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Post by bran127 on Sept 14, 2017 21:40:28 GMT -5
I was at lunch today by myself and there were what I assume were friends sitting at the table next to me. The tables were super close so I couldn't help but listen when the gentleman began talking about his sexless marriage. He wasn't talking loud by any means, but I think my ears were more alert when I heard him say "I can't live without sex anymore and I am resentful". The woman then expressed her struggles and they talked through it and supported each other. He then handed her a letter he wrote that was several pages long. She read it for about 10 minutes and exclaimed how wonderful, articulate, and to the point his letter was and that she wished she could have the strength to do the same. They talked about how it emotionally affects them and the demands they had and how scared they were to put actions in place. He said that he hoped his letter would make her divorce him. He said he would not live this life anymore and the damage was done. He no longer finds her attractive, etc. I know I sound like a total creeper, but it was absolutely surreal to hear them talk. I couldn't make this shit up!!! I typically Do not eat out on my lunch break so it was almost like the universe was speaking to me. Now I come onto ILIASM chat room today and see that many of you are writing letters. I have been contemplating my final move for a couple months (total procrastinaton and mind numbing fear). I think a letter might be the way to express my final thoughts. I obviously know that there will have to be a conversation, but maybe that is the final "spark" I need to execute what I have put in place. I know in my heart a letter isn't going to change shit, but maybe it will force the final conversation I need to have with my roommate. I've never written him a letter expressing my feelings. I've thought about it, but never written anything. Any thoughts are appreciated.
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Post by ironhamster on Sept 14, 2017 21:54:57 GMT -5
From my own brief experience, my bet is the letter will not cause his wife to divorce him.
I've written no letters, but I've had some heated text exchanges and one exposed attempted affair. I'm convinced the next move is mine. She is pretty dug in as a "stay at home mom" and not about to risk that.
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Post by bran127 on Sept 14, 2017 22:10:59 GMT -5
Agreed! The move is ALWAYS ours to make. Trust me when I say that my dude is VERY comfortable with the life I provide for him. quote author=" ironhamster" source="/post/79018/thread" timestamp="1505444097"]From my own brief experience, my bet is the letter will not cause his wife to divorce him. I've written no letters, but I've had some heated text exchanges and one exposed attempted affair. I'm convinced the next move is mine. She is pretty dug in as a "stay at home mom" and not about to risk that. [/quote] |
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Post by ironhamster on Sept 14, 2017 23:12:02 GMT -5
If I dare ask, what useful function does he serve?
One thing nice about writing a letter like that, even for the sake of journaling, is that it helps solidify our thoughts so that, when the time comes, we have more courage to do what we need to do.
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Post by McRoomMate on Sept 14, 2017 23:53:24 GMT -5
Similarly, I was "that guy" talking with many many friends about my SM. I was amazed to see how many live in SM or had lived in one and now escaped. Some were quite happy or apathetic about it. No bother - they admitted their low libido and one even said he refused to take Viagra because he felt like he was being raped. Others were outsourcing and keeping their mouths shut and the marriage going. Also talked with friends in couples married for many many years who enjoyed still wonderful intimacy and sex lives. It is a statistical fact that about say 30% to 40% of long term couples have happy fulfilling intimacy and sex lives. Even on a biological level our brains are evolutionary hardwired to "fall in love" (dominated by dopamine) and then morph / evolve into long term "attachment" (dominated by Oxycotin in women and vasopressin in men). sitn.hms.harvard.edu/flash/2017/love-actually-science-behind-lust-attraction-companionship/A letter will help. Journaling will help. These are all little steps on the way to DOING something about the situation. Making plans, acting on those plans. Absolutely, a lot of uncertainty, where one goes from an SM is fraught with the unknown, but so far so good for me. Courage and blessings !!! |
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Post by dinnaken on Sept 15, 2017 0:14:17 GMT -5
