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Post by lostintime on Nov 26, 2019 18:37:05 GMT -5
I told my story in a previous thread iliasm.org/thread/4099/adviseWife now works and makes about 100K a year. At the worst we did not have sex for a month as she was complaining that I was not helping, so I now help her with all reasonable demands. We still fight every couple of days and have sex about 3 times a week. At some point it was very bad and I asked for divorce I think my biggest issue is that in the beginning of our relationship she was very attracted to me and I was never really attracted to her but really liked her as a person. Girls that I was attracted to were not as nice toward me, so I decided to stay with her. It all started going down hill after the first child was born about 10 years ago it got a little worse after the second child was born, and now its getting really bad after she started making money. The overwhelming sense I got from your note today and in your previous story, is that you felt you compromised to marry her - that you didn't want to be married to her and just being with her was not your first choice. I think in a marriage, across a decade...it's really hard to hide that from your partner. It is expressed in many ways. As you said, you hate your wife. I don't think I'd really ever want to have sex with someone who I thought hated me. I'd probably not even want it with someone who really would prefer to be with someone other than me. If it started going downhill after the kid was born, then it is likely that the increased investment in the relationship amplified the feeling of being trapped with someone who isn't suited, or who holds them in contempt. Let me ask you - did it get worse also when you bought a house together, or made some other big investment? Not everyone who loves each other should be married to each other - at least in Western concepts of romantic marriage. The sense I'm getting from this is that the disconnection and distance you feel is likely the result of her perceiving the contempt. I had options to marry other girls that were more attractive to me, but they were not very nice to me nor do I think they loved me. Marriage is a long commitment and is not just about looks but a general compatibility. At that time I thought she was the best option for me. She got full support from me in anything she needed. I hate that the nicer and better I became to her, she became more indifferent to me. If we get divorced and we go our separate ways I would still wish her all the best. I hate her for what she became and does not appreciate that I am 100 times better to her now from the time we met and she is a lot worse to me from the time we met. I still think she is a nice person especially to other people. She volunteers a lot and helps out a lot of people. I hate her for how she treats me now and that she forgot how it all started and does not appreciate for what I have done for her. I do not know maybe I am wrong and she is right, but at the end of the day I still feel bitter of how I ended up. She thinks there is nothing wrong.
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Post by lostintime on Dec 1, 2019 17:05:11 GMT -5
“I hate her for what she became... I am 100 times better to her now.” I’m having some difficulty reconciling these 2 statements. Do you think your W would agree with both of these? We spoke about how I am so much nicer to her from the time that we met and she is less nice to me from the time that we met and she totally agrees. She says that she is still nice to me especially compared to other couples we know. I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. I do not think she would be the same way if she had to give me the kids and pay child support until kids get to 21 years of age.
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Post by isthisit on Dec 1, 2019 17:31:12 GMT -5
I’m having some difficulty reconciling these 2 statements. Do you think your W would agree with both of these? I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. Some women possibly. All women, not at all.
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Post by saarinista on Dec 22, 2019 1:19:40 GMT -5
I’m having some difficulty reconciling these 2 statements. Do you think your W would agree with both of these? We spoke about how I am so much nicer to her from the time that we met and she is less nice to me from the time that we met and she totally agrees. She says that she is still nice to me especially compared to other couples we know. I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. I do not think she would be the same way if she had to give me the kids and pay child support until kids get to 21 years of age. Generally, I tend to side with men here who are refused. But in your case, no can do. Your wife pulls down 100k plus she is a mom. Add that to your 200k. Not billionaires in metro NYC, but not poor. You have some sex. You're busy. Probably tired. And clearly you think you deserve better. Never mind about her. Dude. Your attitude sounds pretty entitled to me. Now you want to seize the kids and manipulate things that way, too? I'm not sure you should be married to anyone. Just dump the family, get richer and pay for sex, maybe? Not trying to be cold or rude, but hey. When you have kids and work, as does your wife, there are time limits. You're sending vibes you really didn't want her anyway, so what the fuck? Being someone's fallback wife wouldn't make me feel horny, either! Why don't you get some therapy in your own to figure out if you really even want to be married? To anyone? Given that Charlize Theron is not likely going to be your second wife? Again, not trying to be harsh, but I think you're somewhat unrealistic. Let me know if I missed something.
