drbamboo
Junior Member
Posts: 20 
Age Range: 56-60
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Post by drbamboo on Nov 7, 2016 9:50:55 GMT -5
So after 30 years of SM I think I have become the refuser. The sex is so boring and pointless that I really can't be bothered. As far as I know she has never had an orgasm. Not with me, not by herself, not with anyone else. Of course I'm not omniscient so it's possible she has in the past or is now having wonderful orgasms in some other place with some other person or no other person. Who knows. More to the point who cares.
I'm in one of those stages before you actually begin negotiating about money. We live in a no-fault state so have not actually bothered to see a lawyer. I'm perfectly happy with losing 40%-50% of anything to get my life back. Kids are a huge sticking point for me. Youngest is applying for college, one in college and one out of college. I made a false start at an exit over a year ago and the kids went into a huge depression. The oldest threatened suicide. Etc. Etc. End of story: still here.
So anyone else go through this refuser stage? Seems like a lot of people have reset sex and that clouds the mind and causes confusion and second thoughts. We had that, but it really wasn't all that great. And now I'm back to thinking "what's the point". I can go back to therapy and spend hundreds of dollars and weeks or months of twisting myself into a pretzel about how this is somehow my fault just for one night of so-so sex. Does not seem worth it.
Not really sure there is a point to all this. But I'm new here so thought I'd "share". And I can't believe I just used that word. But anyway, Hi Everyone.
PS: has anyone else noticed that ILIASM considers the word refuser to be misspelled? Maybe I just needed a stupid laugh.
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Post by eternaloptimism on Nov 7, 2016 10:46:33 GMT -5
So after 30 years of SM I think I have become the refuser. The sex is so boring and pointless that I really can't be bothered. As far as I know she has never had an orgasm. Not with me, not by herself, not with anyone else. Of course I'm not omniscient so it's possible she has in the past or is now having wonderful orgasms in some other place with some other person or no other person. Who knows. More to the point who cares. I'm in one of those stages before you actually begin negotiating about money. We live in a no-fault state so have not actually bothered to see a lawyer. I'm perfectly happy with losing 40%-50% of anything to get my life back. Kids are a huge sticking point for me. Youngest is applying for college, one in college and one out of college. I made a false start at an exit over a year ago and the kids went into a huge depression. The oldest threatened suicide. Etc. Etc. End of story: still here. So anyone else go through this refuser stage? Seems like a lot of people have reset sex and that clouds the mind and causes confusion and second thoughts. We had that, but it really wasn't all that great. And now I'm back to thinking "what's the point". I can go back to therapy and spend hundreds of dollars and weeks or months of twisting myself into a pretzel about how this is somehow my fault just for one night of so-so sex. Does not seem worth it. Not really sure there is a point to all this. But I'm new here so thought I'd "share". And I can't believe I just used that word. But anyway, Hi Everyone. PS: has anyone else noticed that ILIASM considers the word refuser to be misspelled? Maybe I just needed a stupid laugh. [ Hi drbamboo. Love your user name  Welcome. So sorry you've ended up here with the rest of us. Sounds like you are pretty close to the end of your tether. On my way there myself! Oh the joys! Hope you find this place useful. I do. Regularly! X |
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Post by bballgirl on Nov 7, 2016 10:46:59 GMT -5
Welcome and you are in the best place in town as far as figuring things out! Better than a therapist in my opinion but I don't discredit individual therapy.
I just think marriage counseling is a waste of time and money in most cases.
I was married 23 years and after 21 I became a counter refuser. I was no longer attracted to him and it actually became incestuous to me. So at that point it was a matter of choice - 1)Stay and cheat, which I did for a little but I didn't like the sneaking around. 2) Stay and be celibate or 3) Divorce and have my freedom. I divorced this past January and I'm happier.
Read a lot on here it helps and again Welcome!
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Post by beachguy on Nov 7, 2016 10:50:19 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum! The club you don't really want to belong to...
What you describe is called counter-refusing. I was there at the end for sure and really spent 15 years there at least. That is when I stopped initiating, when it was down to a strict once a year thing, and I found it to be humiliating.
