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Post by Handy on Sept 13, 2018 0:48:26 GMT -5
I have been reading ILIASM for over a year and have posted some on another SM forum. I have some questions and ideas saved from some of the people's threads I would like to kick around.
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Post by Handy on Sept 13, 2018 0:54:42 GMT -5
jgb said: "So...consider leaving? Well, I am middle aged man now (sidebar: finding people who want to fuck you is considerably easier for women...) I am not tall. I am not good looking. Because of my own mental health issues and the medicines they require, I am sexually dysfunctional. So a realistic assessment of my chances of walking out the door into a world of p**sy? Zero." I know money and charm are two good traits to have. I am a nice guy, but not a charmer.
northstarmom replied: Any woman can easily find someone to fuck her if she's willing to just get fucked by anyone. However, most women aren't so desperate to want sex from just anyone. However, most women want relationships -- not just sex with no strings, and the older women are, the harder that is to find. If, however, she wants just no strings sex, she can trade up -- get a younger, handsomer man, etc because women are in short supply on the hook-up sites.
Not interested in no strings. I haven’t made it to first base in so long it just seems women I hear talking, have no sex drive
northstarmom replied: When it comes to people looking for relationships, it's easier for men to find partners. First, the older one gets, the more the male: female ratio tips in male's favor. Also, after women are no longer interested in having kids, the size of a man's wallet becomes less important.
I still think a man’s wallet is very important to most women. Maybe I am wrong.
northstarmom replied: As for height, looks, etc., in general, the older men I see aren't as good looking as are the women they are dating. Due to the fact that so many men become sexually dysfunctional as they age, and so many women lose their libidos, women are more likely to accept being with a man who isn't a sexual stud or is able to provide oral but not PIV. Sites like OK Cupid allow people to share answers to question about things like this so one can rule out people whom one knows are not sexually compatible.
I have the height but also some extra weight. I only know one woman that is at a reasonable weight, so we all lose on the over weight aspect. PIV sex??
northstarmom replied: Still, being married considerably narrows the field of women who'd be interested in establishing a relationship with you.
I know you are right. From reading, most women don't want to be the other woman.
northstarmom replied: Meanwhile, it may be that if you had a willing partner, you would be sexually functional or at least willing to explore sexually.
I don’t have perfect health but I am OK. Like others on the forum have said, making out with a reluctant partner is a buzz killer. It also damages one’s motivation and ability to make out.
Shynjdude said: Honestly, the best thing to happen to me as a result of my (hopefully former) SM was to become a friend and lover to two wonderful women I met through this forum. They are the ones that gave me back my self esteem, they taught me that being sexless was a choice, and one of them taught me what unconditional, pure love really was.
Because of them I am now in a completely different place than I was, and I am eternally grateful.
OK, I read most of Shynjdude’s post and thought I don’t travel, don’t spend much money, would feel guilty doing that BUT totally get the feeling of being a good lover if I met someone like he describes. I read so man threads how being in a SM contributes to feeling depressed and that maybe most spouses don’t like sex or anything physical. They do like someone around to talk (dump on) to, pay the bills, run the household, and do some chores.
Caris said: My love and belonging needs have been missing most of my life, even in childhood. I guess that’s why I haven’t attained much else, although I’ve nearly killed myself trying to accomplish my goals, and never making it. Life has been one long survival course.
Something similar here. I can relate.
OTH, some things in my life were difficult financially but it turned out passable for some reason.
On this and another forum, some guys say women flirt with them. That has been my experience but all of them wanted me to fix something for them. Maybe my go-to default is to fix things and hope it leads to a friend type relationship.. I have done the nothing physical type of friendship but they all seem to decay unless I do a continual fix-it mode, then my W comes unglued. I get minimal pay for most of my handyman skills and my W gets the $$ benefits.
