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Post by csl on Aug 28, 2017 22:05:48 GMT -5
It turned out to be easier than I thought. The topic came up on its own and I went with it. My younger sister just had her first child and a few family members asked when I was going to start. My response was: "You're old enough to know how babies are made, right? Well there aren't any baby making activities going on in our household." That started the conversation about how our marriage has been a joke of near celibacy for the entire duration of it. The hardest part is waiting for the opportunity to arrive naturally. It's not really something you can just blurt out without a context. Once the initial topic is out, the conversation goes much easier. The biggest shock and sympathy came when I tell how she turned me down on our wedding night and only gave me one round of pity/guilt sex on our ten day long honeymoon. Really? How long ago was this, and has your wife received any blowback from family about this? One of my big things on my blog is tearing down the facade, and you've done it, big time! I'd be interested in hearing how the wife handled the new light being shone on her.
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Post by h on Aug 29, 2017 4:24:16 GMT -5
It turned out to be easier than I thought. The topic came up on its own and I went with it. My younger sister just had her first child and a few family members asked when I was going to start. My response was: "You're old enough to know how babies are made, right? Well there aren't any baby making activities going on in our household." That started the conversation about how our marriage has been a joke of near celibacy for the entire duration of it. The hardest part is waiting for the opportunity to arrive naturally. It's not really something you can just blurt out without a context. Once the initial topic is out, the conversation goes much easier. The biggest shock and sympathy came when I tell how she turned me down on our wedding night and only gave me one round of pity/guilt sex on our ten day long honeymoon. Really? How long ago was this, and has your wife received any blowback from family about this? One of my big things on my blog is tearing down the facade, and you've done it, big time! I'd be interested in hearing how the wife handled the new light being shone on her. I didn't tell her. W wasn't around when the conversations happened. The conversations have been spread out over the summer with a few people. I'm preparing my family in case things go south and I have to divorce. I haven't talked to my parents about it yet but I expect to have the time this fall. I'll see my dad more often then. My mother won't take it well, being the "holier than thou" type of judgmental religious fanatic. I expect that if I divorce, I won't see her much anymore. I'm still waiting for one last medical issue to resolve itself before making that D decision. (Doctor gave her a maximum length of time for recovery so I'll wait for that and see if it makes a difference in our sex life.) I'm not telling her about my time limit to prevent her from waiting until the last minute and faking her way through a reset. If she wants me then she will start fixing our sex life once she's healed. If not, I have my answer.
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Post by csl on Aug 29, 2017 21:46:19 GMT -5
Really? How long ago was this, and has your wife received any blowback from family about this? One of my big things on my blog is tearing down the facade, and you've done it, big time! I'd be interested in hearing how the wife handled the new light being shone on her. I didn't tell her. W wasn't around when the conversations happened. The conversations have been spread out over the summer with a few people. I'm preparing my family in case things go south and I have to divorce. I haven't talked to my parents about it yet but I expect to have the time this fall. I'll see my dad more often then. My mother won't take it well, being the "holier than thou" type of judgmental religious fanatic. I expect that if I divorce, I won't see her much anymore. I'm still waiting for one last medical issue to resolve itself before making that D decision. (Doctor gave her a maximum length of time for recovery so I'll wait for that and see if it makes a difference in our sex life.) I'm not telling her about my time limit to prevent her from waiting until the last minute and faking her way through a reset. If she wants me then she will start fixing our sex life once she's healed. If not, I have my answer. For myself, I'm not wild about setting a deadline but not telling her about it. It doesn't seem kosher. I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. Let her know that the clock is ticking on the marriage and whether it lives or dies will be determined by her choice. Part of defining the marriage that will be is setting the boundaries. But that's just me...
