|
Post by mirrororchid on Feb 10, 2021 18:43:39 GMT -5
I was surprised a few times when after we had had sex there was a couple times I'd mention it had been a while and she would agree then tell me the date we last had sex! It had been months but in my mind I thought only a couple weeks. That's how disconnected I have been and really still am. About a month ago rolled over to her while we were in bed (both awake not tired or sleepy) and started to caress her leg. She just lay there not saying or responding in anyway. I just talked softly kept caressing but nothing and I knew she feeling awkward. It's great you realize what a problem it is to be so out of sync with her. So many refusers don't keep track and when a refused partner does keep track it isn't an opportunity to reflect at the mental disconnect, it's an opportunity for teh refuser to find fault with the refused for reducing love and romance to hard numbers. I'm wondering if your caresses were enticing, but she cannot bare the idea of being refused if she were to ask for more. She may also like the attention, as frustrating as it might be, and be scared of running you off with requests for more, stopping the gesture of affection. Or, she's troubled by the difficulty of the relationship and sex would help to strengthen she's unsure she wants. She's been thrown some curveballs. Your "death grip" history is intriguing. Jerri has done some research on that. Don't know what therapy is available for enabling stimulation without intense pressure. Good to hear you're up for Viagra. The ointment would be my first choice if I end up needing it in ten years. Works faster and likely far fewer side effects. I suppose it's a bit disappointing if she cannot bring you to climax. Does that make her less inclined to ask? Could you engage far more often but be comfortable with teh idea that it's for teh purpose of bringing your wife joy and demonstrating love? Or does it get to be a chore? Refusers have been heard to see it that way and sometimes it's an understandable view if the spouse is unskilled or indifferent in attempts to make it enjoyable for both.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 10, 2021 21:49:31 GMT -5
thx jerri. In therapy we touched on these a bit but we worked on EMDR as I was recalling blocked memories and releasing pain/ fear. because I was doing better i.e. : really started "feeling" again over the few years we were meeting .. I lost weight and was getting into shape even got to running 5 miles daily. My work schedule changed and I was unable to keep seeing my therapist as I only have one day off a week (Saturdays) So I thought I was "healed". That was two years ago. I didn't really think about our sexless marriage during my therapy or after. my therapist did ask if we were having sex and I just said yes. Again in my mind even though months went by to me it seemed like we had recently like week or two. I did not talk to my therapist about my daily porn use. So here recently (year or so) I've started realizing I'm still not well. Stopped exercising gained weight back .. depression / panic attacks. Porn use way over the top. I started reading up on sexless marriages and what I was learning I couldn't hide my issues anymore. I'm now seeking therapy focusing this porn addiction and my disassociating being intimate, my avoidance of real sexual "present" acts with the wife as I've come to realize that when the reality that sex was going to happen I deep inside felt fear. Pain. All from what my sister did to me and she did this over years and although there was grooming involved mostly it was physical attacks / smothering with her vagina as she sat on me, grabbing me down there squeezing hard making me scream but insisting I stop crying/screaming then and only then stopping. She increased the pain the longer I cried and screamed. It was torture. So Allot to still address but I'm tired of feeling this way and really how my wife has felt the effects of my passed onto her as a results how I have been in our marriage. I want real intimacy like you mentioned with your partner. I want to be "present" "feel" look at her see her pleasure smell her feel her body close. People here have already helped me and in a way This is my first time writing this out .. like journaling .. something my therapist encouraged me to do but I've never tried. edited: My spelling sucks
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 10, 2021 22:02:56 GMT -5