I don't like to speak for others but I believe at least a majority here are in the counter-refusal stage. It seems to be expected behavior as a marriage descends into the inevitable toxic realm. Most people are in the counter-refusal stage by the time they Google "sexless marriage" and end up here.
Although my wife enforced the monthly plan promptly after the wedding (huge bait n switch here) when we did have sex I always got her an O orally, which she enjoyed, and I think she usually or at least often got a second during PIV. I can't imagine a woman never having one but you do hear about it on occasion.
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Post by eternaloptimism on Nov 7, 2016 10:53:11 GMT -5
Fuck. I'm still waiting for my opportunity to counter-refuse. I feel left out! 😂
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Post by beachguy on Nov 7, 2016 10:59:50 GMT -5
Fuck. I'm still waiting for my opportunity to counter-refuse. I feel left out! 😂 In 15 years I never got that satisfaction. But realistically I determine a start date from when I stopped initiating which is about the same thing?  What say ye?? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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Post by greatcoastal on Nov 7, 2016 11:05:50 GMT -5
Fuck. I'm still waiting for my opportunity to counter-refuse. I feel left out! 😂 You came close to taking away his orgasm by ending his money supply! Time to carry through. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2016 11:05:58 GMT -5
Hello dr. A lot of people stop trying. My ex never tried to reset me so there was nothing to refuse, but I just gave up. I outsourced a little and was divorced last year.
Thankfully I believe all US states have No Fault divorce, so yes you can just leave, you don't have to prove any misconduct on the part of your spouse to get a divorce. But be aware that in some states marital misconduct can come back to bite you. In some states, if you or your spouse can prove marital misconduct, it can affect things such as post separation support.
Even if there is no fighting, you'll probably have to navigate some complex transactions when you divide up assets and debts. If you have a 401k for example you need an act of congress to divide it up. Actually an act of congress would be simpler and faster, and that's not a joke. You need a lawyer for this stuff.
Sounds like you're in a 50/50 state? That might simplify things. If you're in an equitable distribution state on the other hand, it's not necessarily 50/50 and negotiation may be necessary.
It will save you a lot of money and headaches if you can work out a separation agreement instead of going to court. But you need a lawyer for this too to advise you on what you should be offering and what parts of her offer you should accept. But you really really want to avoid going to court.
Ate you picking up my subtle hints that you need a lawyer? :-)
The kids are a sticking point for many people who consider leaving. I can't even imagine having my own child being suicidal. But they are adults now or close to it, and it's time for them to be thinking about their lives more than yours. But that's not something you can control. I guess it comes down to should you sacrifice your happiness for the sake of your children? There is a lot on here about that question, and as you read you'll find way more no's than yes's.
I think too it's better to announce a divorce than ask for their agreement. You probably won't get it. When you're ready and have your exit plan in place, file or move out if there's a waiting period, whatever the first step is, you'll probably have to take it unilaterally.
Good luck and we're glad you're here!
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Post by eternaloptimism on Nov 7, 2016 11:07:40 GMT -5
beachguy I've stopped initiating from the heart tbh. For a good few months now. I still say stuff every now and then, just to see the excuses he comes up with. Yesterday I countered his "when are you going shopping" question with "when are you going to eat me out" He didn't look enthused! Knob. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Post by greatcoastal on Nov 7, 2016 11:12:05 GMT -5
Welcome! Seeing an attorney would relieve many of your fears and help you to gain ground, move forward, and start a new beginning. Do not go into a divorce without one, or think you can use the same one and save money. Go see several, many are free for the first visit. You will learn more of what to say, and what questions you need answered.
