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Post by choosinghappy on Sept 25, 2018 9:09:54 GMT -5
Thanks guys! Let’s see if I can answer all the questions: 1. Money with divorce- there’s a set formula for alimony and child support. The max for paying alimony is 12 years. Since we’ve been married 11 years and have children I’m entitled to the full 12 years. That should give me enough time to get my shit together! 2.Spyware- I just upgraded to ios12- that should reset my phone and remove any spyware. I may pick up a cheap pay as you go phone and keep it at my studio - if shit really hits the fan, I’ve got a secure way to contact folks. 3. The ‘glue’ for getting unstuck? Perhaps it’s reaching that tipping point where I could no longer reconcile his negative view of me with my own self image. I’m hard on myself. I accept responsibility and blame when it isn’t due. I think that’s why we lasted for 11 years. Do you know that feeling of reckless abandon? I can only imagine that it’s similar to the feeling that a shy teenage boy has. He’s had a crush for ages on a friend. She’s kind and smart and pretty, but she socializes mostly with the popular crowd. He’s been wanting to tell how he feels for ages. Afraid, holding back, and one morning he wakes up, runs all the possible scenarios through his head and decides, fuck it. “Today I’m going to tell her.” The months of inner torture have finally hit a tipping point. The fear of rejection and humiliation are less than the pain of sitting with his unrequited love. So he gathers all his courage and decides today is the day. That’s where I am now. I’m a teenage boy, and my secret love is my dream for a better future. One without daily criticism, exclusion, contempt and coldness from my spouse. I used to want him to change, to stop hurting me. I wanted him to understand the pain that he causes and to stop. At this point I don’t care if he ever “gets it.” I’ve got work on myself to do, changing my underlying belief that I deserve to be treated like he treats me. I’ll have my hands full taking care of myself. How he decides to handle his issues is totally on him. My plan is to nurture my independence, my self confidence and to be rock steady in knowing who I am. Currently I don’t want him. In the future I won’t need him, and he becomes totally irrelevant except for co-parenting the kids. I’d much rather be single than be married to a misogynistic asshole who doesn’t consider me an equal partner. Go sing that song to someone else, buddy. Amen elynne! Welcome back!
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Post by workingonit on Sept 25, 2018 20:04:36 GMT -5
You are doing the real work now! Write down all of your notes to yourself so when he starts spewing all manner of bs to suck you back into the pattern you will have a teflon shield to keep you out of it. Anticipate him stepping up his game as you empower yourself. You got this!
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Post by solodriver on Sept 25, 2018 23:16:49 GMT -5
You go girl!
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Post by elynne on Oct 9, 2018 2:08:55 GMT -5
I am so grateful for the therapist I have now. She’s kind and wise and dedicated and she tells the truth as she sees it.
I doubt my perceptions a lot - I get a feeling of Arrrrrvgg- anger at h for something callous or condescending that he’s said or done and then Fwoop! I find myself feeling like a child, replaying a loop of crap patterns. I feel powerless, defensive, guilty for things that are not my fault! And oh! H knows exactly which strings to pull and what buttons to push. But having someone tell me clearly the same things that I think but don’t trust myself to believe is so helpful.
My therapist said to me yesterday, “This is not something I would typically say, but in your case it is painfully clear. Your husband doesn’t love you. He never has. He may love what you do for him, but he is incapable of loving someone else because he doesn’t love himself. People do not treat those that they love the way that he treats you.
That may be hard to hear, but it is the truth.”
I asked her can he never change? Can he learn to love himself? She said no. He will never be able to feel true love or recognize it when it is given to him.
She also said that if I stay with him things will only get worse because my hopes, dreams, desires are inconvenient to him. I am only useful to him as a glorified servant; to run the household, care for his children and cook and clean. “He will replace you with someone who is happy in the role of serving someone else, someone who is content with supporting his dreams and having a husband who earns a lot of money. There are people like that. He will find one, but you would only become more miserable.”
Bitter truth. But better than a happy lie that leads me to more misery. I’d rather take stock of the whole fucked up mess, assess it clearly, and then start cleaning it up and saving myself and protecting the kids.