Hi bran127 What a fascinating conversation to overhear. My two-penneth would be to agree with ironhamster In any interaction like this, written or spoken, what is the outcome that you want? If the guy wants out and states that at the end of the letter then the chances are that he will achieve that aim. If he ends the letter with no 'call to action', then the odds are that nothing will happen. In my marriage, I said things like 'I am unhappy' and 'I have been seeing a marriage guidance counsellor' and 'We are just roommates' etc. these achieved nothing. A few years later, when I had come to terms with my own total procrastination and mind-numbing fear, I said "If that's the kind of job you want to apply for, fine but for your future planning you should know that I want a separation" - that did the trick. I finally stated with complete clarity the outcome that I wanted and that's what I achieved six-months later. Whatever the outcome you desire, whether you express it in writing or verbally, you should state it clearly and unequivocally. Otherwise, it might be utterly heartfelt but it's just information-giving. |
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Post by DryCreek on Sept 15, 2017 1:20:39 GMT -5
One thing nice about writing a letter like that, even for the sake of journaling, is that it helps solidify our thoughts so that, when the time comes, we have more courage to do what we need to do. , I'm pessimistic about letters, having delivered a couple one-pagers in hopes that it would be more effective than selective listening / tuning out / deer-in-the-headlights once a monologue began. They weren't. I do think writing letters and journaling is extremely therapeutic. And it goes a long way to help organize your thoughts, distill (or even identify) your core issues, and vent anger. But I'm not so sure that actually delivering them is productive. Certainly not in the 10-page essay many of us would be tempted to write. They are not going to suddenly become enlightened / sympathetic / remorseful / affectionate through your heartfelt writing. But the things you say in anger will live forever in writing; you might later wish they didn't. So, do write, but do it for yourself. Get it out of your head and into words. Do it over a span of many days or weeks, to draw out more thoughts and then to refine them. It'll bring a lot of clarity to your thinking as well. |
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jenjen
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Post by jenjen on Sept 15, 2017 1:56:17 GMT -5
I've written a handful of letters & all I gained was a inkless pen, carpal tunnel, & a hundred, "I promise things will change", speeches. We ended up having what I call, 'Jen starts 'a bitching & I better put out' sex. After that we're right back where we started. Except my anger rages even deeper as I feel like how many times can I continue to tell him how terrible I feel yet he does nothing to eleviate my pain?
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Post by shamwow on Sept 15, 2017 5:57:18 GMT -5
Many, including myself, have written letters. Some, including myself, have posted them on this forum. And some, myself included, read them to their spouse.
What result you get from this letter depends entirely on what you write.
If you are looking to vent? Writing a letter that you promptly tear up can let you get everything out.
If you are looking to get support? Write one (probably without all the play by play) and post it to the forum. We all know enough to"full in the blanks"
If you want one to read to your partner know that a letter will almost certainly result in no lasting change. If you are looking to end the marriage, though, the tone of the letter will drive that conversation.
A letter that is a list of grievances asking for a divorce will set the stage for a fight. It will be satisfying as fuck to FINALLY say what you have kept bottled up and tell them it to their face, but in doing so you will be pouring gasoline all over the tinderbox on one of the most traumatic episodes in your life. Good luck with that.
My letter was an explanation we tried to work things out. It didn't work. We've drifted apart. I no longer loved her and we will be getting a divorce (not "I WANT a divorce"). The whole thing was about 3/4 of a page. It isn't what I WANTED to say by any means, but it fulfilled its purpose.
The letter set the stage for my very amicable divorce. Are we still friends? Not really. Are we civil? Pretty much. Did it completely tear the kids apart and make them hate either of us? Nope.
So the letter is a tool, nothing more. If you want to use this tool, make sure you select the right one for the job at hand.
