was nice but beyond the sex there was nothing else in the relationship and that was just unacceptable to both of us so we agreed to stop on good terms. That’s about where things are between my wife and me. Even if we agreed to start having sex again our marriage would still be utterly broken. This narrative is a bit hard for me to follow. Is the FWB relationship you had something with your 1st wife? How could you have a FWB relationship with the woman with whom you are in SM?
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Post by iceman on May 24, 2019 12:13:29 GMT -5
i know for me I too focused on sex initially and then I realized there was so much more wrong with my marriage, so much that it boggled my mind. At this point I don’t really think much at all about sex with my wife, or sex in general for that matter. Sure I’d like to have sex. Some of you may recall that I had a FWB arrangement with my ex for a while but it it has ended. The sex was nice but beyond the sex there was nothing else in the relationship and that was just unacceptable to both of us so we agreed to stop on good terms. That’s about where things are between my wife and me. Even if we agreed to start having sex again our marriage would still be utterly broken. This narrative is a bit hard for me to follow. Is the FWB relationship you had something with your 1st wife? How could you have a FWB relationship with the woman with whom you are in SM? Yes, the FWB relationship was with my first wife. I’m on wife #2. The point is trying to make that sex alone is not enough to save or break a marriage. In the case of my first wife our sex life was fabulous and our marriage was still broken. In the case of my current wife just reviving our sex life to something that’s acceptable won’t fix our broken marriage. There’s a lot going on in a marriage besides sex, or lack there of.
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endthegame
Junior Member
Posts: 96
Age Range: 46-50
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Post by endthegame on May 24, 2019 12:57:29 GMT -5
I think a problem with making a fully informed choice about the differences between an ILIASM deal and a healthy intimate and sexual relationship based on equality, sharing and support, is you don't know / remember what healthy and good is any more.
I spoke to a lot of members on this forum and its predecessor on EP. I had lost touch with reality. A SM really does mess with your thinking on a very fundamental level.
I think this forum allows us to accept and understand that a marriage is broken, but to see things from 2 perspectives one needs to have lived in both worlds. I feel this is where people who outsource get a glimpse of 'better' even if it's not a glimpse of 'good'.
My personal view from opposite land is that I have returned (and continue to return/recover) to normal.
I highly recommend searching for a good healthy relationship, good healthy friends and self growth.
If I could give any advice based on 2 decades of SM followed by opposite land is that this forum has a high proportion of people too scared to take the leap into opposite land.
For the record, the leap isn't that bad after the event. Seriously, go to a swimming pool, stand on the high board and just step off. This isn't a metaphor, loterally do it. You will shit yourself on the edge, and more so on the way down, but it's over in a flash.
Then you're in opposite land, the water is refreshing, your heart is beating and you swim to the steps and climb.
Keep climbing.
Opposite land is better, but that's my opinion.
The irony here is in a SM you are actually drowning before you hit the water. An SM will drown you in your own misery.
That one'a a metaphor btw.
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Post by sadkat on May 24, 2019 13:39:46 GMT -5
Well said endthegame! All I can say is that I look forward to reaching those steps and climbing out!
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