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Post by TheGreatContender -aka Daddeeo on Sept 13, 2018 9:47:29 GMT -5
Money and kids.
Im not ready to be a weekend dad. Plan is to let my youngest get to preteen age and all the kids dont need me around as much. By then the finances should be in decent shape for all of us.
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Post by ironhamster on Sept 13, 2018 10:13:01 GMT -5
I voted no, but there are really two questions there and the answer is complex. In the end, I am determined to live a better life for myself and set a better example for my kids, and I don't care what that costs. The prospect of losing the house I figured I would one day be carried out of feet first meant nothing in comparison. The prospect of perpetual alimony is an insult, but less of an insult than staying. Ditto on all counts, Example made - Kids get it good - Dont get it no worries - they will get it ONE FUCKING DAY ? What house (speaking for myself) Bank owns about 1/2 of that at this time ;-) Hey - What insult I have such little ego - You'd be underground before I'd feel insulted. On that last part, I understand why some people bury their spouses but that is not how I roll. Someday, though, I will look at the money coming out of my paycheck and think to myself, "if I'd have killed her, I'd be out by now."
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 13, 2018 10:26:31 GMT -5
Once I learned that I lived in a community property state and qualified to divorce taking half of our assets and debts, I divorced. Big reason to see a lawyer before deciding you can’t afford to divorce!
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Post by sadkat on Sept 13, 2018 15:15:33 GMT -5
I can’t “vote” since I don’t see the poll on my phone. But, my answer would be no. I’m incredibly fortunate to have a good paying job and can support myself when I get out. The biggest task would be to sell the house so we both can have more flexibility with our finances. If we really reduced our spending, we could probably afford 2 homes but I don’t see any sense in doing that. I’ll probably have to initially to force my h to agree to put the house on the market but I was planning to rent for a year anyway.
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Post by javba on Sept 13, 2018 20:26:42 GMT -5
Once I learned that I lived in a community property state and qualified to divorce taking half of our assets and debts, I divorced. Big reason to see a lawyer before deciding you can’t afford to divorce! Good point There's also no fault states where outsourcing doesn't have bigger penalties. Know your state laws
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Money
Sept 13, 2018 20:49:22 GMT -5
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Post by shamwow on Sept 13, 2018 20:49:22 GMT -5
Ditto on all counts, Example made - Kids get it good - Dont get it no worries - they will get it ONE FUCKING DAY ? What house (speaking for myself) Bank owns about 1/2 of that at this time ;-) Hey - What insult I have such little ego - You'd be underground before I'd feel insulted. On that last part, I understand why some people bury their spouses but that is not how I roll. Someday, though, I will look at the money coming out of my paycheck and think to myself, "if I'd have killed her, I'd be out by now." It's never too late....
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Money
Sept 13, 2018 21:13:44 GMT -5
via mobile
DryCreek likes this
Post by Chatter Fox on Sept 13, 2018 21:13:44 GMT -5
It's a big factor. It's only one of many factors I consider though. Its certainly not THE thing that holds me back from leaving. It absolutely contributes to the decision though.
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Post by baza on Sept 13, 2018 21:44:38 GMT -5
There is a follow up question here - relevant to those cases where "money" is being advanced as a prime driver. It is this - "Have you seen a lawyer in your jurisdiction to establish what the facts are ?" or Have you based your thinking on having consulted the law firm "Facebook Friends & Family".
For example, before I consulted my lawyer, I was of the opinion that paying debt down was the sensible and logical thing to do in my situation. As it turned out - taking in to account capital gains issues, taxation issues etc - paying down debt was a silly idea, an idea that longer term would have cost me plenty. Relying on "what I thought" and "what I understood" and "what I figured would be the case" was NOT the smart play. Consulting a lawyer who KNEW how the situation would be best played out WAS the smart play.
Turns out that my divorce attorney having been trained in the law, and having practiced the law knew a helluva lot more about the law than I did, and I daresay, more than "Facebook Friends & Family" knew about the law. Who'd a thunk it ?!!!!!
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Post by sweetplumeria on Sept 13, 2018 23:01:39 GMT -5
I tried to see a lawyer Baz. I was like a dear in headlights and I had no idea the right questions or what to expect. She tripped me up when she asked who would get custody of the kids. I panicked. I had no idea of our finances. What exactly do we ask to find out how things will shake out? I figured I wasnt ready. There is a follow up question here - relevant to those cases where "money" is being advanced as a prime driver. It is this - "Have you seen a lawyer in your jurisdiction to establish what the facts are ?" or Have you based your thinking on having consulted the law firm "Facebook Friends & Family". For example, before I consulted my lawyer, I was of the opinion that paying debt down was the sensible and logical thing to do in my situation. As it turned out - taking in to account capital gains issues, taxation issues etc - paying down debt was a silly idea, an idea that longer term would have cost me plenty. Relying on "what I thought" and "what I understood" and "what I figured would be the case" was NOT the smart play. Consulting a lawyer who KNEW how the situation would be best played out WAS the smart play. Turns out that my divorce attorney having been trained in the law, and having practiced the law knew a helluva lot more about the law than I did, and I daresay, more than "Facebook Friends & Family" knew about the law. Who'd a thunk it ?!!!!!
