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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2016 9:44:32 GMT -5
I''m in a bad place right now, and I'm wondering if I should have ended the relationship with my refuser.
Moving out of town was a great idea. I like it better where I am now, and I can find better jobs here.
But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it.
If I have to be on my own for the whole entire rest of my life - and I never have a real relationship again - I don't see how that is any different from having a long distance relationship with my refuser. Either way, I don't get what I really wanted.
My parents have been together for 54 years, and I doubt if they ever had a great sex life after my brother and I were born. But now, my mom has cancer, and at least my dad is there for her.
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Post by misssunnybunny on Sept 17, 2016 10:04:13 GMT -5
I've gone through similar feelings, had some seriously low moods and wondered if I made the right choice. I still see mine on occasion, as we have similar friends. Sometimes it is nice, and we chat like old friends. Other times I am reminded of why I left him. I also remember the crap I went through emotionally while still married, and the time, near the end, I had a panic attack and thought it was a heart issue. He begrudgingly helped get me to the hospital (I had driven myself to urgent care and they wouldn't let me go to the hospital by myself, for more tests), and he complained the entire time we were there about how it was affecting him....I was fine but his selfishness was over the top that day.
Overall, I like where I am now: great job, friends, love my home and where I live. Being alone is fine most of the time, but I do get not those dark, depressing moments where I feel I will be alone forever. I try to have hope that one day I will find someone else, and most of the time I believe it will happen. Until then, I have to remind myself of how far I've come, and I deserve more than he was willing to give.
I hope your mom is doing well. {{hugs}}
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Post by bballgirl on Sept 17, 2016 10:10:55 GMT -5
Kat your words so resonate with me and I can totally relate. I have gone out on quite a few dates the past 6 months and nothing has clicked. Most of these men were players. Another man was genuinely nice but I knew we were not sexually compatible at all. Another man seemed like he didn't know how to man up and wanted me to pursue him, I lost interest very quickly.
Catch and release. Last week I said I feel like I may have to date over a hundred men until I find the right one. I'm also on match, POF, and OurTime.
The only catches for me have been POF. I get messages on the other two sites but not a lot and nothing to tempt me to respond.
So on Monday I got a message on OurTime from a man and we hit it off we have talked on the phone a lot this week and tomorrow night we are going for dinner. Who knows?! Until you meet someone you don't but we seem to be connecting so far.
I guess my point is: don't be discouraged just keep fishing. There are good men out there too. Maybe join more than one website and just give it time because when you least expect it that's when it can fall into your lap. As far as your ex - that wasn't normal and there have been times that I've been sad when he takes the kids to the movies and the family unit is not intact but I know I'd be miserable under the same roof. Keep putting yourself out there and find your happiness.
Hugs
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Post by nyartgal on Sept 17, 2016 10:23:48 GMT -5
Ha! I just posted a thread in the off topic section about how now that I have a great marriage, I'm in a financial freefall. Laughing because it's obvious there is no such thing as "having it all" if having it all means having it at the same moment! When one area of life improves (or many), there's always something that seems like a mess. I guess it keeps us humble. Eventually the balance will shift and you will find a great partner. And then something else will fall apart! Such is life.  |
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Post by Caris on Sept 17, 2016 16:54:44 GMT -5
Honestly Kat, at this stage, if my refuser had only been a refuser, but had other qualities that would have made for a good marriage, I may as well have stayed. The sexless part was the main event for many years, but the passive aggressive abuse and dishonesty just got worse, so it's better I'm away from that because it caused me great damage along with the rejection.
I'm about a 8-10 years older than you, I think, so I've had longer to accept that this may be as good as it gets for me...growing old alone. Sometimes I cope with it, and sometimes, it feels like I'm dying a slow death of loneliness. I don't fit in to modern day society. I've become something of a loner and shun society, so things like developing a social life hold no interest for me. Part of that comes from the pain of those decades of life and not trusting people, and part comes from my Buddhist practice.
All I know is that it's a lonely life having no one care for me, or share good and not so good experiences. I want to do things but it takes a partner, so I don't do them. I miss hugs and tenderness, but here I am. Sometimes it's so lonely that I miss my ex, but that's just loneliness playing tricks with my mind. I can't go back, but I don't blame anyone for staying or going back if life in oppositeland is not what they thought it would be.
The truth is that dating has changed and so has the culture since we were young. Now, it's more about hook ups than actual courting. The other thing is we have changed too, so I'm not feeling the fit into this "new" world.
Only you know what's right for you, Kat. I wish you well. Hugs.
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Post by JMX on Sept 17, 2016 19:24:14 GMT -5
Sending positive vibes to you, your mom and your family. Super, duper big hugs!