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Post by isthisit on Dec 22, 2019 5:05:21 GMT -5
We spoke about how I am so much nicer to her from the time that we met and she is less nice to me from the time that we met and she totally agrees. She says that she is still nice to me especially compared to other couples we know. I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. I do not think she would be the same way if she had to give me the kids and pay child support until kids get to 21 years of age. Generally, I tend to side with men here who are refused. But in your case, no can do. Your wife pulls down 100k plus she is a mom. Add that to your 200k. Not billionaires in metro NYC, but not poor. You have some sex. You're busy. Probably tired. And clearly you think you deserve better. Never mind about her. Dude. Your attitude sounds pretty entitled to me. Now you want to seize the kids and manipulate things that way, too? I'm not sure you should be married to anyone. Just dump the family, get richer and pay for sex, maybe? Not trying to be cold or rude, but hey. When you have kids and work, as does your wife, there are time limits. You're sending vibes you really didn't want her anyway, so what the fuck? Being someone's fallback wife wouldn't make me feel horny, either! Why don't you get some therapy in your own to figure out if you really even want to be married? To anyone? Given that Charlize Theron is not likely going to be your second wife? Again, not trying to be harsh, but I think you're somewhat unrealistic. Let me know if I missed something. YEAH! We need a ‘like with bells on’ option for just such occasions as this. saarinista you are a hero.
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Post by GeekGoddess on Dec 22, 2019 10:00:58 GMT -5
Hi, lostintime - I am having issue with the comment that you and your wife discussed counseling and mutually decided that it couldn't or wouldn't do you two any good. So - which of you is the counselor who gave this expert opinion?
Here's an analogy for example....when I got a headache yesterday, I was grumpy. I had acetaminophen in my purse. I didn't want to take it. I thought about it and decided not to. My head still hurt. VERSUS: I didn't want to bother finding a water, but I went to the trouble and took the medicine. And realized later, my head no longer hurt.
TRY the counseling. If it doesn't fix the marital issues, that's okay. I went to a counselor for my own benefit. Having someone who would JUST LISTEN without defensiveness or judgment allowed me to clarify for myself what my choice would be. It let me see that leaving my SM stood on its own merit. (BTW - I was entirely celibate in my marriage for 3 years. WTF you complain the worst you two have had was one whole month? Holy crap! That's a luxury problem!)
In any case - I would think you each could benefit from individual counseling and a joint marriage counseling stint, not to mention a family-group session or two. This could be used as a tool to try and reconcile all parties OR could be used as a transition-assisting method for easing the effects of an ultimate divorce. Your kids likely would benefit from some outsider-assistance whether you two stay married or don't.
I am thrilled for you that you have little financial challenge and really, that you seem to care enough that your not-that-great could use something to be even-better. You gotta understand: your version of not-that-good sounds practically ideal for a person like me, that had zero sex, many financial worries, and experienced contempt and derision piled on top. I truly think you ought to try some counseling before deciding that it does not do any good. There are articles in the Resources subforum on what to look for, how to interview and/or measure if it is helping. Lots of good info there.
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Post by csl on Dec 22, 2019 15:43:37 GMT -5
We spoke about how I am so much nicer to her from the time that we met and she is less nice to me from the time that we met and she totally agrees. She says that she is still nice to me especially compared to other couples we know. I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. I do not think she would be the same way if she had to give me the kids and pay child support until kids get to 21 years of age. Generally, I tend to side with men here who are refused. But in your case, no can do. Your wife pulls down 100k plus she is a mom. Add that to your 200k. Not billionaires in metro NYC, but not poor. You have some sex. You're busy. Probably tired. And clearly you think you deserve better. Never mind about her. Dude. Your attitude sounds pretty entitled to me. Now you want to seize the kids and manipulate things that way, too? I'm not sure you should be married to anyone. Just dump the family, get richer and pay for sex, maybe? Not trying to be cold or rude, but hey. When you have kids and work, as does your wife, there are time limits. You're sending vibes you really didn't want her anyway, so what the fuck? Being someone's fallback wife wouldn't make me feel horny, either! Why don't you get some therapy in your own to figure out if you really even want to be married? To anyone? Given that Charlize Theron is not likely going to be your second wife? Again, not trying to be harsh, but I think you're somewhat unrealistic. Let me know if I missed something. Thank you. Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU!!I have been, metaphorically, biting my tongue since the first post in this thread wanting to say something, but not wanting to let my inner stinker off its leash. So thank you.