I was surprised a few times when after we had had sex there was a couple times I'd mention it had been a while and she would agree then tell me the date we last had sex! It had been months but in my mind I thought only a couple weeks. That's how disconnected I have been and really still am. About a month ago rolled over to her while we were in bed (both awake not tired or sleepy) and started to caress her leg. She just lay there not saying or responding in anyway. I just talked softly kept caressing but nothing and I knew she feeling awkward. It's great you realize what a problem it is to be so out of sync with her. So many refusers don't keep track and when a refused partner does keep track it isn't an opportunity to reflect at the mental disconnect, it's an opportunity for teh refuser to find fault with the refused for reducing love and romance to hard numbers. I'm wondering if your caresses were enticing, but she cannot bare the idea of being refused if she were to ask for more. She may also like the attention, as frustrating as it might be, and be scared of running you off with requests for more, stopping the gesture of affection. Or, she's troubled by the difficulty of the relationship and sex would help to strengthen she's unsure she wants. She's been thrown some curveballs. Your "death grip" history is intriguing. Jerri has done some research on that. Don't know what therapy is available for enabling stimulation without intense pressure. Good to hear you're up for Viagra. The ointment would be my first choice if I end up needing it in ten years. Works faster and likely far fewer side effects. I suppose it's a bit disappointing if she cannot bring you to climax. Does that make her less inclined to ask? Could you engage far more often but be comfortable with teh idea that it's for teh purpose of bringing your wife joy and demonstrating love? Or does it get to be a chore? Refusers have been heard to see it that way and sometimes it's an understandable view if the spouse is unskilled or indifferent in attempts to make it enjoyable for both. Your points are well taken. I think for her it's all of the above you mentioned. Going to have to see if she will agree to a talk with me after I get reestablished in therapy. I'm going to let her know that now that my work schedule has changed again I'll be able to resume therapy. She did respond well while I was going but also responded well I think because I was doing better. I'll look into that ointment. But what I'm learning is that not only does my brain need help (Nero feedback therapy) but abstaining from all masturbation is key as well. Need the pathways in my brain brought back "online" as well as "healing' to the nerves down there as well. Both will take time and in my case professional help.
|
|
|
Post by jerri on Feb 10, 2021 22:23:20 GMT -5
How does your therapy slow porn usage? Does your W know?
I tried to bring it in to spice up the bedroom. It worked for a while.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 10, 2021 23:02:19 GMT -5
Haven't addressed the Porn use in Therapy yet. Screening therapist now who specialize in this as well as c-PTSD. There is a Doctor who has a YouTube channel with tons of small vids breaking down this addiction (PORN) I did last summer when I first realized this and she didn't really respond. Just looked at me not saying anything so I stopped talking. www.youtube.com/channel/UC2UjsmTlsL1IhqiRt2oKvXA (Porn Brain Reboot, Dr. Trish Leigh) The thing is. Porn like say Alcohol /marijuana / for (my guess) the vast majority can be used socially and in moderation. Many people enjoy drinks or a beer or a joint / bong hit and doesn't dominate or control their life. Same with Porn I believe. I think it can be viewed by yourself or as an added "toy" in a sexual experience or relationship. For me, I started age 8 or so drinking alcohol as it was everywhere in my home with my parents. I didn't know anything but I started drinking it in left out cups that were left out as well as beer bottles left out that had like half full amounts. I found it made me feel good in that environment that was so abusive from my earliest memories. Plus my High school aged sister made me smoke pot to drug me. By the time I got out of the Army I was a heavy drinker and resumed pot smoking in Dailey large amounts got into methamphetamine that nearly killed me. Got out of the Army a 6'2' buff 225lb young man but a year later on Meth I was 130lbs. I took myself into a treatment center. Anything that took me away from the pain from the abuse /neglect. Porn started at age thirteen getting Playboys / Penthouse. I did address the chemical addictions as stated and have stayed clean/sober since age 21 .. but as for Porn .. I didn't recognize that. Ironically, My Porn use was only Porn mags you could get in like 7 elevens but I met my wife at the treatment center and we were the