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Money
Sept 14, 2018 0:36:14 GMT -5
h likes this
Post by solodriver on Sept 14, 2018 0:36:14 GMT -5
I'm neck deep in debt from credit cards and student loans with a mortgage barely above water. Our home value tanked because of a brand new housing development in our area so a decade of payments has left us with no equity in our house. I'm currently working on paying down debts and stashing cash into a savings account. I'm also trying to get my wife into a better paying job which will help us both out. If we stay together, we'll be better off financially, and if not, I may avoid alimony so I help search for new job openings and proofread her applications and resumes. We're still working on saving our marriage for now, but if it isn't fixed before I fix our finances, I'm done. My current preparations will help us both whether we stay together or not so I can say that I'm preparing for both outcomes. Money (or lack of it) is absolutely keeping me in my marriage but I don't plan on letting that continue forever. EXACTLY where I am h. My mortgage, credit card debts, car payment and my wife's student loans debts leave us $0 in the bank after each paycheck. We are in the red and I'm desperately trying to keep us from going under. My wife is working now, more hours and we don't spend any money on anything, other than a drink, once a week. We don't go out for anything and now even fast food has become impossible because the costs have gone up. This holiday season we will spend nothing on us or anybody else. Our gifts to each other this year is paying off our debt. My birthday is next month and I already told her not to break the tradition she started several years ago and don't get me anything, not even a card. (I know, pretty snarky, but that's my mood around her most of the time now.) Just keep paying the bills. That's my birthday present for this year. I'm hoping for much better and fun gifts next year, but I can only get them if the present bills and debts are taken care of.
Financial issues are also keeping me bound but I'm working on my exit plan as best as I can and plan to execute it next summer.
In the meantime I have to try and keep myself under control and deal with this and not say or do anything that will accidently cause me to prematurely cause a problem to my "launch vehicle".
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Post by baza on Sept 14, 2018 0:49:02 GMT -5
In my jurisdiction Sister sweetplumeria , you would take your (both) last say 3 years worth of tax records, and every other relevant bit of financial information you have to show the asset/debt situation, income/expenditure information you have. You would also have thought through what you would like as far as custody / visitation issues in regard to minor kids, plus other matters relevant to your post married life. Doesn't mean you'd get what you'd like, but it's a starting point. Sidebar - did the lawyer not say to you - "I need this, this, this, that, this and this so I can give you a picture as to how this will probably shake out" ? If they didn't then that would call into question their competency. Might be wise to call a different one. OTOH, if the lawyer did say to you "I need this, this, this, that, this and this so I can give you a picture as to how this will probably shake out" have you now got that information ?....or can you get it ? On yet another hand, are you unknowledgeable about the finances of you/husband/both by choice ? or is he deliberately keeping you in the dark ? If it is because you've been deliberately kept in the dark, I am fresh out of ideas for you, but I think Sister ballofconfusion may have some firsthand knowledge of this scenario, and maybe she'll weigh in (or you could PM her).
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Post by baza on Sept 14, 2018 1:53:52 GMT -5
solodriver and h . It is really doubtful that you'll be able to get yourselves on a solid financial footing "within a year" or "by next summer". You may be able to make a good solid start, but I don't think it is realistic to think you can sort this out in that sort of timeframe. And again, have you embarked on this debt reduction pathway on the advice of your lawyers when you were checking out the divorce angles ? or at least a financial counsellor ? Or are you just figuring that it is probably the right thing to do ? It might not be....particularly if you are looking down the barrel of a potential divorce in the not too distant future.