As for the rest - ah. Well, I have no idea. I did get to the point where it was much better to go than stay. I am on the fence about staying right now as I have some pretty big fish to fry currently. So, that to say, I cannot speak from experience or wisdom in this. I am currently with my "almost STBX" (as you know). My new schedule does not work without him and he has been better about "some" things. While I am figuring it out, I am happy with being about 70-80% okay.
The things I currently crave about my almost-single-life: more "me" time, more connection with friends (although they have to be available and this is hard because they all have kids too), more time to develop my interests, and - I think I actually MISS sleeping alone.
The things I have noticed since I have been "trying" again that sincerely suck: slipping back into old routines that I HATE with the passion of a thousand suns (my own old, bad ways), the fact that when my schedule normalized, I still do everything and nothing very well, the moxie I felt when changing my attitude is almost all but gone.
Some things have shifted for the better, and some things I cannot un-see. So, everything has changed, for the better AND for the worse.
I woke up one morning recently and HAD to watch Sliding Doors - it's a Gwyneth Paltrow movie set in London and as an Anglophile, I figured it was my need to watch a British film. I found it and loved it again (and not just for the accent).
After watching it, I took away the feeling that we all end up how we're supposed to end up. Did you miss the subway and your life changed? Sure! But you always find a way back on your path - we just don't know what that path actually is. Life is a mystery and THANK GOD for that.
You took the right path for you. It will lead you to where you are supposed to be. It will take care of you. Same for me.
You are smart, you are kind and you are beautiful. I am proud of you and look forward to seeing how it all unfolds - however that works out. The mystery of it all is quite exciting!
Love you and your sweet heart.
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Post by baza on Sept 17, 2016 21:52:29 GMT -5
Quoting you here Sister SmartKat - "But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it".
-
A question -
- is it imperative that you have a partner ?
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Post by olgana on Sept 18, 2016 6:15:56 GMT -5
I know what you feel. I left my refuser 4 years ago, and haven't dated since then. Sometimes, I feel so lonely and desperate that I wonder if I made a mistake to leave him. I start believing I could have fixed him... particularly when I discovered he had a new girlfriend.... But actually, as soon as I start detaching myself from these painful feelings, I know that I was right to leave. It took me a long time to understand it because I was manipulated, but, in essence, a refuser is an abuser. Withholding sex and affection is a lack of care, respect. In essence, it is emotional abuse. I reckon I should have left much earlier, and the only reason why I tolerated this abuse for so long is my being codependent. I am presently working on myself to break from this co-dependency.
Life after a sexless marriage is awfully difficult. I still feel broken, I suffer from invisible scars and most people can't understand the pain you have - and still - experience(d).
But leaving was the best move.
Better feel lonely alone than lonely in your couple.
In my case, I also know I tend to underestimate the pain I endured with him, but then I remember that leaving was a survival instinct.
I do not feel very well now, but I do not know if I could have coped with this treatment longer.
So yes, life is difficult. I also moved to another town and see my children much less.
He manipulates them.
But now, my youngest one starts understanding his games.
I am hopeful that the other ones will also open their eyes...
Myself, I am broken but free.
I might never find another relationship, but at least, I give me the opportunities to do so.
I keep the faith!
Do not look back! No regrets!
All is happening perfectly in life. You did the best you could. It may take time, but we will get better.
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Post by unmatched on Sept 18, 2016 8:09:34 GMT -5
I''m in a bad place right now, and I'm wondering if I should have ended the relationship with my refuser. Moving out of town was a great idea. I like it better where I am now, and I can find better jobs here. But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it. If I have to be on my own for the whole entire rest of my life - and I never have a real relationship again - I don't see how that is any different from having a long distance relationship with my refuser. Either way, I don't get what I really wanted. My parents have been together for 54 years, and I doubt if they ever had a great sex life after my brother and I were born. But now, my mom has cancer, and at least my dad is there for her. SK, I am sorry you are feeling so crap right now. It is horrible feeling alone and feeling that it might go on forever. I guess I would beg you to try and take a longer view. My grandmother found herself single in her late 50s. She stayed that way for a decade, I think partly through choice. She then remarried for another 20 years and found herself single again in her late eighties. Life is long, and when you are depressed it is easy to look at one bit and draw some very big conclusions. You are smart and witty and strong and if you hang in there I have no doubt you will get what you want. (although probably not how you expect) |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2016 8:49:29 GMT -5
