spencer
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Post by spencer on May 25, 2019 17:37:28 GMT -5
See my wife is cool is so many ways, yes there are flaws other than the sexlesss marriage, any relationship has its compromises - yes?
Just living without affection or intimacy is killing me, making me wither and decay inside. Over the last few weeks, I've decided its not about stereotypical penetrative sex.
A close friend has opened up to me a lot recently and a whole world of fetishes and fun suddenly are on my radar, but it all involves touch and closeness, something distinctly lacking where I am now. In every other part of the relationship we are so compatible but what to do when feeling loved and needing touch and cuddles is so important to you?
This is going to take some time to play out and work through.
Grrrr
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Post by baza on May 25, 2019 21:07:38 GMT -5
Just been re-reading your posts Brother spencer . You do seem to be edging toward the (perfectly valid) cheating option, so I thought I'd offer you this. The cheating option is invariably a game changer and produces all sorts of consequences. Trouble is, things can fly off at unknown (and unknowable) tangents, up to and including the collapse of your primary relationship - which might not be a bad thing in the longer term scheme of things. But this is not something to do on a half arsed whim. It is deadly serious stuff If you are going down this path, you need to prepare just like you were planning to divorce, because that is highly likely to be the outcome that ensues from this option. See a lawyer in your jurisdiction and establish how a divorce would shake out for you. Start putting together a theoretical exit strategy about how you'd live your life as a single if you had to. Shore up your support network. And, if you aren't up for that preparatory work, then I'd counsel you not to go down this path. It is a minefield, and going into it on anything other than a fully prepared basis is just asking for trouble.
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spencer
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Post by spencer on May 26, 2019 2:03:29 GMT -5
Baza Thinking about this, I think this is possibly my way of forcing the issue that I would otherwise be too cowardly to resolved tackle to be resolved, by making it go out of my control (even if I did set it in motion by my actions). Your words are wise.
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Post by baza on May 26, 2019 3:22:26 GMT -5
FWIW, the evidence in this group is that the members who take responsibility for - and ownership of - their ILIASM situation are the members who bring their situations to resolution.
Making what may seem to be an "easy"* short term choice - to let it run on uncontrolled - hasn't got much of a record of success in this group.
*easy - being a relative term. There is very little that is easy in these situations.
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Post by worksforme2 on May 26, 2019 10:56:37 GMT -5
The option of outsourcing should be allocated a substantial amount of preparation. I considered it at one point but opted for a conversation w. my then W about me having a FWB. Without going into a lot of history that didn't pan out and eventually we divorced. Lots of things to consider and plan. I suggest you "google" "planning an affair" and take note of the many suggestions and safeguards you need to put in place if you go that route. Even if you plan meticulously you might still get caught. Several members are in outsourcing relationships so you might just ask the membership for advice on how to avoid getting caught. But keep in mind that what Baz said is pretty much true. Engaging in an affair can be a real game changer, and you can't always know just when and how those changes are apt to happen and where they are likely to take you.
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Post by northstarmom on May 26, 2019 12:29:38 GMT -5
Spencer, you've said that you and your wife are so conflict averse that you never argue. As a result, you're considering having an affair to force the issue. Since your wife hasn't had sex with you in 15 years, it's unlikely you ever again will have a sexual relationship with her. if you are thinking that an affair would force the issue by forcing you to divorce, I think you're making a mistake. If your goal is to divorce, you'd probably be better off getting some counseling so you could be more assertive about creating the kind of life you want. An affair could indeed blow up your marriage but at the cost of ruining your reputation and estranging you from family and friends. In addition, having an affair isn't easy. You have to find a compatible partner and then treat the partner in a way -- romantically and financially that causes the partner to wish to have sex with you despite your being married and having to sneak around with the person. Cultivating an affair partner also means you'd have to hide from your wife and son the time and money you're spending on your prospective affair partner. Do you really think you'd get away with that? And if the affair blows up your marriage, that also may end the affair.
To me, your thinking about an affair sounds like a pipe dream, not a plan.
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spencer
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Post by spencer on May 26, 2019 17:50:48 GMT -5
northstarmom, I know where you are coming from but in my case, Family and friends, I'm confident would be relived as they all struggle with her and pained at how she constrains my social life. Recently I've started being very honest with very close friends and family about my situation and have been surprised by how supportive everyone has been, even if some of the conversations have been brutally honest.