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Money
Sept 14, 2018 4:49:03 GMT -5
Post by h on Sept 14, 2018 4:49:03 GMT -5
solodriver and h . It is really doubtful that you'll be able to get yourselves on a solid financial footing "within a year" or "by next summer". You may be able to make a good solid start, but I don't think it is realistic to think you can sort this out in that sort of timeframe. And again, have you embarked on this debt reduction pathway on the advice of your lawyers when you were checking out the divorce angles ? or at least a financial counsellor ? Or are you just figuring that it is probably the right thing to do ? It might not be....particularly if you are looking down the barrel of a potential divorce in the not too distant future. I fully admit, I have not consulted a lawyer yet. I do know that in a divorce in my state, our assets would be split (of which there are none), and our debts would also be split (of which there are plenty). The income discrepancy between my W and I is drastic so I would absolutely have to pay alimony. I can barely cover the debt payments each month. Paying bills AND alimony would break me. On top of that, I would need to have enough extra cash to buy her out of her share of the house because selling it right now would be impossible in the current market in our area. Also, my W has health insurance coverage through MY employer. Any divorce negotiations would also include me paying for a private health plan for her (this part I know is legally accurate from my union newsletter as the issue was discussed at length in an article from our group legal plan provider). All of this is in addition to paying lawyers (since her income is so low, I would have to pay for her lawyer too). I have no set time table for exit because of the financial issues. I have dollar amounts to use as benchmarks. Once some of the debt is paid down, I will have enough extra money in the budget to build up my "buy her out" nest egg and my "legal fees fund" and will have something we can negotiate with. Right now though, I have nothing with which to negotiate. Also, if W finally gets into a decent job, those dollar numbers would come down considerably as the likelihood or amount of alimony would be greatly diminished and she would have access to her own health insurance coverage. If I won the lottery, I would be calling a divorce lawyer the same day...
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Post by baza on Sept 14, 2018 6:44:51 GMT -5
It would seem Brother h , that you and your missus - as a unit - are probably insolvent based on what you say. In my jurisdiction, an option would be to call a halt to the financial hemorrhaging by declaring bankruptcy. A drastic move to be sure, but with your declared age demographic of 31-35, a move you could recover from if paddling your own canoe and working to an appropriate financial plan. In my jurisdiction, bankruptcy runs for 5 years. From your creditors point of view, they will be most happy for you to keep paying the minimum off your mortgage and off your credit card debt indefinitely. Your credit card debt in particular, is likely attracting interest at ridiculous rates (20%+ in my jurisdiction) which, on minimum payments might take you another 40 years. The bank don't give a shit. They'll happily accept your interest payments right up until you inevitably default. Then they'll pull the plug on you and the bankruptcy scenario will be forced on you. And all those interest payments you've made may as well have been flushed down the S bend. Brother h , I truly think you need some legal and financial advice. In my jurisdiction there is a thing called "Legal Aid". A government institution which provides free legal and financial advice to people in financial distress. Is there such a thing in your jurisdiction ? Can your Union plug you in to such a resource ? Irrespective of where your marriage goes, you need some decent legal and financial advice mate. There may be a way out of this. Not an ideal way, not a painless way. But "a" way.
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Post by h on Sept 14, 2018 6:58:21 GMT -5
It would seem Brother h , that you and your missus - as a unit - are probably insolvent based on what you say. In my jurisdiction, an option would be to call a halt to the financial hemorrhaging by declaring bankruptcy. A drastic move to be sure, but with your declared age demographic of 31-35, a move you could recover from if paddling your own canoe and working to an appropriate financial plan. In my jurisdiction, bankruptcy runs for 5 years. From your creditors point of view, they will be most happy for you to keep paying the minimum off your mortgage and off your credit card debt indefinitely. Your credit card debt in particular, is likely attracting interest at ridiculous rates (20%+ in my jurisdiction) which, on minimum payments might take you another 40 years. The bank don't give a shit. They'll happily accept your interest payments right up until you inevitably default. Then they'll pull the plug on you and the bankruptcy scenario will be forced on you. And all those interest payments you've made may as well have been flushed down the S bend. Brother h , I truly think you need some legal and financial advice. In my jurisdiction there is a thing called "Legal Aid". A government institution which provides free legal and financial advice to people in financial distress. Is there such a thing in your jurisdiction ? Irrespective of where your marriage goes, you need some decent legal and financial advice mate. There may be a way out of this. Not an ideal way, not a painless way. But "a" way. Bankruptcy is not an option for me. First, our student loans are second only to our mortgage in dollar amount and here, student loans are exempt from any bankruptcy filing. My credit cards aren't that high so I can make reasonable progress on them. Going bankrupt would ruin my credit for 10 years here and only make a small dent in the problem. Second, filing for bankruptcy would end any relationship I have with my family. Financial independence is a strick expectation in my family and getting bailed out or accepting any kind of public assistance is unacceptable. I would be cut off from the only support I have. I would be cut out of my family's life. Bankruptcy is unacceptable for me. Yes, money is tight, but we make all our monthly payments and have been paying a little extra when we can afford it. It doesn't make long term financial sense to do things the way we are because we're paying off the student loans first and they are lower interest than the credit cards. I'm doing it this way because the student loans are a debt that my W can't afford if we split and also, they are a debt she can't run back up after it's paid down. I tried to pay down on credit cards to minimize interest, but she is incapable of self discipline and maxed them back out in a few months. Even maxed out though, the interest each month is less than most people pay for a car payment on an older/used car. The total balance of all cards combined is far less than the student loans.
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