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Post by baza on Jul 22, 2018 18:52:21 GMT -5
In my time on here and the precursor EP group (since 2009) I reckon I've read thousands of stories, comments, suggestions etc in regard to dysfunctional marriages.
I cannot recall a single one where I read it, then thought - "Shit, this person has jumped the gun and has left way too quick".
Now given that the marriages seen in here are very much the arse end of the dysfunctional marriage demographic, that's hardly surprising, but in my life generally I can't think of any examples in my family, friends or acquaintances where I thought - "Geez, they left way too quick" either.
And on a personal level, I hung in for 3 decades, and don't feel I left too quick.
If anything, I reckon people (myself included) tend to hang on for too long, longer than is healthy.
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Post by choosinghappy on Jul 23, 2018 5:38:33 GMT -5
In my time on here and the precursor EP group (since 2009) I reckon I've read thousands of stories, comments, suggestions etc in regard to dysfunctional marriages. I cannot recall a single one where I read it, then thought - "Shit, this person has jumped the gun and has left way too quick". Now given that the marriages seen in here are very much the arse end of the dysfunctional marriage demographic, that's hardly surprising, but in my life generally I can't think of any examples in my family, friends or acquaintances where I thought - "Geez, they left way too quick" either. And on a personal level, I hung in for 3 decades, and don't feel I left too quick. If anything, I reckon people (myself included) tend to hang on for too long, longer than is healthy. My STBX and I just passed our 6 year anniversary before deciding to go our separate ways. And even I don’t feel I left too quick. It’s never too soon to get out of an unhappy situation and choose to reclaim yourself and work towards the life you want. |
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Post by beachguy on Jul 25, 2018 11:14:41 GMT -5
Nice to see someone not mindlessly demanding that people remain in toxic relationships just for the sake of remaining in a relationship.
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Post by elkclan2 on Jul 25, 2018 11:59:13 GMT -5
Rarely, if ever, does anyone come to these pages looking to give up too quickly. We are not the audience for the 'stick it out, give it another chance'. We are the audience for "For god's sake, just go!"
I remember buying tons of books - like "Too good to leave, too bad to stay" and my result on the basic checklist was "Why the fuck aren't you gone already?"
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Post by beachguy on Jul 25, 2018 12:22:37 GMT -5
I have a strong sense that people with secure attachment styles and a libido leave sexless relationships before the first sexless year is out.
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Post by twotimesone on Jul 27, 2018 3:53:09 GMT -5
I think there are many factors in choosing to end or mend the marriage and there is a different case for everybody. Years ago, my W was pissed off at me and openly threaten me with divorce. I think my W is childish in making a selfish decision like this because we have young kids and I think it would be bad for them. I think my W and maybe many W in general that it is okay that once they have kids, it is okay to neglect their H.
For me I chose to stay and worked out with the situation with my W. At least with the SM situation is a little better as we do it at about once every 2-3 weeks, though she is almost like a starfish when we do it. But I chose to stay to bring some stability into the household, and hopefully teach my values to my kids. I will probably leave my W and do my own thing once when the kids are out of the nest.
I thought about the whole gender equality thing are hurting marriages in general as a side effect. Not because there shouldn't be gender equality, but women are taught to be independent of men really puts women in this kind of marriage is for me vs for us. I'm not saying that a woman should be dependent to their husbands, but I wish that they put some effort in working it out before ending it too soon.