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Post by northstarmom on May 26, 2019 20:32:23 GMT -5
Spencer, if your wife constrains your social life a lot how would you manage to have an affair? How does she constrain your social life?
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Post by ironhamster on May 27, 2019 2:07:47 GMT -5
One thing you may well want is a burner phone. There are plenty of pay as you go options. The burner phone stays at work. It does not come home with you. This allows you to separate your affair personna with your ILIASM self.
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spencer
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Post by spencer on May 27, 2019 4:35:55 GMT -5
Spencer, if your wife constrains your social life a lot how would you manage to have an affair? How does she constrain your social life? Lets explore this little corner of the issues then - this is more of a general relationship thing... She is a very frosty spiky person who friends comment they feel unwelcome when they come around. Its big introvert with social anxiety coming out in a bad way. Say we go to a large craft fair with friends, she will slip off and sit in the cafe on the phone after 20 mins (and be relatively happy doing do), which makes them feel like they offended her, but really its just the above too issues an an intolerance for people. However next time you are less likely to get an invite to something like that again as they perceived its not worth inviting us as they think she didn't enjoy it. This there is an instance of where it constrains my social life. This is unfortunate as I desperately want a big social circle I can lean on and wallow in. I yearn company even though I'm quiet in a crowd. I would love to spend a few nights of the week up to whatever time chatting at different friends houses, geeking out. So I do have a widening set of friends, and opportunities to get involved in other new activities and groups too, so I could just go out and not invite her along, but then she starts getting tetchy that I'm going out so much and she's bored at home. Its like its my job to just be there as a comfort blanket or entertainer. This is fine, after all that is why people live together, but not every single hour of every night. Even if I go off to craft in the garage for an evening I unusually get a moan that she is widow to whatever thing I was up to. Its another one of those situations that has crept up on us, couple of episodes like post natal depression when this level of attention was required, but never "reset" back to how it was before those, when things improved, or perhaps they never improved hmmm. And yes, this totally would make it difficult to have a fwb, although a couple of afternoons off work a month and odd evenings could be enough if it purely was a light weight fwb rather than a full blown romantic affair. So far I get get a long leash with other women as I've always had them for best friends. Even writing this stuff down can help understand it.
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Post by northstarmom on May 27, 2019 8:27:07 GMT -5
Spencer said: “So I do have a widening set of friends, and opportunities to get involved in other new activities and groups too, so I could just go out and not invite her along, but then she starts getting tetchy that I'm going out so much and she's bored at home. Its like its my job to just be there as a comfort blanket or entertainer. This is fine, after all that is why people live together, but not every single hour of every night. Even if I go off to craft in the garage for an evening I unusually get a moan that she is widow to whatever thing I was up to. “
The only thing preventing your having a vibrant life doing things with friends and by yourself is your caving into your wife’s whines. You could choose otherwise just like she chooses not to tuck you. Givenbthat yiu are in a low conflict marriage she’s not likely yogight about it. She’ll adapt just as you've adapted to a sm.
FWIW when many couples have their individual interests it adds interest and excitement to their marriage. They have more to talk about when they are together.
My post sm partner and I do things apart and together. We’ve been in cabaret shows together. We also have been in separate productions. Last weekend, I spent an afternoon kayaking with mutual fiends while partner stayed home readying for our move to Mexico. Another day that weekend we had dinner with friends.
This holiday weekend , I went to a day-long meditation retreat. My partner and I also had dinner with friends twice. My partner isn’t a meditator but it’s important to me so I’ve even gone on week long retreats without him. In all honesty, he didn’t at first get why I did that, but those retreats are an important way I stay balanced. I told him that and went anyway. He missed my presence including regular sex. But he found things to do to entertain himself. And we had super hot sex when I got back.
He is not delighted about my need to be away for experiences like that but such retreats are essential for my mental health. Where I compromise is by by not ringing in the New Year by going to a week long retreat: my partner thinks that being a couple means spending holidays together. There’s give and take on both our parts.
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spencer
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Post by spencer on May 27, 2019 9:19:18 GMT -5
northstarmomWhat you are saying is totally correct in my view. Its in that saying "absence makes the heart grow fonder". And although you can and probably should have an interest in each others interests, its healthy to have different interests to recharge your batteries or ignite your passions (in non-sexual sense). Indeed this is certainly a direction i'm going in for the next 6 months to see where it ends up. I have some new hobby interests one of which involve sports lessons for 6 weeks of weekends. I'm so excited about it but dreading the moaning about its when we normally do the weekly shop. -see something wrong there isn't there!