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Post by h on Aug 29, 2017 22:02:22 GMT -5
I didn't tell her. W wasn't around when the conversations happened. The conversations have been spread out over the summer with a few people. I'm preparing my family in case things go south and I have to divorce. I haven't talked to my parents about it yet but I expect to have the time this fall. I'll see my dad more often then. My mother won't take it well, being the "holier than thou" type of judgmental religious fanatic. I expect that if I divorce, I won't see her much anymore. I'm still waiting for one last medical issue to resolve itself before making that D decision. (Doctor gave her a maximum length of time for recovery so I'll wait for that and see if it makes a difference in our sex life.) I'm not telling her about my time limit to prevent her from waiting until the last minute and faking her way through a reset. If she wants me then she will start fixing our sex life once she's healed. If not, I have my answer. For myself, I'm not wild about setting a deadline but not telling her about it. It doesn't seem kosher. I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. Let her know that the clock is ticking on the marriage and whether it lives or dies will be determined by her choice. Part of defining the marriage that will be is setting the boundaries. But that's just me... If she doesn't change on her own and I have to force her into it with threats of divorce, can I really believe that any change is genuine? I have asked her to go to counseling with me and was adamantly rejected. I told her that I was unhappy with the situation but she's done almost nothing to compromise with alternative activities to make up for the years of rejection. When she brought up divorce during the last talk we had, I agreed and told her that maybe we needed to. From her, it was an idle threat but I explained that the rest of our life and activities together do not add up to a marriage. I did tell her that divorce is extremely likely and something desirable to me if things continue the same way. I'm giving her the time to heal. If after that, she still doesn't desire me enough to make a sex life work, she will have shown me that she never really wanted to at all. The time line is irrelevant. The end result is the same.
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Post by northstarmom on Aug 30, 2017 6:12:17 GMT -5
"I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. "
Can you make yourself want to have sex with a person you find unsexually appealing? That's what you are trying to get your wife to do. The deadline may force her to have sex with you in order to stay married. But it can't make her sexually desire you. Starfish sex may be the most she will be able to offer. If what you want is passionate, mutually enjoyable sex, you'd need a different partner.
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Post by h on Aug 30, 2017 14:15:00 GMT -5
"I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. " Can you make yourself want to have sex with a person you find unsexually appealing? That's what you are trying to get your wife to do. The deadline may force her to have sex with you in order to stay married. But it can't make her sexually desire you. Starfish sex may be the most she will be able to offer. If what you want is passionate, mutually enjoyable sex, you'd need a different partner. That's exactly why I didn't tell her the deadline. If the change doesn't come from her after all I've said and done to get through to her, it never will. I'm going to give her the time and wait until the end of the doctor's maximum time for recovery. After that, she'll either be interested in me or she won't. I'm done forcing the issue. I won't demean myself anymore by breaking down in front of her or writing any more letters. I'll start setting aside money for a lawyer if/when I need one.
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Post by baza on Aug 31, 2017 0:57:50 GMT -5
Your big risk here Brother h is that the ovarian cyst diagnosis with its' "up to a year to heal" prognosis gives her a free pass until August 2018. If you - then - are convinced that she IS full of shit, and then you start checking out the legal position etc etc, you will likely be at Sep / Oct 2018 as a starting point, and with about another year to 18 months to get out. That potentially runs you up to around August 2019 You joined this group in April 2017, so potentially you are looking at a couple more years of this bullshit. Could a case be made to cut your missus free pass back to say 6 months ? If no, then could a case be made for you to get your legal advice etc etc together NOW and fine tune it by Sep 2018 so you are good to go then ? Time is not your friend in these situations.
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Post by casual777 on Sept 6, 2017 16:54:07 GMT -5
You sound like a very lovely person and I know that there is no way that I could have stayed faithful as long as you if I was you. Yes a number of difficult options and it is unfair indeed.
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Post by Frustrated1978 on Sept 24, 2017 21:28:12 GMT -5
Unfortunately you only have two choices. Both ain't easy to make but needless to say one needs to be made.
You can either choose to take a stand and inform your wife that you will no longer tolerate the situation as it is. This choice will involve enforcing consequences which might mean seperating, visiting lawyers, and a split of assets leaving you both financially poorer. However this option has long term benefits and is considered a long term investment.
On the other hand you could choose to accept the situation and not bring it up and enjoy life's pleasures where you can.
I truly believe that when the sex dries up in a marriage barring some underlying health issue which is properly diagnosed by a medical professional then the possibility that the Refuser might be engaging in an affair should always discreetly be examined.