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Post by lostintime on Dec 23, 2019 11:22:21 GMT -5
We spoke about how I am so much nicer to her from the time that we met and she is less nice to me from the time that we met and she totally agrees. She says that she is still nice to me especially compared to other couples we know. I guess its just nature of women that after marriage and kids they become more confidant and become less caring and more challenging. I do not think she would be the same way if she had to give me the kids and pay child support until kids get to 21 years of age. Generally, I tend to side with men here who are refused. But in your case, no can do. Your wife pulls down 100k plus she is a mom. Add that to your 200k. Not billionaires in metro NYC, but not poor. You have some sex. You're busy. Probably tired. And clearly you think you deserve better. Never mind about her. Dude. Your attitude sounds pretty entitled to me. Now you want to seize the kids and manipulate things that way, too? I'm not sure you should be married to anyone. Just dump the family, get richer and pay for sex, maybe? Not trying to be cold or rude, but hey. When you have kids and work, as does your wife, there are time limits. You're sending vibes you really didn't want her anyway, so what the fuck? Being someone's fallback wife wouldn't make me feel horny, either! Why don't you get some therapy in your own to figure out if you really even want to be married? To anyone? Given that Charlize Theron is not likely going to be your second wife? Again, not trying to be harsh, but I think you're somewhat unrealistic. Let me know if I missed something. My wife makes 100K because I helped her to get there. For 20+ years I was working 70+ hours a week and helping with kids. She was not working for many years but its not just about the money. We now have cleaners and I help around the house and also continue helping with kids. We do have some sex. I work very hard on my business and also working out. She is more on the lazy side of things always tired even though she sleeps 8+ hours a day I do not want to seize kids, not sure where you got this from, nor am I trying to manipulate things. Not sure why you think I should not be married. I want to be married to someone who loves me and supports me and works hand in hand with me, like a team. I do not want to dump the family. If I wanted to dump the family I would of done it already. Also do not want to pay for sex. I am not sure what time limits you are talking about, I have a business and work many hours also workout and also have time for my wife and kids. I start my day early around 5am and finish my day late around midnight. My wife knew I did not want to marry her but she wanted to marry me, I was very honest with her not sure why you bring this up as an issue. So its OK to be horny as a fallback wife until you have kids and stop being horny after that? I want to be married, preferably to someone who is there for me and even better if she is someone who looks like Charlize Theron. But if I get divorced I do not think I would marry the second time. Many women change after they get married, why risk it. You are not harsh, you do sound a little angry and I understand that your situation is probably worse and me complaining does not make you feel any better. I do think that everyone deserve to be happy.
