I can back up much of the above with my own experiences. I would like to mention something regarding your opening remarks: You love him. I believe you. I'm sure we all do. On this site, we may tend to gloss over the love issue and cut straight to sounding the alarm for what YOU are about to encounter. But this is very early in your process and you love him, and are probably thinking "How can I possibly do this to him now?" (Forgive me if I'm over assuming). So you should definitely consider HIS future as well??
Statistically speaking, based on my observations on this forum, and my own experiences, I would suggest that if the present status quo is maintained, over the course of the next several years your husband has a HIGH probability of encountering a number of the following:
1. wife "craves it" more and more even as husband "craves it" less and less. 2. wife resents husband's actions 3. wife resents husband's lack of actions 4. wife resents husband in general 5. wife becomes cold toward intimacy in general 6. wife becomes depressed, perhaps clinically depressed 7. wife contemplates leaving the marriage 8. wife contemplates or engages in extra-marital affairs 9. wife contemplates suicide 10. wife contemplates what life would be like if husband were no longer alive 11. wife begins to pursue outside interests more and involve husband less and less 12. wife moves out of the marital bedroom and/or removes wedding ring 13. contempt becomes the primary love language in the marriage
Every single one of these horrors are discussed on this forum routinely. These are the default responses to the default SM. Whatever you do, please don't accept the default. Don't accept the status quo. When it comes to this issue, you have to be the "alpha" on this, or I'm afraid these defaults will be what your husband can expect from this marriage in a few short years. We refused tend to think we are concealing all this, but as my ex said to me for the first time when I filed, "You made my life a living HELL!!!" Perhaps things could have been different if she had only let me know, but she didn't. I don't think it is selfish to preemptively want mutual peace for the both of you.
Last Edit: Jun 11, 2020 21:32:26 GMT -5 by padgemi
To the OP, I totally get where you're coming from. It's been nearly 20 years for me, 19 of those married. My wife has body image issues and always had. She has suffered from diabetes that was diagnosed a year after we got married. She and I did have sex before marriage and I was her first. She was into more, like wearing lingerie, oral (at least to start until PIV), and into more positions. After we got married the extra stuff like oral and lingerie stopped completely, and the frequency came to a grinding halt. We have since had two kids (please don't do that if you are unhappy in your marriage!) and this makes things more difficult. I make considerably more than her income wise and we live in a community property state. I'm strong on my marriage vows and my faith and this makes things difficult for me to consider divorce, though the thought has been crossing my mind more, the older I get. A divorce would devastate her as she would be crushed financially. I don't believe my state has an alimony allowance outside of child support.
I should have seen the signs on the wall right after we got married and ended it there and I'm kicking myself for not doing so. I love my kids immensely, but I wouldn't want to put them through a divorce either so it looks like I'm waiting at least another 10 years before my youngest is out of school before I can consider it.
I'm lonely. We aren't really affectionate to each other, and I feel like my wife's controlling, especially with the finances. I've offered to help but she won't let me. Sex is maybe 1 time a month if that, and it's always the same: she feels guilty so she will ask if I want to do it. I stopped initiating because I got tired of the constant rejection. She has to use lube and even with that it's painful to start, even if I get her going. It's always kissing and touching her, then missionary and hurry up for me to finish. It's very lackluster and I really have to fantasize in order to finish. I have a much higher libido and usually just take care of it myself which sucks. This is what a teenager does, not a grown adult!
Sorry to rant and go off on a tangent, but I want the OP to realize what will happen if she doesn't leave before it's too late.
Post by northstarmom on Jun 13, 2020 17:37:17 GMT -5
“ A divorce would devastate her as she would be crushed financially. I don't believe my state has an alimony allowance outside of child support.”
Have you talked with a lawyer to find out both of your rights? In my community property state, for those in longterm marriages of at least 10 years, assets and debts including retirement were split down the middle. I got more because since I had sacrificed my career for his, my ex voluntarily made the asset split 60/40 in my favor. You could do the same.
As the child of parents who were miserably married throughout most of my childhood, I hope you won’t force your kids to live in the midst of a miserable marriage. I wanted my parents to divorce but they never did.