only two in there that voluntarily sought treatment. The 20 or so other patients were court ordered or spouse forced in there. She an I have stayed clean and sober .. but back to what was ironic about getting together with her .. She was kinky, as I was getting my first experiences with her she showed me things .. she had toys and real porn books that had graphic images more that the playboy / Penthouse I used. She took me into a "Porn Shop" I knew about them but could never let myself go into one as I thought that's where pervs hung out. What she couldn't have known as well as I was what viewing porn movies did to me. I discovered lesbian porn for the first time and I was hooked. Again she had no idea as she liked them as well and we had nasty sex as a result of her being so open ... what I found viewing porn with her is it helped me stay in that fantasy mode in my mind that was when I could stay erect and finish with her as our first few times I couldn't .. like I've mentioned .. I thought nervousness was it but I couldn't stay "present" and couldn't feel her. SO for me I now realize if I'm going to ever have a chance at really knowing what sexuality's is with a real person, I have to figure this out and try to undo as much damage "this" addiction has done to my mental and Phyical body.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 11, 2021 3:09:58 GMT -5
Have you ever cut back on porn and death grip long enough to see how many days you can forego satisfaction? (Let the tension build...)? I have and It does. Along with a dose of Viagra. The Viagra keeps me hard during the early stages of intercorse and I will start to feel sensations better. Many times then being able to finish. sorry don't mean to be graphic So for a long time (years) the compulsion of porn and masturbating really has been the "issue" that I now realize. Looking back I guess it was self medication and I would not think of my marriage and what was happening, how it was and is affecting my wife. The self medication using porn became my "go to" since I didn't drink or smoke pot or other drugs anymore. But depression was deep and very dark. Bed ridden days at a time. Sleeping 20 hour a day. Over eating junk sugar sodas. Panic Attacks waking me from a deep sleep. So masturbation and it's use with porn drugged me.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 12, 2021 7:48:51 GMT -5
"Self medication. Depression. Hope. (Lack)"
As far back into my childhood that I can remember and my whole life since ..this is all I've really known.
"Self love. Gratitude. Contentment."
My mind just can't picture that.
What I've learned from members here who are/have been denied in their marriages/relationships is life is to be lived .. all of it. And if a spouse/partner can't or won't then that person deserves no less than to find that healthy someone to be close to. Share. Laugh. Love. And yes .. sex.
|
|
|
Post by lwoetin on Feb 13, 2021 3:19:17 GMT -5
What I've learned from members here who are/have been denied in their marriages/relationships is life is to be lived .. all of it. And if a spouse/partner can't or won't then that person deserves no less than to find that healthy someone to be close to. Share. Laugh. Love. And yes .. sex. And then there is the subgroup Choosing to Stay... "SO for me I now realize if I'm going to ever have a chance at really knowing what sexuality's is with a real person, I have to figure this out and try to undo as much damage "this" addiction has done to my mental and Phyical body." What was your catalyst for change? Did your spouse do something? My wife is quite happy with her current self. I've tried threatening to leave, making her feel guilt, or jealousy, being sensitive to her feelings... No luck yet. A tough nut to crack.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 13, 2021 16:00:12 GMT -5
lwoetin "What was your catalyst for change? Did your spouse do something?"
In 2015 I was the closest to suicide I'd ever been. I knew my childhood was terrifying and bad but self medication with alcohol/marijuana in my teens and until age 21 I didn't think about it (or want to). With the added use of methamphetamine (age 20) in one years time I nearly died. Ended up in a treatment center. I put myself in there voluntarily. So fast forward to 2015 although I had and have remained clean and sober I was numb emotionally. Depression ever worse. Just making it through each day. How my wife stayed with me I don't know. But 2015 was another turning point in that I started realizing, just like I needed help from the drugs and alcohol abuse when I was younger, I knew if I didn't try to find a therapist soon I wouldn't make it.
