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Post by obobfla on Feb 23, 2017 21:21:50 GMT -5
Other posts have sort of touched on this, and I thought about replying. But instead of hijacking those threads, I started this one.
Years ago, when I discovered I was a drunk and I didn't want to be one anymore, I went to AA and picked up a white chip. Shortly afterwards, I began doing the 12 steps.
The first three steps were easy. I admitted I had a problem. A night in jail, an empty wallet, and an eviction notice on my door let me know that. Then I acknowledged there was a higher power that could help me. This higher power wasn't the judgemental bastard who guilt tripped me in my younger years. For the third step, I let go and turned my life over to that power. It was like quitting a bad job and walking out.
But the four step was something else. I had to write down a fearless moral inventory of my character defects, two of which are procrastination and avoidance. True to my nature, I dawdled and took months to complete it. It was painful. But when I finished it and read it to my sponsor, I felt a large burden removed from me. I tell people it is the closest thing to being pregnant that I will ever be. I have not had a drink in 22 years, so I guess I did it right.
So what does this have to do with a sexless marriage? It's because I wonder what made me choose my wife even though there were plenty of flags telling me not to. Plus, she was not the first mentally unstable person I dated. Why am I attracted to these women? Is it because I think I am not normal myself, so only a defective woman would want me? Do I want to cure her because I can't cure myself?
I am curious if anyone in our situation has done or thought of doing something similar to this.
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Post by baza on Feb 23, 2017 22:21:05 GMT -5
Brother obobflaMinutes ago, I put up a story about my experience in the 12 step deal in GamAnon. Of the 12 steps, I too had a great deal of difficulty in taking a fearless moral inventory of myself. And still do. It is fucking hard. The other thing, not a step, but a guideline, was the one about "accepting without resentment". Guideline #14 as I recall. In my group, the guidelines were always read out one by one in rotation by the attenders of the meeting. It was fucking uncanny that no matter where I would sit in the circle, no matter who started off etc, that guideline #14 nearly always arrived when it was my turn to read. Fucking spooky. I could do the "accept" bit. But I reckon it took me 7 or more years to do the "without resentment" bit. By then I was divorced. |
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Post by wewbwb on Feb 24, 2017 6:41:46 GMT -5
I can state that a big reason I stayed with the Frigidaire, even after many warning signs cropped up, was a fear of loneliness.
Totally stems from my childhood.
I also foolishly believed that she would try as hard as I would.
That's just me thinking the best of people.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 6:43:46 GMT -5
This is not something I talk about often since it is not mainstream and not widely accepted but I posted about Chakras a few weeks ago and below is the link to that thread because it has helped me find some of my grounding and balance in the past and therefore maybe worth reading up about. It has also helped me deal with issues such as procrastination (which btw I dont think is so much a character flaw but more a mental block) If anyone has any questions, I am very happy to share my experiences. iliasm.org/thread/2359/chakras?page=1&scrollTo=51215 |
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Post by GeekGoddess on Feb 24, 2017 7:42:04 GMT -5
I will have to cogitate on this post to prepare a valid (honest) response. I like the question & thread, though.
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Post by bballgirl on Feb 24, 2017 9:08:18 GMT -5
I'm of the belief that the way we love ourselves is the love we will want and attract for ourselves. I do believe that people with insecurities and for lack of a better word, issues, attract others with issues. Just my $.02.
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Post by McRoomMate on May 3, 2017 6:21:30 GMT -5
Oh yes, I know very well this program . . . and how many times have I heard "Rigorous Honesty" - well yes about Booze - that was "easy" once I qualified for membership (that 12 step program has a very expensive "entrance fee" payable in money, time, and blood).
Now the 2nd time I will say I have held that "rigorous honesty" is by my heart dealing with this SM mess I found myself. I found that looking deep into my heart and soul was about as certain as staring into a Stage 5 Hurricane sometimes (I too know Sabal palms in Tropical Storms).
So all I can do is "Turn-it-Over" and do what in good faith I believe to be the next right thing.
ANECDOTE: So being at my wits end I decided I just wanted to go on my own (no Mom influence around) to a Catholic Church for the first time in over 10 years (I was raised Catholic) and get on my knees to feel humble before the Almighty. Now can you believe this? During the Mass the Priest mentioned the Serenity Prayer as part of his Homily (i.e., Sermon ). First time I ever heard the AA Serenity Prayer in a Catholic Mass and I have been going to Mass - how is that for a "coincidence"?
Excellent Post and Topic.