I’m still having trouble swallowing the fact that because of the kids we’ll always be connected. And as they get older and become independent people they may also become the targets of his emotional abuse. He’s going to get joint custody. He’s going to be alone with them. I won’t be able to stop that. I need to help them build their self esteem to the point where they will be able to withstand his attacks. To understand his hurtful words aren’t about them but that he’s acting like a hurt and scared child and the words are actually about himself.
It’s going to be a long hard road. But it’s mine. And I get to choose who I walk it with. I can choose to surround myself with kind and loving people. I can also choose to spend as little time as possible with people who intentionally hurt me.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2018 2:13:47 GMT -5
I'm so glad you found this therapist and you are emerging from the fog that your husband has been spreading, elynne . It will take effort and tears, but your life is turning around and your happiness is coming.
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Post by elkclan2 on Oct 9, 2018 2:59:11 GMT -5
"And as they get older and become independent people they may also become the targets of his emotional abuse. He’s going to get joint custody. He’s going to be alone with them. I won’t be able to stop that. I need to help them build their self esteem to the point where they will be able to withstand his attacks. To understand his hurtful words aren’t about them but that he’s acting like a hurt and scared child and the words are actually about himself. "
This has been the hardest damn thing for me to swallow.
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Post by baza on Oct 9, 2018 3:14:13 GMT -5
I think you might find that as the kids get older, they will actually become LESS susceptible to his bullshit - particularly given that the 50% time they spend with you they will not be subject to any manipulative bullshit. It seems equally possible that the kids might be somewhat inconvenient to his agenda at times to the extent where his time with them drops off, at his instigation when they don't fit in to what he wants to do. He may, of course, use the kids as a means of making your life difficult in the lead up to - and initial stages of - the split up...perhaps in an effort to intimidate you and to derail any such split from taking place. Anyway, this is all speculation until such time as you do split. You've done well to reach this stage of clarity Sister elynne . Reflect on that for a bit, gather your resources, then, the next step.
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Post by workingonit on Oct 9, 2018 5:04:34 GMT -5
Sounds like you have found the northstarmom of therapists! Truth bombs all over you! Well done. You have been manipulated for so long that you need some serious truth bombs to break through the fog. Sounds like it is working. Keep on keeping on!
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Post by northstarmom on Oct 9, 2018 5:07:12 GMT -5
Very happy that you are in long term therapy with a therapist who seems to be offering you excellent guidance. Kudos for following through on therapy! Congratulations on your Dutch citizenship.
Keep in mind that if you keep working on yourself in therapy, leave your husband and have half custody of your kids, your daughters would be spending half of their time with a narcissist and half of their time with a healthy mom. Right now, they are spending virtually all of their time with a narcissist dad and until recently were spending all of their time with a mom who was replicating the dysfunctional dynamic of her own childhood.
Your becoming emotionally healthier and then leaving your husband will give your kids a better model of healthy living than you had growing up.
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Post by choosinghappy on Oct 9, 2018 6:05:51 GMT -5
elynne I am so glad you found a competent therapist you can trust. A LOT of what you relayed in this last post is what has been said to you by many of us, some of it even word for word. So if you are having a particularly bad day or need some mental fortitude, your past posts are a good resource for you to come back to to reinforce what you are able to hear and accept from your therapist. Happy for you!
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Post by nyartgal on Oct 10, 2018 20:38:49 GMT -5
Wow!!!!! I’m so happy to hear all of your news and so proud of you! Also, your therapist sounds AMAZING.
It’s all happening..one foot in front of the other! You are almost free!
Great work, Elynne!!0
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Post by JMX on Oct 10, 2018 22:26:31 GMT -5
Good job elynne!! I suspect Elynne 2.0 coming down the pike.