Post by angeleyes65 on Jun 14, 2020 16:57:12 GMT -5
Not to be negative but having lived in a sexless marriage and read a lot on here my advice is to just pack it up before you waste anymore time. The yard work excuse doesn't even make sense unless he is literally doing yard work everyday and is sleeping when you get home until he has to work. But seems unlikely... And if that is the case hire a lawn service or split the duties. But saying he doesnt crave it not a good sign... Working opposite shifts also makes things tough but where there is a will there is a way. The beginning usually starts hot and heavy and in most cases wanes a little due to kids, jobs etc.
I'm lonely. We aren't really affectionate to each other....
The bottom line is that you can be miserable forever if you are afraid or unwilling to make a change or at least try to make a change. During that time, life will pass you by if you let it. Trust me, I know. My wife and I spent the better part of our entire marriage to date (21 years) acting like everything was fine when it wasn't. We stopped talking about issues that were bothering us and stopped fighting for each other and our marriage. Making that change can be very difficult because it requires communication from both parties and a commitment to first off saving the marriage and then making it stronger and it requires you to be emotionally vulnerable to a spouse that you may feel doesn't love you or love you enough at the time these discussions start. If either party isn't interested in engaging in these discussions and fighting for the marriage, you'd need to ask yourself (or your spouse) some hard questions as to why they aren't willing and consider the impacts that divorce or separation will have on your family, finances, etc.
I'm curious if you have ever mentioned your comment above to your wife in a loving way? The key is in a loving way, not in an accusatory one (i.e. starting by saying "We never have sex any more" isn't the way to begin the conversation.) If you said "Honey, I feel like we are emotionally disconnected with everything life, the kids, etc. have thrown at us over the last several years and it feels very lonely. Are you feeling this at all? I just wanted you to know that I love you very much and I am really wondering what we can do to reconnect. What do you need from me to feel more connected in our marriage?" (or something along those lines).
I know as guys we aren't not good at this stuff (or at least I wasn't originally in my case, but I am getting much better), but as corny as it may sound, it does make a difference and has for me personally once I began really having these hard discussions with my wife. If nothing else, hopefully it gets you both talking and on the same page about how you feel individually and about your marriage and what you need to do to reconnect with each other. You may learn she loves you very much and feels like you have just grown apart but that she wants to reconnect but just doesn't know how (which you can then work on together). You may also find out that you aren't in love anymore and that you have both realized that and that you have both just been biding your time rather that having to make a difficult decision to end the marriage. Or, you might find that you are somewhere in the middle, with the opportunity to try to grow closer together again and save your marriage. In any case, you now know where you stand, what some of the issues bothering your wife may be and she has now learned some of the things you are concerned with. You have reached out to her emotionally and at least moved forward rather than being mired in a sexless marriage with the taboo elephant in the room that you can't talk about. In all likelihood, there are more issues at play that are having an impact on making your marriage sexless but you won't know if you don't start that discussion and try to rebuild the connection.
I highly recommend a book called "Hold Me Tight" by Dr. Sue Johnson. That book helped me see how several of these difficult discussions in marriage can lead into never ending spirals and it helps you work through those spirals to make them productive discussions that bring you closer together. When it comes to saving a marriage that is already sexless, you have to ask what do I have to lose if I don't at least try. If my marriage ultimately doesn't work out, I know that I gave 100% trying to fix it and left it all on the table so to speak. Personally, I believe as long as we are talking, we are working on fixing it. If you aren't talking about the issues, you aren't working on fixing said issues and your feelings of being alone and not feeling loved (and certainly not having meaningful sex) will continue indefinitely.
Last Edit: Jun 14, 2020 19:04:36 GMT -5 by flyingsolo
My guess is sort of similar to Northstarmon's. many people go to web sites like ILIASM to find a solution to fix the issues. Suck it up, have an extra marrital affair, or divorce is too drastic for many people. Those 3 choices are not what many people consider a "fix."
Saarinista, at least some of us know there isn't any fix so we give up looking for a fix and decide WE, as individuals, need to quit trying to "FIX" the other person.
Yesterday a friend was concerned about me not doing something for my W. I replied, "what is she going to do--cut me off?" He knows my M is sexless so said something about no sex. I replied, "precisely, it won't help or hurt my position if I didn't do X for my W. There is no sex and won't be any so what ever I do or don't do, will have the same result.