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 25, 2017 6:23:50 GMT -5
Ovarian cysts don't prevent women from enjoying giving and receiving oral and manual stimulation.
The sooner you allow yourself to face the fact that your wife is permanently sexually averse to you but stays in the marriage for financial or other reasons that don't include lovng you, the sooner you will be able to let go of a marriage that is not and will never be what you want.
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Post by neonspace on Sept 27, 2017 14:51:44 GMT -5
"I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. " Can you make yourself want to have sex with a person you find unsexually appealing? That's what you are trying to get your wife to do. The deadline may force her to have sex with you in order to stay married. But it can't make her sexually desire you. Starfish sex may be the most she will be able to offer. If what you want is passionate, mutually enjoyable sex, you'd need a different partner. This. As I read these posts suggesting timeboxed ultimatums I can't help but think, is there anything a spouse could do at this point that would turn things around? I don't know if there is. I'm so hurt and turned off that I'm just done. I don't see her suddenly desiring me after 25 years of considering me a chore. Those wounds go deep and not sure if I can forgive. I can probably forgive eventually, but probaly couldn't continue a relationship always wondering if she really changed or was just better at manipulating me.
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Post by tirefire on Sept 27, 2017 17:33:53 GMT -5
"I'm all in favor of letting her know that she's on the clock, and that if she wants to continue, not do a reset, but a whole change. " Can you make yourself want to have sex with a person you find unsexually appealing? That's what you are trying to get your wife to do. The deadline may force her to have sex with you in order to stay married. But it can't make her sexually desire you. Starfish sex may be the most she will be able to offer. If what you want is passionate, mutually enjoyable sex, you'd need a different partner. This. As I read these posts suggesting timeboxed ultimatums I can't help but think, is there anything a spouse could do at this point that would turn things around? I don't know if there is. I'm so hurt and turned off that I'm just done. I don't see her suddenly desiring me after 25 years of considering me a chore. Those wounds go deep and not sure if I can forgive. I can probably forgive eventually, but probaly couldn't continue a relationship always wondering if she really changed or was just better at manipulating me. You might get to a place where you realize that you aren't even attracted anymore after all the rejection and forcing yourself to not think about sex with her. Lack of sex destroys marriages.
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Post by h on Sept 27, 2017 19:22:03 GMT -5
This. As I read these posts suggesting timeboxed ultimatums I can't help but think, is there anything a spouse could do at this point that would turn things around? I don't know if there is. I'm so hurt and turned off that I'm just done. I don't see her suddenly desiring me after 25 years of considering me a chore. Those wounds go deep and not sure if I can forgive. I can probably forgive eventually, but probaly couldn't continue a relationship always wondering if she really changed or was just better at manipulating me. You might get to a place where you realize that you aren't even attracted anymore after all the rejection and forcing yourself to not think about sex with her. Lack of sex destroys marriages. Correct! Sexlessness is likely to end mine.
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Post by TMD on Sept 27, 2017 20:03:13 GMT -5
Ovarian cysts don't prevent women from enjoying giving and receiving oral and manual stimulation. The sooner you allow yourself to face the fact that your wife is permanently sexually averse to you but stays in the marriage for financial or other reasons that don't include lovng you, the sooner you will be able to let go of a marriage that is not and will never be what you want. Having had a few of those cysts a couple of years ago, I can say there were unbearable moments. But overall, no, they would not have prevented intercourse.
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Post by hopingforachange on Sept 28, 2017 7:58:22 GMT -5
Ovarian cysts don't prevent women from enjoying giving and receiving oral and manual stimulation. The sooner you allow yourself to face the fact that your wife is permanently sexually averse to you but stays in the marriage for financial or other reasons that don't include lovng you, the sooner you will be able to let go of a marriage that is not and will never be what you want. Having had a few of those cysts a couple of years ago, I can say there were unbearable moments. But overall, no, they would not have prevented intercourse. I had an ex with ovarian cysts and endometriosis and sex was one of the few things short of narcotics that gave her pain relief.
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