I''m in a bad place right now, and I'm wondering if I should have ended the relationship with my refuser. Moving out of town was a great idea. I like it better where I am now, and I can find better jobs here. But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it. If I have to be on my own for the whole entire rest of my life - and I never have a real relationship again - I don't see how that is any different from having a long distance relationship with my refuser. Either way, I don't get what I really wanted. My parents have been together for 54 years, and I doubt if they ever had a great sex life after my brother and I were born. But now, my mom has cancer, and at least my dad is there for her. SK, I am sorry you are feeling so crap right now. It is horrible feeling alone and feeling that it might go on forever. I guess I would beg you to try and take a longer view. My grandmother found herself single in her late 50s. She stayed that way for a decade, I think partly through choice. She then remarried for another 20 years and found herself single again in her late eighties. Life is long, and when you are depressed it is easy to look at one bit and draw some very big conclusions. You are smart and witty and strong and if you hang in there I have no doubt you will get what you want. (although probably not how you expect) This last parenthetical caveat sums up the matter to me. You never know when or where you'll run across someone and it clicks. And really, just talking out my arse here, not from actual experience, but from the anecdotal evidence I've seen, that "where" is not likely to be a dating site. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2016 9:45:56 GMT -5
Quoting you here Sister SmartKat - "But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it". - A question - - is it imperative that you have a partner ? said it better than I could. It's imperative that I have the *right* partner. Or to express it with symbols: Good relationship > alone > wrong relationship I wish society would just get over this idea that unless we are totally strong, totally independent, have no needs, and are perfectly happy to do everything alone forever, that we are somehow flawed and unworthy of having a partner. That's just another version of telling me I have to look like a Barbie doll, or else men won't find me attractive. Sometimes life hands you some bad stuff - job losses, sick family members, etc. Nobody is exempt from that. I guess the ideal is to be perfectly happy and never need anything from anybody, despite every bad thing life throws at you. I have done therapy, self-help books, all kinds of other things designed to make me perfectly happy and cheery at all times. This has worked about as well as eating nothing but steak and broccoli would work to make me grow from 5'2" to 5'7". I'm never going to grow any taller. Perhaps I'm also never going to get over my "wrong" desire to have a partner at my side. |
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Post by Caris on Sept 18, 2016 12:43:30 GMT -5
Quoting you here Sister SmartKat - "But, I have had no success at all in finding another real partner. I've done some throwaway dating that hasn't brought any real results, but that's it". - A question - - is it imperative that you have a partner ? said it better than I could. It's imperative that I have the *right* partner. Or to express it with symbols: Good relationship > alone > wrong relationship I wish society would just get over this idea that unless we are totally strong, totally independent, have no needs, and are perfectly happy to do everything alone forever, that we are somehow flawed and unworthy of having a partner. That's just another version of telling me I have to look like a Barbie doll, or else men won't find me attractive. Sometimes life hands you some bad stuff - job losses, sick family members, etc. Nobody is exempt from that. I guess the ideal is to be perfectly happy and never need anything from anybody, despite every bad thing life throws at you. I have done therapy, self-help books, all kinds of other things designed to make me perfectly happy and cheery at all times. This has worked about as well as eating nothing but steak and broccoli would work to make me grow from 5'2" to 5'7". I'm never going to grow any taller. Perhaps I'm also never going to get over my "wrong" desire to have a partner at my side. Kat, what you and @fiery said, very, very well said. I wholeheartedly agree with both of you. It seems a person must be completely happy alone with no need for touch, affection, caring and sharing or have a need for a deep connection with a lover...and making love. Somehow, we are to have no needs and just being by ourselves should suffice, but this is not reality. We are all interdependent beings who affect each other. If we didn't we might as well be robots. Most of us are better out of the abuse of a SM, but all those needs that were denied being met in the marriage, don't miraculously disappear just because we are now single. Some people like being single and celibate with no human intimacy, but from viewing life for over 60-years, most suffer greatly when denied love, affection, feeling wanted, feeling like you matter to someone, and having someone special to share the good times and the bad. I know this is true for me because I've experience love, and feeling wanted, albeit for a very short time in my life, and I can tell you that with such love as a foundation of life, you can pretty much deal with anything, but take that foundation away, and every issue feels 10 times the pressure. I've slept on the floor, only had apples to eat, but God, I WAS so happy that it didn't matter to me. Some love and some kindness and I'm in my element. Without it, I'm like a plant that's struggling to survive without enough water. We all need love. |
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Post by itsjustus on Sept 18, 2016 14:20:10 GMT -5
Aww @smartkat . It kills me to see you in such a lonely funk!!! I've known you for a long time and I know how important the human contact, interaction, and love of someone is to you, just as it is for me.
What you say about how it's expected that we are all "supposed" to be just as happy and comfortable with just ourselves alone, is pure bullshit! What the hell!!! We're all here on this forum EXACTLY because we NEED that connection and weren't getting it in our marriages! If we didn't, we would not only not be here, we'd be content to live with our refusers and be perfectly "alone" there!!!! Which is what we were....alone, but with someone who vowed not to let us feel that way.