I really think many people think there are solutions when solutions are rare and take both sides to work to a similar goal. It takes a while for many people to see one person can't make much progress and different goals are another insurmountable issue.
If I had a time machine and could go back to my honeymoon, I would grab my younger self and drive him anywhere then tell him not to look back. They never change and the lies wrapoed in promises are still lies. As the Thais say, it is up to you. Only you can decide how important sex is in your life. But you hunted on line and you ended up here. It is too late for someone like me, but you can walk away, take thst precious chance.
This the "Shoutbox" -- basically a site-wide, group chat. (It's only visible to members.)
petrushka: I've no idea what it is with the toilet paper hoarding. I walked out of a supermarket yesterday and saw a woman with the jumbo sized trolley and some 4x 18 roll packs of toilet paper. Nuts. Completely nuts. Incidentally, a bidet is definitely the way to go
Mar 14, 2020 6:18:43 GMT -5
petrushka: Even her little 5 or 6 year old was questioning her purchase!
Mar 14, 2020 6:25:44 GMT -5
petrushka: One of my favourite quotes for the last 30 years: "don't ever look a sheep in the eyes, the intellectual vacuum may suck your brains out". Well, let's all drink to the sheeple! (besides, alcohol is a good disinfectant).
Mar 14, 2020 6:31:26 GMT -5
frednsa: so...............i'd like to tell her when she "attempts to placate me": have you ever been invited to a party where you knew for certain that you WEREN'T wanted ?
Mar 19, 2020 15:57:05 GMT -5
worksforme2: Former Miss Hawaii tests positive. Being the gallant lad that I am I have offered her the use of my guest bedroom to "shelter in place"..
Mar 23, 2020 20:34:21 GMT -5
worksforme2: Hey tamara68, there is a covid19 positive cat in Belgium, watch out for it.
Mar 30, 2020 14:05:56 GMT -5
tamara68: @worksforme I think I have to be more careful for all infected people. Most likely I already have Covid19
Apr 1, 2020 3:29:42 GMT -5
worksforme2: tamara68.....it's been a couple weeks since you posted you may have the covid19 virus. hopefully you are feeling better and are on your way to renewed health
Apr 11, 2020 5:31:38 GMT -5
tamara68: @worksforme thanks, yes I am feeling better. How is it in the USA?
Apr 14, 2020 1:57:26 GMT -5
worksforme2: some better and some worse,..virus seems to be slowing down, but people are beginning to refuse to stay inside,...worst thing I see is Biden leading in the election poles,...but that could be fake news
Apr 20, 2020 16:56:22 GMT -5
mirrororchid: Politics? Is that what we want to happen here?
Apr 21, 2020 6:21:24 GMT -5
petrushka: Certainly not American style politics. Toxic echo chambers.
Apr 23, 2020 16:21:52 GMT -5
petrushka: However, I feel that sexual politics, including political moves that impact the relationships between gender (misogynist, misandrist, etc) definitely deserve room in this context.
Apr 23, 2020 16:22:59 GMT -5
fred: just calculated that i've spent somewhere near 19,000 days (& nights) as a "rejectee".AND that allows for 2,000+ days (& nights) on business travel apart from her. i've chosen to "stay" .....would never do that again, and can't as you see doing the math
May 15, 2020 18:01:15 GMT -5
worksforme2: 19000 days and nights,....damn dude, that's 52 yrs.
Jun 17, 2020 9:19:10 GMT -5
fred: you're a little short works - was thinking this AM, there has NEVER been a day when she indicated desire for me physically (other than for heavy lifting or finance)........LOL...........earlier, i had enough libido for both of us, now i'm left with guilt
Jun 20, 2020 13:11:12 GMT -5
fred: over imposing myself on her rather than simply leaving .....DAMN LOVE ANYWAY !
Jun 20, 2020 13:12:12 GMT -5
mesulina: update everyone, still has not happened. I have now come to accept that I will live with out. It is just different now.
Jun 29, 2020 19:32:31 GMT -5
worksforme2: Sorry mesulina,... but on the positive side you did stock up on toys a short time back,..now might be the time to go for the gusto
Jun 30, 2020 17:42:54 GMT -5
grower: Embrace a change, you will wonder why you waited so long
Jul 9, 2020 11:22:56 GMT -5