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Post by Handy on Jan 17, 2019 18:42:03 GMT -5
I just read something that I related to and that is accepting less than normal in relationships and other areas of my life. It is sort of a stretch to match all of the article's ideas but one main thing was growing up with few resources and future expetations.
The link was poverty influences some people to accept less because that is mostly what they knew and living in poverty affects a child's brain development. This paragraph describes part f the process:
This, we now know, is one pillar of the mechanism of the epigenome: Who you are as a person is not just defined by your DNA, but by which parts of it your epigenome permits to be expressed.
The quality of maternal care alters the epigenome in rats, affecting glucocorticoid stress receptors in the hippocampus as well as the response of the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal axis to stress.2 Similar effects were later found in zebra finches which, like humans, are socially monogamous and involve both parents in raising offspring. Messenger-RNA levels of glucocorticoid and mineralocorticoid receptors were reduced in maternally deprived birds, which made stress hormones remain elevated in adult finches for longer periods of time. The researchers wrote that epigenetic mechanisms could be responsible for the changes, but they did not prove them to be. [/i][/div]
This could be one of the reasons people stay in substandard relationships. But kids and lack of money to operate dual households seems to be a bigger reasons people stay in low functioning relationships.
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Post by jamesbonding on Jan 17, 2019 22:23:46 GMT -5
In another thread, Handy said: If there is a "next time" something sexual comes on TV and I am in the room with my W, I am going to say something sililar to "Boy, she really likes the _________________, I wish I was that guy. At this point, why be shy about stating what you wished you had? The reason I say this is because I read over and over again where people clam up to avoid any negativity from the spouse. Guess what some refusing spouses say on the "recently Divorced" (mostly women) forum? They say they never heard any complaints from the XH and the D was "out of the blue."
A lot of us refused spouses probably learn (get trained by hostile reactions from the refuser) to not ask for sex. Then the refuser, hearing no complaints (and not wanting to hear any complaints), thinks everything is fine! I'm amazed at the extreme measures I had to take to get my wife to understand that I wasn't going to endure the no-sex situation any more. I had to take some steps toward divorce, AND openly visit another woman, and my wife was still in shock/denial for another couple months before she finally came around and we started having sex again. See iliasm.org/thread/4694/recovered-sexless-marriage
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Post by baza on Jan 17, 2019 23:43:10 GMT -5
You know that footnote on all of Brother shamwow 's post (it says something like - 'life is simple. First you figure out what you want, then you figure out how to get it, then you do it. But the first bit is the hardest') I think that is pretty right. Further, I think that the reason people "don't ask for what they want" is usually because they have no fucking idea of what they want. A lot of people know what they do NOT want, but there are not a real lot who know what they do want.
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Post by shamwow on Jan 18, 2019 9:11:39 GMT -5
You know that footnote on all of Brother shamwow 's post (it says something like - 'life is simple. First you figure out what you want, then you figure out how to get it, then you do it. But the first bit is the hardest') I think that is pretty right. Further, I think that the reason people "don't ask for what they want" is usually because they have no fucking idea of what they want. A lot of people know what they do NOT want, but there are not a real lot who know what they do want. It's SCARY to figure out what you want. Choosing one thing by definition precludes others and has consequences. For example: "If I choose to leave my shithole marriage I may be alone forever. I won't have as much money and won't see my kids as much." Put that way it sounds scary as fuck. That style of thinking kept me mired in shit for two decades unhappy in near celibacy. Of course it also depends on how you phrase that trade off. It could also be stated: "If I choose to leave my shithole marriage I have the chance to find someone else. I will learn that I can be quite happy living with less 'stuff', and I will model to my kids what a real relationship should be like so THEY will be happy when they are grown." Most human beings are predisposed to be somewhat fearful of change. That is probably a good thing since change for the sake of change would be chaos for all involved. But when the situation is a shithole already? Focusing on the potential positive outcomes of change can provide the nudge towards "figuring out what you want." And make no mistake. That IS the hardest step. Fear can sometimes protect, but is unlikely to elevate. Focusing on the negative potential outcomes just means you will perpetually remain covered in shit. Elevate yourself.
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Post by sadkat on Jan 18, 2019 9:33:43 GMT -5
You know that footnote on all of Brother shamwow 's post (it says something like - 'life is simple. First you figure out what you want, then you figure out how to get it, then you do it. But the first bit is the hardest') I think that is pretty right. Further, I think that the reason people "don't ask for what they want" is usually because they have no fucking idea of what they want. A lot of people know what they do NOT want, but there are not a real lot who know what they do want. It's SCARY to figure out what you want. Choosing one thing by definition precludes others and has consequences. For example: "If I choose to leave my shithole marriage I may be alone forever. I won't have as much money and won't see my kids as much." Put that way it sounds scary as fuck. That style of thinking kept me mired in shit for two decades unhappy in near celibacy. Of course it also depends on how you phrase that trade off. It could also be stated: "If I choose to leave my shithole marriage I have the chance to find someone else. I will learn that I can be quite happy living with less 'stuff', and I will model to my kids what a real relationship should be like so THEY will be happy when they are grown." Most human beings are predisposed to be somewhat fearful of change. That is probably a good thing since change for the sake of change would be chaos for all involved. But when the situation is a shithole already? Focusing on the potential positive outcomes of change can provide the nudge towards "figuring out what you want." And make no mistake. That IS the hardest step. Fear can sometimes protect, but is unlikely to elevate. Focusing on the negative potential outcomes just means you will perpetually remain covered in shit. Elevate yourself. I love this shamwow! I needed it today- thank you!!!