I am not the one to be here trying to comfort you. You and I both know that. I've been very, very fortunate in my post SM life in finding people who loved me. You of all people know of my first experience, how fulfilling, but ultimately damaging that was for me. I NEED love in my life. I can't live without it. So I took the risk. I paid a price for that risk, but it showed me so much more of how life should be, how love should be. It showed me that I need to give myself in service to another to feel complete. It also showed me that *I* need that for myself....a hard lesson, as you know.
I did take time after that relationship to look inward, to live "by myself" and find that I liked "me"....I like who and what I've become after my SM. I even enjoyed the feeling of not having to be in constant contact with anyone, that needy feeling of constant affirmation of myself as a human with the need for love....mostly. I still yearned to have that someone special in my life, someone I could give myself to, someone I could find that fulfillment in. But I was very, very mindful of my experience of life before in my SM, a life of emotional abuse. There were no redeeming qualities there. For that I guess I find myself fortunate. There's no regrets in leaving that life. I can only begin to understand your second guessing.
And once again, I find myself fortunate. I've found someone who can love me, and accept my love, beyond what I could have hoped for or even dreamed of previously. And that....makes me completely unqualified to give you any advice on where you're at right now. I can only say that it's possible, but that has to be little comfort to you and other's, HelenT, or MountainRunner or grantgeek or bballgirl, Caris, or Fiery and so many others I don't know of, who have yet to find that. I wish that for each one of you. I can only say that I never, ever, lost hope that it was out there. That there HAD to be someone out there for me. That I MUST take the risk to find that for me.
I came very close to joining you in the "dating pool" on the websites, wondering if by some circumstance that I'd actually run into you or the others on OKStupid, LOL. But I didn't have to. It was here, on ILIASM, that I found someone who felt the same as me, who had lived the same un-fulfilling life as me. Someone who already knows about the damage a SM can cause, and how as giver's (which I think the majority of us are) we shared the same needs and idea's of what a relationship should be. What we want for our "normal". I'm not saying this should be a "dating site", far from it, but it is certainly a place where our deepest emotions of what our needs for love and intimacy is the very first thing we know about each other. It's been one "Wow" moment after another. I was spared the sifting thru those who couldn't possibly understand where I've been and how damaged I was....and am.
Whether you decide to keep going on a quest to find that in your life, or go back to your previous life, is up to you and a perfectly valid choice. You need to be happy in your life. I hope that for you.
You...my dear friend Smartkat....deserve that, no matter how you find it. |
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Post by worksforme2 on Sept 18, 2016 14:55:13 GMT -5
Ahhh..impetuous youth. I'm maybe full of it but it just seems to me your post here is a mirror of the sentiment below your avatar. I get a read that you are frustrated because having moved on from your refuser you expected to quickly meet the man of your dreams. If reading here tells us anything it is that those of us who have exited a S/M rarely have the good fortune to make that connection with in a few months of leaving our dysfunctional relationship. There are a couple of exceptions, but that's what they appear to be, exceptions. Think back to your EP days and all the folks who posted about not being ready to date or entertain the idea of a meaningful relationship, even after years of being out. You have been actually dating now for what, maybe 6 months. That's way to short a time frame to have the expectation that you should be settled back into the couple combo fit with a great man that is so simpatico. That would make for a good romance novel, but it's unlikely in real life. For most of us and this may include you, 'patience really is a virtue and everything comes to she who waits'.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2016 15:49:21 GMT -5
Ahhh..impetuous youth. I'm maybe full of it but it just seems to me your post here is a mirror of the sentiment below your avatar. I get a read that you are frustrated because having moved on from your refuser you expected to quickly meet the man of your dreams. If reading here tells us anything it is that those of us who have exited a S/M rarely have the good fortune to make that connection with in a few months of leaving our dysfunctional relationship. There are a couple of exceptions, but that's what they appear to be, exceptions. Think back to your EP days and all the folks who posted about not being ready to date or entertain the idea of a meaningful relationship, even after years of being out. You have been actually dating now for what, maybe 6 months. That's way to short a time frame to have the expectation that you should be settled back into the couple combo fit with a great man that is so simpatico. That would make for a good romance novel, but it's unlikely in real life. For most of us and this may include you, 'patience really is a virtue and everything comes to she who waits'. Thanks. I think I'll take some Benadryl and try to sleep as much as possible through the next year; maybe that will use up the time a bit faster. And, I thought of another thing. Maybe people who only want to be around me when I''m in a good mood are not people who care about me - they just don't want the discomfort of seeing me when I refuse to pretend everything is fine. That would be the equivalent of a person who would cringe if they saw me with no makeup on. Maybe telling the truth about how I really feel is an equivalent to going out without makeup on. If someone finds me unattractive because I would rather have a partner than be on my own - obviously, we are not a good match. I would say, "Buh-bye. If you don't find me attractive, you don't need to be in my life. Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out." |
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