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Post by baza on Jul 27, 2018 4:40:23 GMT -5
Personally Brother twotimesone I don't think gender has anything to do with it. Spouses (IMHO) *should* be independent of each other. I see that as a very healthy thing. It means that if the couple stay together, it is because they want to - not because they feel obligated to. |
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Post by shamwow on Jul 27, 2018 8:22:23 GMT -5
I think there are many factors in choosing to end or mend the marriage and there is a different case for everybody. Years ago, my W was pissed off at me and openly threaten me with divorce. I think my W is childish in making a selfish decision like this because we have young kids and I think it would be bad for them. I think my W and maybe many W in general that it is okay that once they have kids, it is okay to neglect their H. For me I chose to stay and worked out with the situation with my W. At least with the SM situation is a little better as we do it at about once every 2-3 weeks, though she is almost like a starfish when we do it. But I chose to stay to bring some stability into the household, and hopefully teach my values to my kids. I will probably leave my W and do my own thing once when the kids are out of the nest. I thought about the whole gender equality thing are hurting marriages in general as a side effect. Not because there shouldn't be gender equality, but women are taught to be independent of men really puts women in this kind of marriage is for me vs for us. I'm not saying that a woman should be dependent to their husbands, but I wish that they put some effort in working it out before ending it too soon. I'm confused as to the lesson you're trying to teach your kids. That it is better to model an example of marriage where mom and dad are roommates. That dad is forced to stay in misery because of them (no guilt there). Whether that is your intention or not, this is what you will be modeling to them. When children grow and form their own relationships the best example they have to work from is their parents. If you have a son would you want him to be brow beaten into sexual submission? Would you want your daughter to believe that withholding affection and flying off the handle threatening divorce is acceptable? Your choice to stay is absolutely valid. But "staying for the kids" is a double edged sword. It is a way to give the kids stability at best. It is a way to propogate your misery to your children at worst. Just my 2 cents |
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Post by bballgirl on Jul 27, 2018 9:32:24 GMT -5
Personally Brother twotimesone I don't think gender has anything to do with it. Spouses (IMHO) *should* be independent of each other. I see that as a very healthy thing. It means that if the couple stay together, it is because they want to - not because they feel obligated to. I agree with you. SM is not a gender thing an EP was proof: 50,000 members and about 50/50 male/ female membership. The bottom line is and I know you know this - people either like sex or they don’t, a couple is either sexually compatible or they’re not. Sex is part of marriage in my opinion and if sex is not present then they do not deserve the financial, social, etc. perks of marriage. twotimesone - I promise you there are plenty of women who are independent that enjoy sex so much. |
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Post by northstarmom on Jul 27, 2018 11:15:45 GMT -5
"I think there are many factors in choosing to end or mend the marriage and there is a different case for everybody. Years ago, my W was pissed off at me and openly threaten me with divorce. I think my W is childish in making a selfish decision like this because we have young kids and I think it would be bad for them. I think my W and maybe many W in general that it is okay that once they have kids, it is okay to neglect their H.
For me I chose to stay and worked out with the situation with my W. At least with the SM situation is a little better as we do it at about once every 2-3 weeks, though she is almost like a starfish when we do it. But I chose to stay to bring some stability into the household, and hopefully teach my values to my kids. I will probably leave my W and do my own thing once when the kids are out of the nest.
I thought about the whole gender equality thing are hurting marriages in general as a side effect. Not because there shouldn't be gender equality, but women are taught to be independent of men really puts women in this kind of marriage is for me vs for us. I'm not saying that a woman should be dependent to their husbands, but I wish that they put some effort in working it out before ending it too soon."
Sex lacking as you feel your marriage is, at starfish sex every other week, your marriage doesn't fit the technical definition of SM, which is 10 times a year or less. Most here who divorce have gone at minimum months without sex but some have gone years even decades without sex. I'd had 8 straight sexless years, 5 other sexless years and other years that met the technical definition of SM. I was married 34 years. I also am independent and thoroughly enjoy sex at least 3 times a week with my post SM partner of 5 years.
As for your thoughts on independence: men and women should be able to live independently of partners because all relationships end in death or divorce.