I tried a few “Meet-Up“ groups, did a few things at the community center, went on sever bicycle rides but no connections with men or women. Even the daughter and other relatives only contact me when THEY need something. I am thinking I do too much and need to make the other people do more. As they say, many people do not value things unless they work for it.
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Post by lifeinwoodinville on Sept 13, 2018 1:07:45 GMT -5
I'm just going to comment on one thing, physical attributes. I am 46 years old, I'm 5' 6" tall, weigh about 200 lbs, I'm bald, and I have Parkinson's Disease. Overweight bald guy that shakes and has trouble walking, not what the ladies are looking for, right? Well, I can tell you in my two times I outsourced, both those ladies I considered way out of my league. One was eighteen years younger than me and the other flew 7000 miles to meet me. What was more important to them was that I was a nice guy, I treated them well, and I listened to them. All the stuff their jerk off husbands did not provide. So, what you look like isn't nearly as important as who you are.
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Post by worksforme2 on Sept 13, 2018 8:46:55 GMT -5
I can state pretty unequivocally that women in the 60 plus age range are interested in sex. northstarmom is correct when she stated that being in a relationship is pretty much one of the foundation blocks foe a woman to engage a man sexually. There are women over 60 wo will have sex at the drop of a hat but they are the exception, few and far between. I make it a point when meeting a new dating prospect to work intimacy questions into our conversation fairly early. And some aspects of her behavior say a lot about how she feels about intimacy. If her children are grown and she hasn't been sexual in years(not dating and not in a relationship) then that's a dead giveaway it isn't very important to her, and your interaction with her is likely to be platonic. I have found women who want sex usually say so during my conversation with them. They often frame their answer around how long the 2 of you have been seeing each other. And all have stated they want an exclusive relationship. So, no other ladies in the bed. Your being married is going to close the majority of their doors. Most likely you will have to find a woman in a similar situation as you. Married but looking for something outside her primary relationship. Not impossible at your age but difficult. Since a substantial % of men over 60 have ED issues the possibility is there. Money and charm are good to have. But I would have to say charm is the more important of the 2, provided you are willing and able to afford the types of activities she enjoys as a part of the relationship you share. If a woman enjoys your conversation and you are physically presentable(not a fashion model)then there is a high probability her pants are going to come off for you. Caring and confident are also 2 traits you want to exhibit. And if you are out of practice you will want to mentally rehearse how you will make love to this woman. After all, you are probably going to want to be ask back for seconds aren't you? So it's imperative that you make her satisfaction more important than your own. If you live near a population center there are often senior citizen activities available through their recreation dept. Exercise class, or group excursions and day trips are often available. It will be mostly couples, but many women who want to get out go with a female friend. So opportunities are out there. Do your homework and find activities that are apt to be of interest to a woman. Just how available are you and how badly you want intimacy back in your life are likely to be what really determine how successful you are. Good luck.....
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Post by Handy on Sept 13, 2018 9:04:54 GMT -5
Worksforme2, I go to yoga with a friend, then stop for a Coke. We do some relationship type of talking but it doesn't go any where. I have something similar with another friend #2. #2 is so busy she is on the go all of the time and says she doesn't want another man.
Two not married women in a club like me for the help I give them but that is where things end. I am a caring type of guy and do not want to be pushy or make others uncomfortable so I watch what I say about anything other than a friendly relationship. Like a lot of other conservative people, I don't want to offend others and make the situation feel strained. I judge the situations and if the subject doesn't advance, to me that is a sign the other person doesn't want to go there.
I still have the idea the man needs to pay for what ever the couple does. This "dutch" thing is sort of new behavior to me.
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 13, 2018 9:49:41 GMT -5
Handy, if you are bringing a platonic woman friend to yoga, that is preventing your meeting other women there. They assume you are a couple. You also are not available for conversation and coffe with other women after class.