I had never seen a therapist before so I didn't know who to look for. I googled my symptoms (Depression/Suicide/Trauma) and narrowed the field to these type of therapist. The therapy took me where I had avoided and blocked out ...my childhood abuse. It took a couple years of weekly sessions but mainly using EMDR I got tons of terrible crap out and for the first time in my life started to "feel" emotions. So with that experience slowly over the past three years I "noticed" that some of the very same patterns i.e. Depression/addictive traits were coming over me again. Like how I was in my young adult life not dealing with the trauma I was now not dealing with something else. My sexless marriage that I caused. My addiction to porn. My habitual masturbation using porn but blocking my wife out. I started to become aware that this is what I have been doing most of my marriage.
We were married 33 years ago but the sexlessness started about age 25 for me. It was slowly at first but by age 30 I might have sex with her 2x year. As I've mentioned in previous posts, this avoidance was and is a result of the sexual abuse and trauma I endured from age 5 through age 12 from my older teen sister. So this last 6 months with similar symptoms I researched:
sexless marriage Porn addiction Sexual avoidance Trauma flashbacks induced while trying to be intimate.
I was focused on men who were not having sex with their wife's/partners to see what people were saying and talking about. I started seeing a pattern in some of the information I was reading that I knew that I was doing the same. I wasn't having affairs / I didn't have hard feelings against my wife I did and do love her. But I was avoiding her sexually, I was using porn instead of being with a more that willing wife. She has always wanted sex and was always available for just about anything. I was now understanding that although I had worked with my therapist on my abuse/neglect/ witnessed trauma from my parents I didn't talk about the sexual abuse from my sister. Even though I knew I wasn't having sex with my wife and I knew I chose porn over her I don't talk about it with the therapist and when they asked about me and my wife I said everything was fine. I was asked if we were having sex and I said yes. I really was so disconnected that in my mind the 2 or 5 times a year seemed like we had just had sex yesterday.
My wife did nothing to force me into therapy or anything. The main difference I'm seeing from spouses/partners in a sexless relationship is the ones who are being neglected or otherwise shut out are the one's trying to reach out, trying to find out what's going on, trying everything they can to get their partner to be with them. My wife isn't like that. I have been the one I our relationship who tries to talk. She has a very difficult time talking. So my sexless marriage is very opposite in some ways to others here and other places I've read at. I believe she chose not to leave me and in her 30's/40's she had her needs met elsewhere. I don't believe that is true today.
|
|
|
Post by lwoetin on Feb 15, 2021 1:31:48 GMT -5
Good luck with kicking the porn addiction. IMHO, the women in there are not much more special than women all around. I'd rather spend time being with a woman than watching videos. Also, if you have depression, hang out here. There's plenty of nice people here to cheer you up.
|
|
|
Post by gladifoundthisforum on Feb 15, 2021 7:55:11 GMT -5
lwoetin "What was your catalyst for change? Did your spouse do something?" In 2015 I was the closest to suicide I'd ever been. I knew my childhood was terrifying and bad but self medication with alcohol/marijuana in my teens and until age 21 I didn't think about it (or want to). With the added use of methamphetamine (age 20) in one years time I nearly died. Ended up in a treatment center. I put myself in there voluntarily. So fast forward to 2015 although I had and have remained clean and sober I was numb emotionally. Depression ever worse. Just making it through each day. How my wife stayed with me I don't know. But 2015 was another turning point in that I started realizing, just like I needed help from the drugs and alcohol abuse when I was younger, I knew if I didn't try to find a therapist soon I wouldn't make it. I had never seen a therapist before so I didn't know who to look for. I googled my symptoms (Depression/Suicide/Trauma) and narrowed the field to these type of therapist. The therapy took me where I had avoided and blocked out ...my childhood abuse. It took a couple years of weekly sessions but mainly using EMDR I got tons of terrible crap out and for the first time in my life started to "feel" emotions. So with that experience slowly over the past three years I "noticed" that some of the very same patterns i.e. Depression/addictive traits were coming over me again. Like how I was in my young adult life not dealing