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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2017 17:29:51 GMT -5
I am going to meet with my refuser to tell her that we will NOT be getting back together. She will probably cry or throw a huge fit. Maybe both.
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Post by misssunnybunny on Jan 26, 2017 18:09:13 GMT -5
Good luck!
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 26, 2017 19:32:39 GMT -5
Inspiring post. I am just now "Waking up" to the fact I have been in an SM for over 10 years (last sex was 11 months ago, 8 months before that etc.) I have asked my W 2 times in the past few days "Do I bring you any Joy in Life?" she does not even answer me.
Tonight when I kissed our 5 year old daughter good night , my W said I was too rough and I said "What do you know about kissing" and she knew what I was talking about.
She of course blamed our SM on me. I said yes I know 100% my fault but it takes two to tango.
I am psychologically preparing myself for high turbulance and tornados these coming months - I work at her company now - so first is getting another job before the storm hits - and pray she does not use our children as weapons / defensive shields. When in the past she threatened things about separating she said "You will never see your children again"
I appreciate your courageous post and actions. Seeing posts like yours is why I am here.
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 26, 2017 19:34:09 GMT -5
My next question to her . . . and the timing has to be just right because this little question could unleash a massive pent up tension "Why are you still with me then?"
But my escape plan (Financial independence, etc.) is still in process.
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Post by lyn on Jan 26, 2017 21:14:25 GMT -5
Stay focused on your plan @jaybo Mcroommate. At this point, I'm almost obsessing over mine. Of course you know that in no jurisdiction can she keep your children from you unless you've been proven unfit - something tells me you are of course quite fit to parent.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2017 21:35:29 GMT -5
You go Flash! You got this. Let us know how it goes!
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Post by baza on Jan 26, 2017 22:41:13 GMT -5
When I left, back in 09, my missus got it into her head that it was a "trial" separation.
It suited me, initially, for her to think that, though where she got that idea I have no idea.
In fairness to all concerned, I slammed the door on that a few weeks later.
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Post by beachguy on Jan 26, 2017 23:18:32 GMT -5
Congratulations, flashjohn, for taking control of your life. Most of those conversations that I've read about involve the STBX totally consumed with their desire to remain in the relationship. We are not a matter of interest here. Our needs are never a matter of interest, and never were. I suspect that in most or all cases here, there are extreme fears of abandonment involved. And not just our spouses, but us too. Not everyone puts in 10 years or more of total celibacy before punching out. For many people it is a year or less. But I digress. Anyway, it occurred to me that most of us handle this wrong. We announce our decision to divorce, and then defend our decision. That's a loser, at least in terms of Harvard Debating Points. Perhaps a better solution is to ask your spouse the following question: Given the circumstances of our marriage, what's in it for me if I stay? Convince me why *I* want to stay in this relationship. That should force a huge change in the debating dynamics. Your spouse will then try to return to forcing you to defend your decision, in terms of THEIR needs. You might want to ignore all that and just keep repeating the question: "What's in it for me? I'm a party to this marriage too!" |
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Post by beachguy on Jan 27, 2017 2:30:53 GMT -5
My next question to her . . . and the timing has to be just right because this little question could unleash a massive pent up tension "Why are you still with me then?" But my escape plan (Financial independence, etc.) is still in process. A better question: I am obviously miserable. You know that. You've known for years. Why should I stay? You need to convince *ME* to stay. If you ask, "Why are you still here?" you are tacitly admitting that she controls the relationship. My question gives you the control you deserve as an equal partner and puts the burden on her to validate your needs. You would, of course, first want to arrange suitable alternate employment, of course. Very few people here have ever considered asking that question. Because most of us were trained to be doormats and we accept that role, even as we contemplated our exit. This one question changes the entire dynamics of the relationship. But you have to keep asking that question each time your spouse tries to return you to the defensive. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 27, 2017 2:34:38 GMT -5
Congratulations, flashjohn , for taking control of your life. Most of those conversations that I've read about involve the STBX totally consumed with their desire to remain in the relationship. We are not a matter of interest here. Our needs are never a matter of interest, and never were. I suspect that in most or all cases here, there are extreme fears of abandonment involved. And not just our spouses, but us too. Not everyone puts in 10 years or more of total celibacy before punching out. For many people it is a year or less. But I digress. Anyway, it occurred to me that most of us handle this wrong. We announce our decision to divorce, and then defend our decision. That's a loser, at least in terms of Harvard Debating Points. Perhaps a better solution is to ask your spouse the following question: Given the circumstances of our marriage, what's in it for me if I stay? Convince me why *I* want to stay in this relationship. That should force a huge change in the debating dynamics. Your spouse will then try to return to forcing you to defend your decision, in terms of THEIR needs. You might want to ignore all that and just keep repeating the question: "What's in it for me? I'm a party to this marriage too!" Wow. Here is what I get ALL THE TIME - a recurring jingo "I am Selfish" "I do not care about our children" when her Grandmother died my W was very emotional and the truth slipped out "You are the Worst Person in the World" My Needs? Why that is only selfish egomania. I readily admit that I am maybe 70% of the cause or more or less but NOT 100%. She is the main financial provider to the family and still is beautiful and could get a 1000 men of her choosing - good ones no doubt. I am perpetually reminded of all my inadequacies - and so now have ZERO WILL to want to try to repair this. I have asked my W two times this week "Do I bring you any Joy?" she refused to answer -first time gave me an annoying look and second time just totally ignored me. My next question - when ducks are more in a row for exit (firstly I work for her and need to get financially independent ASAP) - "Why do you want to stay with me?" I know the answer - "for the children and family is first" that is what she said when she "caught" me talking on FB to a lady (we were not even doing anything) she started packing my things in boxes hysterically saying look what I did for your family (she did help them) and this is how you repay me. It is like I am "Bought" by her for having children and money - but intimacy/love/ etc. - is not relevant in her analysis. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 27, 2017 2:41:29 GMT -5