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Post by northstarmom on May 27, 2019 10:01:22 GMT -5
spencer: "I have some new hobby interests one of which involve sports lessons for 6 weeks of weekends. I'm so excited about it but dreading the moaning about its when we normally do the weekly shop. -see something wrong there isn't there!"
Her "moaning about it" only gets to you because you must think that you are doing something wrong to be having a sports activity without her. If you didn't have doubts about what you're doing, her complaints would roll off your back.
You also can choose to tell her that you don't want to hear her complaints: That you deserve to have some activities that don't include her. The same goes for her. If she starts complaining again, you could walk away. Hell, you could even choose to not participate in your weekly shopping excursions if they aren't pleasant for you. You could treat her complaints the way that she has treated your complaints about sexlessness. She seems to have no problem ignoring your needs.
As for outings with friends, you could choose to either go in a separate car from your wife or you could choose to leave her at home since she doesn't seem to enjoy them. You also could set up experiences with friends and not include your wife if there are things that she's not fond of doing. You don't have to be glued together. Since crafts fairs aren't something she enjoys, you could set up the events with friends, and then -- if your wife chooses to go -- let her drive herself so she can leave when she has had enough. BTW, her spending 20 minutes at a fair and then spending a couple of hours alone at a coffee shop may actually be what she enjoys. There's no rule that she has to stick with the group. If she complains that the experience took too long then that's a sign that it's not the type of thing that she enjoys or needs to be included in doing.
When you go out with friends, is it only couples or are there some singles or halves of a couple? If you only hang with couples, should your spouse die or you get divorced, you may find yourself with no friends.
One last thing: If your wife is bored when she's not with you, that's her problem not yours. Your job isn't to make her life entertaining. She is responsible for her own happiness. Frankly, she sounds like a very boring person. What do you see in her?
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Post by shamwow on May 30, 2019 7:19:04 GMT -5
The option of outsourcing should be allocated a substantial amount of preparation. I considered it at one point but opted for a conversation w. my then W about me having a FWB. Without going into a lot of history that didn't pan out and eventually we divorced. Lots of things to consider and plan. I suggest you "google" "planning an affair" and take note of the many suggestions and safeguards you need to put in place if you go that route. Even if you plan meticulously you might still get caught. Several members are in outsourcing relationships so you might just ask the membership for advice on how to avoid getting caught. But keep in mind that what Baz said is pretty much true. Engaging in an affair can be a real game changer, and you can't always know just when and how those changes are apt to happen and where they are likely to take you. It's funny. When I hear about all the James Bond type precautions that need to be done to cheat without being caught it seems a hell of a lot easier to just call a lawyer and get out 🤣
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Post by worksforme2 on May 30, 2019 7:42:47 GMT -5
The option of outsourcing should be allocated a substantial amount of preparation. I considered it at one point but opted for a conversation w. my then W about me having a FWB. Without going into a lot of history that didn't pan out and eventually we divorced. Lots of things to consider and plan. I suggest you "google" "planning an affair" and take note of the many suggestions and safeguards you need to put in place if you go that route. Even if you plan meticulously you might still get caught. Several members are in outsourcing relationships so you might just ask the membership for advice on how to avoid getting caught. But keep in mind that what Baz said is pretty much true. Engaging in an affair can be a real game changer, and you can't always know just when and how those changes are apt to happen and where they are likely to take you. It's funny. When I hear about all the James Bond type precautions that need to be done to cheat without being caught it seems a hell of a lot easier to just call a lawyer and get out 🤣 "Just getting out" presupposes that you really want out. Often the marriage taken as a whole really isn't so bad that one is desperate to get out of it if there is another solution. Probably most couples take quite a financial hit when the household busts up. And there could be kids and other considerations, like still loving your spouse. Lots of valid reasons to stay married while still having some strange available on the side. Like you I think it too difficult to manage sex with someone else while still married. But we know a # of people at this site that have pulled it off for years. I could never have gotten away with it given how well my then W knew my habits and daily routines. That's why I tried (unsuccessfully)to convince my then W to allow me a FWB.
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