If you have interest in any of the below activities, they can be great ways of meeting women including sex-interested, attractive women in their 50s and older:
Volunteering with your political party. I participate in a weekly letter writing get out the vote meeting. The volunteers are prediminantly women, many of whom are single. All share the same political values.
Ballroom dancing. Women tend to like to dance. Most men don’t. Take lessons and go to the dance parties the dance company sponsors. Great way to meet women. Great way, too, to learn to dance. Same goes for salsa, contra, and line dancing.
Acting classes. I started them when I was about 56. Always had wanted to act but didn’t think I had talent. Finally decided to plunge in and risk making a fool of myself. Have made lots of friends there of all and I mean all genders and all ages. When I divorced about 5 years after starting acting, I found the love of my life from one of my acting troupes. We’ve now been together for 5 years. I also progressed to getting major roles in community theater and making local commercials. Btw many men who act are gay. There are far more women than men aspiring actors. So being a hetero man is an advantage for getting dates and parts.
What activities have you longed to try? Do those things. You are likely to meet romantic partners.
FWIW I’m 67. I also love sex. My partner is 66, 6’ about 30 pounds overweight. I view him as a handsome hottie. He takes cialis for ed and has monthly t shots for low t. Those drugs work wonderfully. We usually have sex about three times a week but recently it has been about 6 times a week.
An easy way to meet women: get a dog and walk that dog in local parks.
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Post by Handy on Sept 13, 2018 15:13:54 GMT -5
lifeinwoodinville, way to go. Your example is encouraging. northstarmom, you have some good suggestions for things to do in target rich environments. At yoga, I tell everyone friend#1 is a neighbor that doesn't drive. I also do my yoga on an opposite side of the room where there is a fan. W and I joined a dance beginners group Oct to May. W quit in Nov but I kept going for that year and the next year. I liked one 20 yr younger partner a little too much, had to drop out for a month because of a bad cold and decided to not go back. Also I don't know what the woman thought about me other than someone she met at the community hall. I know she was in a financial bind so paid for one of her passes. About the time I quit going, she danced with a younger guy but that didn't last. I went to the ballroom dancing studio but they only wanted couples. I did one session of line dancing but I slowed all of the other experienced women down. If I hear about a strictly beginner's class I try to go to things like that. I know I lack some confidence and think being better at some things will help me and my overly cautious attitude. I wish I could figure out how bold to be without infringing on other people is something I work on. Life circumstances required that I worked most of the time so life was about making enough $$ to pay the bills on time, which I always did even if it took working 60 hrs a week, which was also typical. I joke with a male friend that I know how to work but don't know how to have fun.
northstarmom, I have been reading your posts with a bit of special interest. I sort of guessed your age and determined physical attraction was alive and functioning in some women. My first hand experience isn't as rosy, but then again I suppose a lot of things contribute to that.
WTG for meeting your partner.
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 13, 2018 16:07:01 GMT -5
Your being married is the main thing preventing your finding a sex partner. Women who date married men often expect to trade up by getting a better looking or more affluent or prestigious man than they’d otherwise attract.
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Post by baza on Sept 13, 2018 18:58:54 GMT -5
"Social Conventions" are such that being in an ILIASM deal stack the deck against you having a decent sex life. Obviously in such a situation there is not going to be any sex happening within the marriage, and just as obviously there is not going to be any sex happening extraneous to the marriage either from people who have negative attitudes to infidelity, cheating etc. These people are NOT going to see you as a potential lover. You are married.
Now, many people flout "Social Conventions" (I have no idea what %) but that's your audience. Those who are OK with fucking a married person. That applies a fair few limits on your chances.
OTOH, if you are NOT married, then that opens up things quite a bit. Those who would not entertain the idea of rooting you (because you are married) now come in to play. That stacks the deck in your favour.
Note, I am not suggesting that you charge off to the exit.