Stay focused on your plan @jaybo Mcroommate. At this point, I'm almost obsessing over mine. Of course you know that in no jurisdiction can she keep your children from you unless you've been proven unfit - something tells me you are of course quite fit to parent. Thank-you. I do my best - per my W I am 100% of all the problems of our family - my selfishness my lack of caring etc. etc. I am not perfect but I try - there is no abuse or arguing in our house - I try to help out as best I can and all I get is perpetual reminders of my "inadequacies" meanwhile she plays video games all week-end in her pajamas and then binge watches TV shows on her laptop - because she is too stressed from work and it helps her cope. She does work hard (owner of medium company) but in terms of our relationship ZERO EFFORT from her - I too stopped making efforts about a few years ago - I recently stopped even giving symbolic kisses and hugs - which was all that was left. Oh, I went thru a traumatic divorce - mainly resulting in separation my daughter - my 1st wife was alcoholic manic depressive and has since died. My current wife is hard working and a big heart for her children and many others but for me - I am just her "inadequacy". First step is I must get financially independent (I work at her company) second - then I can address the Exit - After 10 years of SM - I see any repair effort as a matter of pulling the plug or not - there is nothing in my heart left for her - just respect for her many good qualities but I need a real relationship in a loving couple - if I stay with her impossible. |
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Post by beachguy on Jan 27, 2017 2:46:46 GMT -5
Congratulations, flashjohn , for taking control of your life. Most of those conversations that I've read about involve the STBX totally consumed with their desire to remain in the relationship. We are not a matter of interest here. Our needs are never a matter of interest, and never were. I suspect that in most or all cases here, there are extreme fears of abandonment involved. And not just our spouses, but us too. Not everyone puts in 10 years or more of total celibacy before punching out. For many people it is a year or less. But I digress. Anyway, it occurred to me that most of us handle this wrong. We announce our decision to divorce, and then defend our decision. That's a loser, at least in terms of Harvard Debating Points. Perhaps a better solution is to ask your spouse the following question: Given the circumstances of our marriage, what's in it for me if I stay? Convince me why *I* want to stay in this relationship. That should force a huge change in the debating dynamics. Your spouse will then try to return to forcing you to defend your decision, in terms of THEIR needs. You might want to ignore all that and just keep repeating the question: "What's in it for me? I'm a party to this marriage too!" Wow. Here is what I get ALL THE TIME - a recurring jingo "I am Selfish" "I do not care about our children" when her Grandmother died my W was very emotional and the truth slipped out "You are the Worst Person in the World" My Needs? Why that is only selfish egomania. I readily admit that I am maybe 70% of the cause or more or less but NOT 100%. She is the main financial provider to the family and still is beautiful and could get a 1000 men of her choosing - good ones no doubt. I am perpetually reminded of all my inadequacies - and so now have ZERO WILL to want to try to repair this. I have asked my W two times this week "Do I bring you any Joy?" she refused to answer -first time gave me an annoying look and second time just totally ignored me. My next question - when ducks are more in a row for exit (firstly I work for her and need to get financially independent ASAP) - "Why do you want to stay with me?" I know the answer - "for the children and family is first" that is what she said when she "caught" me talking on FB to a lady (we were not even doing anything) she started packing my things in boxes hysterically saying look what I did for your family (she did help them) and this is how you repay me. It is like I am "Bought" by her for having children and money - but intimacy/love/ etc. - is not relevant in her analysis. Perhaps you might want to consider finding one of those thousand men for her. Personally, having been through this, I would ignore her claims of selfishness and just insist on asking why you should stay in the marriage. You are the one that wants to leave (presumably). That should place the burden on her to keep you. My STBX never started packing my things because she knew I would join in, enthusiastically. If she had been stupid enough to do that, it would have surely made my day. My year. My decade. And believe me, I was trained for decades that it was all my fault, that I was unworthy of fucking. |
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Post by baza on Jan 27, 2017 2:57:32 GMT -5
I'd posit a hypothetical scenario where you are 100% to blame for the big fuck up your marriage morphed in to. Then i'd pose this question - "so fucking what "  ?? The marriage is still a shithole irrespective of who caused it, who is to blame, who isn't to blame, who has the moral highground or who hasn't. And, you get the casting vote. If you want, you can end it. EVEN if you are 100% to blame. Or 0% to blame. |
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Post by McRoomMate on Jan 27, 2017 3:04:40 GMT -5
I'd posit a hypothetical scenario where you are 100% to blame for the big fuck up your marriage morphed in to. Then i'd pose this question - "so fucking what " ?? The marriage is still a shithole irrespective of who caused it, who is to blame, who isn't to blame, who has the moral highground or who hasn't. And, you get the casting vote. If you want, you can end it. EVEN if you are 100% to blame. Or 0% to blame. Thank-you baza for your extraordinarly ability here to cut thru the "red tape" and go right to the heart of the matter. I suppose it is my deep instilled and pathological sense of guilt. 100% or 0% I get the casting vote - so obvious but yet I could not see that. Sublime. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2017 16:40:20 GMT -5
IT was truly amazing! She cannot accept that I don't want to be married to her. We have been living separately since March 1 of 2016, I told her that things have not improved, and I want to move on. She still thinks I should want to work things out.
I will be telling my lawyer to get it filed next week.
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