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Post by twotimesone on Jul 27, 2018 12:34:34 GMT -5
I think there are many factors in choosing to end or mend the marriage and there is a different case for everybody. Years ago, my W was pissed off at me and openly threaten me with divorce. I think my W is childish in making a selfish decision like this because we have young kids and I think it would be bad for them. I think my W and maybe many W in general that it is okay that once they have kids, it is okay to neglect their H. For me I chose to stay and worked out with the situation with my W. At least with the SM situation is a little better as we do it at about once every 2-3 weeks, though she is almost like a starfish when we do it. But I chose to stay to bring some stability into the household, and hopefully teach my values to my kids. I will probably leave my W and do my own thing once when the kids are out of the nest. I thought about the whole gender equality thing are hurting marriages in general as a side effect. Not because there shouldn't be gender equality, but women are taught to be independent of men really puts women in this kind of marriage is for me vs for us. I'm not saying that a woman should be dependent to their husbands, but I wish that they put some effort in working it out before ending it too soon. I'm confused as to the lesson you're trying to teach your kids. That it is better to model an example of marriage where mom and dad are roommates. That dad is forced to stay in misery because of them (no guilt there). Whether that is your intention or not, this is what you will be modeling to them. When children grow and form their own relationships the best example they have to work from is their parents. If you have a son would you want him to be brow beaten into sexual submission? Would you want your daughter to believe that withholding affection and flying off the handle threatening divorce is acceptable? Your choice to stay is absolutely valid. But "staying for the kids" is a double edged sword. It is a way to give the kids stability at best. It is a way to propogate your misery to your children at worst. Just my 2 cents If I we were to divorce, then what is the lesson are we trying to teach to our kids? A divorce is an easy way out and everybody will be happy and the grass is greener on the other side? Kids grow up with either one of parents gone because they are unable to compromise? When one of the parents take, take and take from the other and put nothing in the relationship is healthy? I would want to teach my kids that if you want to be in a married relationship to be good you have to give and receive. At least it is easier to teach my kids when both parents are in the same roof. "Sex lacking as you feel your marriage is, at starfish sex every other week, your marriage doesn't fit the technical definition of SM, which is 10 times a year or less. Most here who divorce have gone at minimum months without sex but some have gone years even decades without sex. I'd had 8 straight sexless years, 5 other sexless years and other years that met the technical definition of SM. I was married 34 years. I also am independent and thoroughly enjoy sex at least 3 times a week with my post SM partner of 5 years. As for your thoughts on independence: men and women should be able to live independently of partners because all relationships end in death or divorce." There's a difference in having sex and making love. Believe it or not, some men want more than empty sex. And every time when we do it she is holding something back. That goes to my definition to independence. I'm not talking about being able to live independently of each other. But it goes back to holding back something that you can provide to each other in the relationship. |
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Post by shamwow on Jul 27, 2018 13:10:11 GMT -5
I'm confused as to the lesson you're trying to teach your kids. That it is better to model an example of marriage where mom and dad are roommates. That dad is forced to stay in misery because of them (no guilt there). Whether that is your intention or not, this is what you will be modeling to them. When children grow and form their own relationships the best example they have to work from is their parents. If you have a son would you want him to be brow beaten into sexual submission? Would you want your daughter to believe that withholding affection and flying off the handle threatening divorce is acceptable? Your choice to stay is absolutely valid. But "staying for the kids" is a double edged sword. It is a way to give the kids stability at best. It is a way to propogate your misery to your children at worst. Just my 2 cents If I we were to divorce, then what is the lesson are we trying to teach to our kids? A divorce is an easy way out and everybody will be happy and the grass is greener on the other side? Kids grow up with either one of parents gone because they are unable to compromise? When one of the parents take, take and take from the other and put nothing in the relationship is healthy? I would want to teach my kids that if you want to be in a married relationship to be good you have to give and receive. At least it is easier to teach my kids when both parents are in the same roof. "Sex lacking as you feel your marriage is, at starfish sex every other week, your marriage doesn't fit the technical definition of SM, which is 10 times a year or less. Most here who divorce have gone at minimum months without sex but some have gone years even decades without sex. I'd had 8 straight sexless years, 5 other sexless years and other years that met the technical definition of SM. I was married 34 years. I also am independent and thoroughly enjoy sex at least 3 times a week with my post SM partner of 5 years. As for your thoughts on independence: men and women should be able to live independently of partners because all relationships end in death or divorce." There's a difference in having sex and making love. Believe it or not, some men want more than empty sex. And every time when we do it she is holding something back. That goes to my definition to independence. I'm not talking about being able to live independently of each other. But it goes back to holding back something that you can provide to each other in the relationship. Nothing about divorce is easy. And it is possible to be better parents to your kids separate and emotionally healthy than together and living a cold war (on full display for the children). But I truly mean it when I say to each their own. In my personal situation leaving worked out as the best for everyone (except perhaps my ex). Yours could be totally different. |
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