with the trauma I was now not dealing with something else. My sexless marriage that I caused. My addiction to porn. My habitual masturbation using porn but blocking my wife out. I started to become aware that this is what I have been doing most of my marriage. We were married 33 years ago but the sexlessness started about age 25 for me. It was slowly at first but by age 30 I might have sex with her 2x year. As I've mentioned in previous posts, this avoidance was and is a result of the sexual abuse and trauma I endured from age 5 through age 12 from my older teen sister. So this last 6 months with similar symptoms I researched: sexless marriage Porn addiction Sexual avoidance Trauma flashbacks induced while trying to be intimate. I was focused on men who were not having sex with their wife's/partners to see what people were saying and talking about. I started seeing a pattern in some of the information I was reading that I knew that I was doing the same. I wasn't having affairs / I didn't have hard feelings against my wife I did and do love her. But I was avoiding her sexually, I was using porn instead of being with a more that willing wife. She has always wanted sex and was always available for just about anything. I was now understanding that although I had worked with my therapist on my abuse/neglect/ witnessed trauma from my parents I didn't talk about the sexual abuse from my sister. Even though I knew I wasn't having sex with my wife and I knew I chose porn over her I don't talk about it with the therapist and when they asked about me and my wife I said everything was fine. I was asked if we were having sex and I said yes. I really was so disconnected that in my mind the 2 or 5 times a year seemed like we had just had sex yesterday. My wife did nothing to force me into therapy or anything. The main difference I'm seeing from spouses/partners in a sexless relationship is the ones who are being neglected or otherwise shut out are the one's trying to reach out, trying to find out what's going on, trying everything they can to get their partner to be with them. My wife isn't like that. I have been the one I our relationship who tries to talk. She has a very difficult time talking. So my sexless marriage is very opposite in some ways to others here and other places I've read at. I believe she chose not to leave me and in her 30's/40's she had her needs met elsewhere. I don't believe that is true today. Communication Sav ; open and honest conversations. Between you and your wife. It's *really* tough. Your wife has to be convinced to actually say things she'd rather not mention. Then you stand a chance of both of you 'sorting your shit out'
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 16, 2021 5:34:37 GMT -5
Good luck with kicking the porn addiction. IMHO, the women in there are not much more special than women all around. I'd rather spend time being with a woman than watching videos. Also, if you have depression, hang out here. There's plenty of nice people here to cheer you up. I've really always wanted this. Very difficult to describe how I've been since a teen entering puberty then into adulthood experiencing what I did as a child particularly with the long term sex abuse. Biologically, all the hormones firing up, having normal wants and desires, wanting that emotional connection and learning experiences. The scars ran too deep and I had no help so I blocked memories, went numb and it wasn't a conscious thought. Just did. I faked it becoming an adult trying to mimic those who I saw around me thinking I'd find a way to be normal. Fooled most, but as far as the ladies .. we'll they can tell .. I'm not sure how really but they can tell when you're not genuine. It puts up red flags. And I picked up on their disinterest quickly as well. Did meet some women that very cool and they showed interest but I picked up on that and ran the other way. After meeting this very special woman (my wife) she was very careful and patient with me. I just didn't know (looking back now) that my early porn mag use wired my brain in a way that has and to this day keeps me disconnected in a way I can't really help anyone know what it's like.
|
|
sav
Junior Member
Posts: 23
Age Range: 51-55
|
Post by sav on Feb 16, 2021 5:42:21 GMT -5
Want to thank all who have chatted with me here as I've learned allot and understand much better the spouses/partners who hurt by this. Painful, stressful, agonizing to say the least especially when you love/loved them. Other than the refusers who were causing the SM by having affairs, all of you didn't ask to be in this club. I'm glad you people are here as new frustrated, hurt, sad men and women come here for feedback. I hope giving my story will help someone here or down the road some insight to their SM if that spouse/partner has come from trauma background especially if if was throughout their childhood.
|
|