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Post by saarinista on Dec 23, 2019 13:32:03 GMT -5
lostintime I'm glad I didn't sound harsh. I AM a bit angry at your WIFE, though, for staying in a shell of a marriage that is surely murdering her self esteem and soul, bit by bit. It's not doing your kids any favors, either, IMHO, to live in a situation where love and marriage are portrayed in such a "meh" light. The lessons they are learning about what marriage and relationships can be are, quite possibly, NOT positive ones. I hope both you and your wife get therapy to see why you are both putting up with a disatisfying traditional marriage, even though you are both ambivalent about it. Honestly, perhaps an open marriage would better fit your situation. I'm not sure you could be satisfied with any one woman. News flash - even Charlize Theron doesn't look like Charlize Theron in person. You're seeing the red carpet filtered version. Besides, it's really hard to attract someone of her ilk unless you meet at least a few million dollars a year, I would think. I mean, good luck, but the odds seem very low, especially since you work so much. When are you going to have time to meet anyone like Ms. Theron? You barely have time for your kids. You might be better off with finding a high-level escort service to fill your excess needs. Seriously. Or, find a really beautiful, sexually gifted someone to be your "kept" woman, if you can afford it. All of these things will require some compromises, but that's life as I see it. Compromise can be a bitch, but it's almost always necessary. Perfection does not exist in this world. All the best to you and yours. Happy holidays! 🎄🎉🎊♥️🗺️🎁🕎 ❄️🌟 ⛄🌠⭐
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Post by lostintime on Dec 23, 2019 22:43:06 GMT -5
lostintime I'm glad I didn't sound harsh. I AM a bit angry at your WIFE, though, for staying in a shell of a marriage that is surely murdering her self esteem and soul, bit by bit. It's not doing your kids any favors, either, IMHO, to live in a situation where love and marriage are portrayed in such a "meh" light. The lessons they are learning about what marriage and relationships can be are, quite possibly, NOT positive ones. I hope both you and your wife get therapy to see why you are both putting up with a disatisfying traditional marriage, even though you are both ambivalent about it. Honestly, perhaps an open marriage would better fit your situation. I'm not sure you could be satisfied with any one woman. News flash - even Charlize Theron doesn't look like Charlize Theron in person. You're seeing the red carpet filtered version. Besides, it's really hard to attract someone of her ilk unless you meet at least a few million dollars a year, I would think. I mean, good luck, but the odds seem very low, especially since you work so much. When are you going to have time to meet anyone like Ms. Theron? You barely have time for your kids. You might be better off with finding a high-level escort service to fill your excess needs. Seriously. Or, find a really beautiful, sexually gifted someone to be your "kept" woman, if you can afford it. All of these things will require some compromises, but that's life as I see it. Compromise can be a bitch, but it's almost always necessary. Perfection does not exist in this world. All the best to you and yours. Happy holidays! 🎄🎉🎊♥️🗺️🎁🕎 ❄️🌟 ⛄🌠⭐ I am also angry at my wife but for a different reason. She wanted to be with me from the time she was very young, she new my position and she still wanted to be with me. I married her and watched over her, helped her with education, working out, etc. After a few years of marriage we both decided to have kids. My kids do not know the situation in the bedroom. They see my love to them and help to them and wife. From math help to kids to business decisions to my wife. I am home from 6:30pm until they go to bed, help them with sports and education. Not sure what traditional marriage is, my five has more friends than a usual person. 500+ friends on Facebook and 300+ on LinkedIn, she goes out during the day quite often and goes out at night 1-2 times a month. Gets plenty of help at home from me, cleaners, etc. We have shared account and she can spend as much money as she needs, even before she was working. Lives in a large house with great school and drives a very expensive car. Not sure what else she wants, but I always offered to listen and help I do not really care about Charlize Theron. I did sleep with some very attractive women but I wanted a connection and to have someone with me who I can depend on and work together on life. I tried escort service and it does not work for me. For some reason I do not enjoy having sex with escort it feels fake as I cannot kiss or hug them. Why would I want a "kept" woman? I want a partner in life. Compromises? I changed a lot from my early 20th and can honestly say that I am a much better person to strangers on the street and especially to my wife. I think my wife just got too comfortable and knows that she has to do something really stupid for my to walk away. Happy holidays to you and your family!
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Post by Apocrypha on Dec 24, 2019 11:34:45 GMT -5
Not sure what traditional marriage is, my five has more friends than a usual person. 500+ friends on Facebook and 300+ on LinkedIn, she goes out during the day quite often and goes out at night 1-2 times a month. Gets plenty of help at home from me, cleaners, etc. We have shared account and she can spend as much money as she needs, even before she was working. Lives in a large house with great school and drives a very expensive car. Not sure what else she wants A faithful husband who is attracted to the person she is and who offers grace for who she isn't.
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