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Post by ironhamster on Sept 15, 2017 6:14:51 GMT -5
I've written a handful of letters & all I gained was a inkless pen, carpal tunnel, & a hundred, "I promise things will change", speeches. We ended up having what I call, 'Jen starts 'a bitching & I better put out' sex. After that we're right back where we started. Except my anger rages even deeper as I feel like how many times can I continue to tell him how terrible I feel yet he does nothing to eleviate my pain? Wow. So many of our stories have parallels. Letters versus texts but the lack of result is the same. Reset sex is so shitty I'm done asking. |
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Post by greatcoastal on Sept 15, 2017 6:42:11 GMT -5
Letters involving a third party sure make a difference. Divorce papers served at their office,change things. Having a therapist back your facts and ask them hard questions, makes a difference. Deposition questions from an attorney, involving finances and controlling abusive behaviors, make a difference. Letters from their own teenage adult sons and daughters written from their own free will, make a difference.
Mostly words from others who they can't manipulate,or bully, who have experience with such matters, takes the wind out of their sails and gives your argument much more strength.
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 15, 2017 7:00:57 GMT -5
"I've written a handful of letters & all I gained was a inkless pen, carpal tunnel, & a hundred, "I promise things will change", speeches. We ended up having what I call, 'Jen starts 'a bitching & I better put out' sex. After that we're right back where we started. Except my anger rages even deeper as I feel like how many times can I continue to tell him how terrible I feel yet he does nothing to eleviate my ."
How many letters will you choose to write before admitting that you can't change him and he won't change himself.He is whom he is. Accept him or move on.
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Post by h on Sept 15, 2017 7:30:05 GMT -5
I was at lunch today by myself and there were what I assume were friends sitting at the table next to me. The tables were super close so I couldn't help but listen when the gentleman began talking about his sexless marriage. He wasn't talking loud by any means, but I think my ears were more alert when I heard him say "I can't live without sex anymore and I am resentful". The woman then expressed her struggles and they talked through it and supported each other. He then handed her a letter he wrote that was several pages long. She read it for about 10 minutes and exclaimed how wonderful, articulate, and to the point his letter was and that she wished she could have the strength to do the same. They talked about how it emotionally affects them and the demands they had and how scared they were to put actions in place. He said that he hoped his letter would make her divorce him. He said he would not live this life anymore and the damage was done. He no longer finds her attractive, etc. I know I sound like a total creeper, but it was absolutely surreal to hear them talk. I couldn't make this shit up!!! I typically Do not eat out on my lunch break so it was almost like the universe was speaking to me. Now I come onto ILIASM chat room today and see that many of you are writing letters. I have been contemplating my final move for a couple months (total procrastinaton and mind numbing fear). I think a letter might be the way to express my final thoughts. I obviously know that there will have to be a conversation, but maybe that is the final "spark" I need to execute what I have put in place. I know in my heart a letter isn't going to change shit, but maybe it will force the final conversation I need to have with my roommate. I've never written him a letter expressing my feelings. I've thought about it, but never written anything. Any thoughts are appreciated. Wow! I think if I would have heard that conversation when I was out at lunch, I would have joined in. I probably would have directed them here. I may not have done so a few years ago but now, I would happily introduce myself to a stranger, apologize for listening in, and jump right into the conversation myself. I have written several letters before and got better results than conversations with her. She gets upset easily and starts crying if we are face to face. The changes have always been temporary though. The next letter I write will be my last. I won't write another letter begging her to change. If she gets another letter from me, it will be a goodbye letter. |
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 15, 2017 7:53:59 GMT -5
The person who needs to understand the refused's feelings is the refused. Write a letter to yourself and then respect and honor it. Believe what you wrote. Then respond accordingly. The only person you can change is yourself. You cannot make somebody love you or desire you like you want. You can choose to stay and remain celibate. You can choose to stay and cheat. You can choose to leave. You cannot choose to make your partner into the kind of spouse you want. Telling them how you feel and what you want will not make them lust after you or love you the way you want. At best, they will go through the motions, but they still will not desire you. Just like you cannot force yourself to feel lust for someone you are not interested in, they cannot force themselves to feel passion or lust for you. They may deeply love you, but they do not love you the way you want them to.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2017 10:11:49 GMT -5
bran127 I am so proud of you!! You have come such a long way. Congratulations.
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