Feel free to share more about your experience with the kids. As a father to 6 teenagers, two heading for college, I can relate. I am 12 weeks into my divorce.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2016 11:17:59 GMT -5
Welcome and you are in the best place in town as far as figuring things out! Better than a therapist in my opinion but I don't discredit individual therapy. I just think marriage counseling is a waste of time and money in most cases. I was married 23 years and after 21 I became a counter refuser. I was no longer attracted to him and it actually became incestuous to me. So at that point it was a matter of choice - 1)Stay and cheat, which I did for a little but I didn't like the sneaking around. 2) Stay and be celibate or 3) Divorce and have my freedom. I divorced this past January and I'm happier. Read a lot on here it helps and again Welcome! I second this assessment of marriage counseling. By the time you're here, date nights and communication exercises are not going to cut it. Don't even bother. |
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Post by beachguy on Nov 7, 2016 11:23:40 GMT -5
beachguy I've stopped initiating from the heart tbh. For a good few months now. I still say stuff every now and then, just to see the excuses he comes up with. Yesterday I countered his "when are you going shopping" question with "when are you going to eat me out" He didn't look enthused! Knob. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk "when are you going to eat me out" Truly words I cannot fathom my STBX ever saying. Just incomprehensible. When I grow up I hope my next SO says that at least twice a week because I really enjoyed it Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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drbamboo
Junior Member
Posts: 20
Age Range: 56-60
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Post by drbamboo on Nov 7, 2016 12:21:52 GMT -5
Counter refusing is overrated. First you have to wait months for an opportunity (I waited three years once) and then after a variation of "not tonight honey, I have a headache" all you get it is "oh, OK, never mind". And another 6 months of celibacy (based on my record of celibacy I could probably kill a whole town and still go straight to heaven).
And I think it just occurred to me today how much her unconcern about being refused is in itself a sign.
I'm working my way through Baz's (is that the right name, sorry if it's wrong) suggestion to look deep into what you are afraid of about divorce: guilt, loneliness, financial loss, etc. There are definitely layers to the fears.
And anyone go through the Divorce Mediator route? That seems the least expensive and hostile path. Assuming both parties agree obviously.
And, uh, without getting too inappropriate I think "when are you going to eat me out" gave every guy here a bone. But then I suspect it's not something we hear that often in the real world. I know I never have.
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Post by callisto on Nov 7, 2016 12:31:00 GMT -5
Welcome and you are in the best place in town as far as figuring things out! Better than a therapist in my opinion but I don't discredit individual therapy. I just think marriage counseling is a waste of time and money in most cases. I was married 23 years and after 21 I became a counter refuser. I was no longer attracted to him and it actually became incestuous to me. So at that point it was a matter of choice - 1)Stay and cheat, which I did for a little but I didn't like the sneaking around. 2) Stay and be celibate or 3) Divorce and have my freedom. I divorced this past January and I'm happier. Read a lot on here it helps and again Welcome! The idea of having sex with my husband is incestuous to me too - in fact I'm so whacked out of the 'normal' frame of mind that I can't believe people are supposed to have physical relations with the person they marry- it seems plain weird! Counselling does not seem nearly as useful as this site( only been twice so far but doesn't feel like I'm getting anywhere except toward an empty wallet.. ) |
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Post by bballgirl on Nov 7, 2016 13:04:46 GMT -5
Welcome and you are in the best place in town as far as figuring things out! Better than a therapist in my opinion but I don't discredit individual therapy. I just think marriage counseling is a waste of time and money in most cases. I was married 23 years and after 21 I became a counter refuser. I was no longer attracted to him and it actually became incestuous to me. So at that point it was a matter of choice - 1)Stay and cheat, which I did for a little but I didn't like the sneaking around. 2) Stay and be celibate or 3) Divorce and have my freedom. I divorced this past January and I'm happier. Read a lot on here it helps and again Welcome! The idea of having sex with my husband is incestuous to me too - in fact I'm so whacked out of the 'normal' frame of mind that I can't believe people are supposed to have physical relations with the person they marry- it seems plain weird! Counselling does not seem nearly as useful as this site( only been twice so far but doesn't feel like I'm getting anywhere except toward an empty wallet.. ) [ It got to the point I knew I would not be able to ever touch his dick again. I felt more comfortable to be intimate with a total stranger. When it gets to the point you can't even put a fork in it. |
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What say ye??