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Post by hopingforachange on May 3, 2017 7:14:27 GMT -5
obobfla brought up a very good point about who we choose to date. We are often attracted to those that match our bent antenna. In my past I have dated women that often had some sort of sexual abuse in their past, the last girl I would have married but she had to move to Florida with her family.* Because I was so hurt from the breakup, I chose someone that didn't have the same background, that there wasn't as fiery attraction to was still attracted to on a lower flame level. I was so concerned and guarding my heart that I to ignored the red flags to a SM while dating. In the end I made choices without fully being honest with my self. So far, not trying harder to stay together when her family moved is my one regret in life, she is my one that got away. Helping her work thru some of her childhood was some of the most rewarding and bonding intimate talks in my life. Even now a decade plus later, she can call me and I can hear thru her voice into how she is feeling and what is going on and know if she is calling for me to tear down her walls into her own feelings or if she needs me to play along. *She was not financially independent yet and her mom did not like that I wasn't "religious enough". So, they moved 3 years before they planned to ensure that we didn't get married. Just 3ish years ago I was talking to her again and her mom apologized for what she did, the mom said I lived more inline with the gospel without ever saying his name, (aka, never doing the Southern Baptist song and dance) then even many of her pastors.
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Post by WindSister on May 4, 2017 9:03:02 GMT -5
I definitely took a good, long hard look at myself as I was trying to fix my marriage and after I left. I also try to keep myself in check now, too, in my new marriage. I realized that I chose my ex out of fear of loneliness - 100%. I had just ended a relationship with a man that took me a good decade to FINALLY get over. We were engaged but young and stupid - especially me. I used to say one of my two biggest regrets in life was not turning around when he called my name - my pride kept me walking away and I KNEW it as it was happening. The guy I met next and married was the complete opposite of the man I had just broken up with - the man I broke up with was affectionate, funny, caring, ambitious as all hell, and crazy about me. I was me, though -- the over-jealous FOOL (back then I didn't keep myself in check) who was mad he befriended a woman who was in an abusive relationship and had kids - he was trying to help her. She sent him roses (not exactly a "friendly" move, in my defense) -- I flipped out. Ended it all right there. They got married five years later - have been together since and he adopted her boys so a part of me knows that is just how that was supposed to play out - she is now dying of cancer. He was a charmer, flirt, wanna-fix-everything-for-everyone kind of guy. My ex was ... well, not. My ex was cold, unaffectionate, unfeeling (admitted to me in the end he didn't know how to feel joy), flat (which I mistook as "stable")..... etc. The opposite. I didn't want to feel back then, I can see that now. I also didn't want to be alone. I wasn't taking true care of myself. I ran away from my hometown, landed in the big city with this "city boy" who didn't like any of the things I liked so I gave them up. Then I got pregnant after we had been married for years, he didn't want the baby and... well.......... I went along with choices that added another layer of regret and depression. This second regret stayed with me for years and years but I didn't recognize the source until later, much later. I "blamed" depression on other things like my job, etc. I say I "woke up" because, quite literally, one day I did. From depression, from a life I didn't want that I let myself be swayed into, from living like a walking dead girl (zombie). I started grieving choices I had made that didn't suit me - walking away, saying I do, saying yes to something I didn't believe in nor want. Walking through grief (not ignoring it) is the only way to heal. As I started to heal and look around, my life was not anything I imagined for myself so I started taking action. I shared that part of my journey here already: joined hiking groups/clubs, bought a kayak, went camping, backpacking, hiking, kayaking alone as often as I could. Tried to encourage my husband to join me, he tried for a bit but it wasn't him and he looked odd in the woods. (City boy under the trees... just weird). I became the kind of person who has the kind of life I wanted and was told my husband will either join me or not --- he didn't. But, yes -- I clearly am not a "victim" of my ex or that marriage. I created that life, 100%. Having said that, I didn't know all of this till after leaving. "Sexlessness" is the reason I started to look at my marriage (we didn't have sex for 10 years). That is what opened my eyes to all the other, actually more real, dysfunction in my life and marriage. It wasn't just about the sex - not even close. (for me) My now-husband is not like either men I was with before. He is closer to my first, but he's not a flirt and he believes in 100% committing and doting on one woman only. (yes, I need and want that - but lucky me, I found that). I still have jealous tendencies because of my deep-rooted-in-the-genes insecurities, but I am a bit older and wiser now so I have learned to keep them in check and not believe every manic thought that fills my head. Breathe first -- stay in reality. Don't believe every thought. So as a result I am not suffocating him. "Guys night" still fills me with crazy thoughts but I don't voice them and I get busy doing something I love. My husband's actions make me trust him even more every year, quieting those jealous demons little by little. (I am hopeful they will be completely gone some day). So -- fearless, honest moral inventory? Oh yeah. I do that. I suppose I didn't have to share it all out loud, but here it is.  |
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