This is just to make the obvious point that being in an ILIASM deal severely limits your chances of having a robust sex life within - or extraneous to - your marriage. You aren't going to get a root within your ILIASM deal, and (as far as followers of social conventions go) nor are you going to get a root outside of it. Additional to this, there are *your* social conventions as well. If your social conventions are such that you frown on infidelity and/or cheating, then that closes the whole she-bang down.
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Post by Handy on Sept 14, 2018 12:35:52 GMT -5
My short term goal is to make friends with more people. I worked almost alone out of my shop. I would go and pick up small office equipment, bring it home repair it , and then deliver said equipment with a little social interaction with the office people. I found if I got too involved with the people upon delivery, I seemed to irritate some people so I mostly went back to being mostly business like, deliver-explain-suggest if necessary, and then leave. I did do some social things but time and money was limited so I never developed in that area.
I suppose I am more interested in making what some people would call emotional connections than going for something more sexual. My idea is the social-emotional needs to be decent before anything goes past that. Being very conservative, I also want to avoid problems that cause a lot of strife.
Baza If your social conventions are such that you frown on infidelity and/or cheating, then that closes the whole she-bang down.
I used to think affairs were all wrong. After reading what people put up with, sometimes for 5, 10, 15, 25 years, affairs because of SM's and a few other reasons, if the affair is with someone else that is in a destructive relationship, I don't have a problem with having a friendly affair, especially if one or both people are beaten down and think at one point no one wants them. i have read about the bad and the good an affair can have on some people.
Take Shamwow and Ballofconfusion situation. I say go-team-go to both of them. Based on the things I have read, I also think she should have never had to endure what she did and if she was my sister, I would encourage her to stay away from her STBXH as much as possible. If I was a divorce judge in her case one rather swift gavel strike would end the marriage and grant her a decent spousal support award. OK,I know divorces have guidelines to follow so maybe my made for TV, sheriff, judge, and jury persona doesn't work IRL.
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Post by Handy on Sept 14, 2018 13:14:31 GMT -5
Northstarmon Women who date married men often expect to trade up by getting a better looking or more affluent or prestigious man than they’d otherwise attract. That has been on my mind as to why I might not be worth it to a woman going out of her way to be a close friend to me. My handyman skills only go so far when it comes to what some or most women put effort in to develop a closer relationship. Like I said up thread I suppose I am more interested in making what some people would call emotional connections than going for something more sexual. My idea is the social-emotional needs to be decent before anything goes past that. Being very conservative, I also want to avoid problems that cause a lot of strife. I know that me being married limits what most women might desire to make a relationship more than what is called "the friend zone." I know people have their own wants and desires that often diverge as they age so the early life "lets dream/hope what could be" goes more towards "this is what I want and what I don't want."
Northstarmom
I have to also look into the political choices in my area. I fixed some things for the Democratic office a long time ago. Sorry, my belief is that there is way too much money in mainstream politics, money to get elected and what benefits corperate profits are considered the main goals, not what is good for the citizens.
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Post by northstarmom on Sept 14, 2018 13:27:49 GMT -5
“ have to also look into the political choices in my area. I fixed some things for the Democratic office a long time ago, although that is not my choice of party because of Nancy of Pelosi and people of similar beliefs. Maybe there is a Ralph Nader party around hiding in the woodwork. Sorry, my belief is that there is way too much money in mainstream politics, money to get elected and what benefits corperate profits are considered the main goals, not what is good for the citizens.”
You also could get involved in activities in support of issues that you care about.
Still, I think the main thing hurting your chances of establishing emotional or sexual relationships with women is the fact that you are married and also seem unlikely to divorce.
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Post by Handy on Sept 14, 2018 13:42:48 GMT -5
Northstarmom, I agree with you on the married part.
On the issues part, that is a good idea. I will check out why "dark money" is allowed to go to political campaigns.
Now if I could only sit on the Supreme Court" and reverse the decision that corporations are "people" then decree all campaign money be limited to $500 per person (and groups or companies if I had my way) like Alaska does.
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