Is There Any Difference Here ?

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TMD
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 23, 2017 20:09:27 GMT -5 via mobile GeekGoddess likes this

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Post by TMD on Aug 23, 2017 20:09:27 GMT -5

Each situation requires honest and direct communication.

My girlfriend was the refuser and I begged her to be direct and talk to her now ex. She refused. He served her with divorce papers.

Years ago, if I could have done one thing differently about my messy marriage, I would be gently honest and direct.

"The capacity that people have to love... Where does it go?" -- Truly, Madly, Deeply

TMD
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 23, 2017 21:59:49 GMT -5 via mobile McRoomMate likes this

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Post by TMD on Aug 23, 2017 21:59:49 GMT -5

Aug 23, 2017 20:09:27 GMT -5 TMD said:

A member messaged me to ask what I meant by "doing things differently."

I'll clarify... had I done things differently, I would have been persistent and gently "forced" the communication, clearly and honestly. It's very likely the divorce would have happened long before we had kids, etc.

Ironic, too. Today is the 20 year anniversary of the legalization of the marriage, quietly unrecognized by both of us (that said he's not home).

The marriage was doomed from the start. We have always been sexless. Always sucked at communicating with one another. We are a veritable mismatch.

"The capacity that people have to love... Where does it go?" -- Truly, Madly, Deeply

allworkandnoplay
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 24, 2017 21:48:16 GMT -5

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Post by allworkandnoplay on Aug 24, 2017 21:48:16 GMT -5

Great debate situation. However, I think the crux of the matter requires more information. What does "sexually avoidant" mean? What about "sexually demanding"? Does avoidant mean only wanting it a couple of times a week rather than every day? Does demanding mean they ask for it at least once a week, or maybe a few times a month when the other spouse only wants it once every few months?

The only prudent advice with this much information is to highly suggest both spouses open up and lay out their vision of what the sexual relationship should look like. Once that information is out further steps can be taken. It reminds me of that Annie Hall quote that was floating around a while back:

Alvy's analyst: How often do you sleep together?
Alvy: Hardly ever, maybe three times a week.

Annie's analyst: Do you have sex often?
Annie: Constantly, I'd say three times a week.

“Their lives were ruined, he thought; ruined by the fundamental error of their matrimonial union: that of having based a permanent contract on a temporary feeling.”

- Thomas Hardy, Jude the Obscure

McRoomMate
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 25, 2017 8:52:27 GMT -5

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Post by McRoomMate on Aug 25, 2017 8:52:27 GMT -5

Aug 23, 2017 8:21:57 GMT -5 ironhamster said:

If the avoidant spouse does not want to have sex, they should not have sex, but in doing so they relinquish their right to be a sole supplier of sex to their spouse.

My advice would be for them to open up the marriage, and set some ground rules. Odds are that the avoidant one would balk at the idea, in which case the only ground rules for the other is to not get caught.

Very well said ironhamster Your post seems to me PRACTICAL ADVICE if not EXPERIENCE TALKING . . .

Here we have 2 Mismatched Libidos. Assuming this is the only problem - meaning the mismatch in libido is due to the refusing spouse not having issues with the relationship and the low libido is a result of that. This is a big assumption.

Anyhow, yes, if the libidos are mismatched then the marriage needs to be opened up.

I had a friend and his Grandmother threw the horny Grandfather out of bed and got twin beds. Don't ask, don't tell.

Absolute fidelity and never ending frustration for both spouses . .. Meh, no thank-you.

Last Edit: Aug 25, 2017 8:53:31 GMT -5 by McRoomMate

McRoomMate
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 25, 2017 8:57:10 GMT -5 bballgirl likes this

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Post by McRoomMate on Aug 25, 2017 8:57:10 GMT -5

Aug 23, 2017 8:40:02 GMT -5 bballgirl said:

To the refuser I would say:
Lay your cards on the table, be honest and tell your spouse that you don't like and/ or want sex with them.
Allow them to seek sex elsewhere. If you can't provide your spouse with a basic biological need and you will deny the spouse seeking it elsewhere then you are a selfish pig and you have no right holding your spouse hostage.
Yes this might blow up the marriage and the family unit but your marriage is already a lie and dishonest because you are avoidant and not honest.

To the refused I would say:
Lay your cards on the table, be honest and advocate for yourself.
Your spouse is being selfish and it's time for you to be selfish for yourself.
Let them know that celibacy is no longer an option and they can either start fucking You enthusiastically in a meaningful intimate manner, which may mean seeing a therapist, counselor or sex therapist OR you will either be fucking someone else or seek a divorce.
An avoidant non answer will result in the refused's choice.

Wow wow wow ! ! !

Concise point absolutely well made. Clear as a bell. Very nice to read.

solitarysoul
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Is There Any Difference Here ? Aug 26, 2017 13:35:25 GMT -5 via mobile itme and ironhamster like this

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Post by solitarysoul on Aug 26, 2017 13:35:25 GMT -5

To me this question gets so much harder if you started on the same page sexually but people changed over the course of the marriage, as we ALL do...and then you find yourself in different places....

There in lies the real pain.

Last Edit: Aug 28, 2017 6:54:23 GMT -5 by solitarysoul

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mirrororchid: We've compared denier/refuser spouses to prison wardens. Dr. Psychmom has compared them to hostage takers and the unhappy spouse has Stockholm syndrome. Prisoners can't leave. Stockholm hostages don't because they want a good outcome for the captor. Sept 10, 2024 18:54:11 GMT -5

mirrororchid: Heard on a podcast: "Dating is where we present our best selves. Vulnerability is the opposite. Where we risk our partner knowing things that are imperfect. This is the way to forge the life partner bond." Sept 10, 2024 19:17:03 GMT -5

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Sept 12, 2024 0:05:11 GMT -5

week5of35years: My Wife had 30 free mins before she had to start work this AM... I said.. "lets have a quick shag" and she said she was going to walk the dog instead.... Still work to do.... Sept 17, 2024 3:51:34 GMT -5

isthisit: Week 5; For once I am in your wife’s corner on this one, I’d have walked the dog too! You need to work in your delivery there… Sept 20, 2024 0:01:57 GMT -5

week5of35years: LOL, in my defence, I squeezed her boobs as we were waking up and she was pretty responsive ...... If that had just come out of the blue I would have smacked myself in the face .... ha ha ha Sept 23, 2024 5:54:56 GMT -5

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