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Post by Handy on Jan 18, 2019 13:13:59 GMT -5
Shamwow It's SCARY to figure out what you want. Choosing one thing by definition precludes others and has consequences.
Shamwow and Baza, I mostly know what i want. I haven't found or heard of any women that want the same thing, younger women, yes but then there is the age miss-match.
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Post by h on Jan 18, 2019 13:19:35 GMT -5
Shamwow It's SCARY to figure out what you want. Choosing one thing by definition precludes others and has consequences. Shamwow and Baza, I mostly know what i want. I haven't found or heard of any women that want the same thing in my age range. Ten or twenty years younger women, yes. Then go for someone who wants the same things and don't worry about age.
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Post by baza on Jan 18, 2019 15:40:44 GMT -5
Shamwow It's SCARY to figure out what you want. Choosing one thing by definition precludes others and has consequences.Shamwow and Baza, I mostly know what i want. I haven't found or heard of any women that want the same thing in my age range. Ten or twenty years younger women, yes. OK. You "want" a woman of a particular age and attitude in your life. How bad do you "want" that ? Bad enough to make some big and disruptive choices ? - because that's what will be required if you really "want" this. By necessity, the primary "want" would need to be getting out of your ILIASM deal, because as long as you are in your ILIASM deal your chances of finding this chick you "want" and being available to her, is minimal. AND, there's no guarantee that this woman of a certain age and attitude is out there just waiting for you. If you are not prepared to make some big and disruptive choices (and that would be perfectly understandable) then this "want" probably needs to be re-evaluated to a "prefer".... and maybe a full revision to what you truly "want" might be timely.
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Post by Handy on Jan 18, 2019 16:55:20 GMT -5
Baza By necessity, the primary "want" would need to be getting out of your ILIASM deal, because as long as you are in your ILIASM deal your chances of finding this chick you "want" and being available to her, is minimal.
That is the main problem as I understand it, and Northstarmon has said, several times already.
Mostly right now, I compare my life to what I see and observe how other people are living. I mostly see affluence or some lower income people living beyond their economic means and in debt. And then, there are the people that never saved for retirement and now they are truly in a pickle.
I also run into some women that are a bit too much into religion and believe xyz because the Bible said so, which contradicts with the laws of physics.
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Post by Handy on Jan 18, 2019 20:32:47 GMT -5
To add to the I think I found some women that want what I want so other than my handyman skills I don't count for all that much. Also maybe I don't pick up on interest signals from other women. I get a fair amount of friendly (friend zone) interests, so that helps let me know I am not a total or very low interest to them.
But like Baza and NSM, being married is a big factor in finding compatible takers.
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Post by baza on Jan 18, 2019 20:55:36 GMT -5
Problem identification is key. Here for example Brother Handy , the problem is NOT the number or whereabouts of women about who are too young (or fail to meet some other criteria) . The problem is that you are in an ILIASM deal, and that pretty much precludes you from pursuing said women anyway. And if you can't resolve Problem #1, then you are never going to be in a position to resolve Problem #2. Of course, some people DO have a crack at reverse engineering it and going in pursuit of another person first (cheating, outsourcing) The results from that method of handling the situation can be quite spectacular and unpredictable....and inevitably mean you still have to resolve Problem #1 anyway.
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Post by Handy on Jan 18, 2019 21:44:05 GMT -5
Baza, even though I don't feel all that desirable and feel there are very limited prospective compatible relationships, I am upping my social abilities by interacting with more people than I did 5 or 10 years ago. Working from home, mostly in my basement and doing few social activities due to working most of the time, my recent years of trying new social things sort gives me an insight to things that work or don't work. I am not one to think I have most of the answers and try not to suffer from the Dunning-Kruger effect ***, where a little knowledge but not enough knowledge or skills, leads to over confidence and making mistakes or being a fool.
*** The solution the more you know the more you find out what you don't know.
The intellectual lecture by /David Dunning. (45 minuets)
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Post by baza on Jan 18, 2019 21:54:32 GMT -5
"I am upping my social abilities by interacting with more people than I did 5 or 10 years ago"
This is a good plan. A social network from which you can derive support from - and contribute support to - is a great thing to have in your tool box.
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Post by Handy on Jan 19, 2019 0:18:26 GMT -5
Along with the Dunning-Kruger effect, I just watched a video about some common bias people have, that seems to fit into the rarional vs irrational thinking that sometimes effects how people act and why.
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Post by Handy on Mar 7, 2019 0:00:46 GMT -5
Seventeen Red Flags
My score is 17, what is yours?
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