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Post by surfergirl on Oct 11, 2018 12:01:00 GMT -5
That's when stuff hit the fan in my marriage, too. These guys do NOT like boundaries or women with self-esteem. KEEP GOING. He will get angrier and life will get worse, but YOU will get better. Re-read the post about intermittent reinforcement and understand that you are in process of breaking an ADDICTION. I am still not over my addiction [to him]. I want him to love me so badly. It is sick. elynne and I married the SAME GUY. Now that I'm out, I can tell you what is going to happen. My therapist told me this, and it came true. It's like having a crystal ball. He will: 1. Turn into SUPER DAD. 2. Turn everyone against you. 3. Remain calm and stable while you look like a lunatic. 4. Buy a lot of SHIT for the kids. Take them on trips. The whole shebang. I had to remain stable (I did not do a perfect job, but when I messed up, I started over.) It only took 4 months until a situation happened where my oldest daughter, who was no longer speaking to me at age 18, texted me and said, "I'm not stupid [meaning, she saw her father for who he is]." She is coming over this weekend from college to hear the story of our marriage because now she understands that I did NOT walk out on the family. I lost her and all my older kids in the divorce because they thought I abandoned the family. They all see it now. I thought it would take longer. But here I am. I got my kids' affection back and I thought it'd take YEARS for them to see the truth. It was only a matter of months. You, elynne, will hopefully not have that dynamic of losing the kids, as they are still young. My kids are ages 10 - 20, and all the older ones were PISSED, hurt, angry, etc.
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Post by shamwow on Oct 11, 2018 13:00:34 GMT -5
Very happy that you are in long term therapy with a therapist who seems to be offering you excellent guidance. Kudos for following through on therapy! Congratulations on your Dutch citizenship. Keep in mind that if you keep working on yourself in therapy, leave your husband and have half custody of your kids, your daughters would be spending half of their time with a narcissist and half of their time with a healthy mom. Right now, they are spending virtually all of their time with a narcissist dad and until recently were spending all of their time with a mom who was replicating the dysfunctional dynamic of her own childhood. Your becoming emotionally healthier and then leaving your husband will give your kids a better model of healthy living than you had growing up. This is an important point. Right now you don't really have an opportunity to leave YOUR mark on the kids. You leave a joint mark of what marriage is not supposed to be. The part that sucks most for me is that I now see my kids LESS than half the time. But the time I spend with them is rich and I focus on teaching them the things they need to know while having fun doing it.
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Post by elynne on Oct 11, 2018 13:26:23 GMT -5
That's when stuff hit the fan in my marriage, too. These guys do NOT like boundaries or women with self-esteem. KEEP GOING. He will get angrier and life will get worse, but YOU will get better. Re-read the post about intermittent reinforcement and understand that you are in process of breaking an ADDICTION. I am still not over my addiction [to him]. I want him to love me so badly. It is sick. elynne and I married the SAME GUY. Now that I'm out, I can tell you what is going to happen. My therapist told me this, and it came true. It's like having a crystal ball. He will: 1. Turn into SUPER DAD. 2. Turn everyone against you. 3. Remain calm and stable while you look like a lunatic. 4. Buy a lot of SHIT for the kids. Take them on trips. The whole shebang. I had to remain stable (I did not do a perfect job, but when I messed up, I started over.) It only took 4 months until a situation happened where my oldest daughter, who was no longer speaking to me at age 18, texted me and said, "I'm not stupid [meaning, she saw her father for who he is]." She is coming over this weekend from college to hear the story of our marriage because now she understands that I did NOT walk out on the family. I lost her and all my older kids in the divorce because they thought I abandoned the family. They all see it now. I thought it would take longer. But here I am. I got my kids' affection back and I thought it'd take YEARS for them to see the truth. It was only a matter of months. You, elynne, will hopefully not have that dynamic of losing the kids, as they are still young. My kids are ages 10 - 20, and all the older ones were PISSED, hurt, angry, etc. It’s like your therapist has a crystal ball! H just bought the youngest her own iPad, and today took her shopping for two new pairs of pants. He has NEVER in the eleven years that we’ve had children taken them shopping for clothes before. If money could buy the children’s love he’d win hands down. Luckily I’m the one that reads to them every night at bedtime, sang their lullabies, goes to every parent-teacher conference, reading mother, lice mother, room mother, chaperone for the class field trips and sports days, school soccer, drive for hockey training, plan birthday parties and bake cupcakes for school. I listen to their fears and hold them when they cry, console them and support them and cheer them on. I play games with them and dance with them in the morning before school. Papa can buy them their electronics, but when they’re scared or need a parent they come to me. I’ve got a feeling that he’s going to do his best to turn the kids, joint acquaintances and his family against me. There are some folks who will believe him, but he’s going to have to work hard. I’m friendly and cheerful, I gladly help lots of people with all sorts of things. I volunteer for charity and help underprivileged children. I’m genuinely a really nice person. Most people like me. The one glaring exception is my husband! His loss!
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