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Post by warmways on Sept 23, 2018 16:32:42 GMT -5
Every person I talk to post divorce says that they didn’t want to take the money they were entitled to but they’re glad that they did. One lady I just talked to said her one regret is not taking her share and not being able to provide for her two boys as well as she could have. I know. I have mixed feelings too but then when I think how for 18 y ars I did nothing but provide for him in every aspect (except sexually because he refused me), I can’t help but feel I deserve it and need to look after my best interests. IMO its hard for us givers on here to receive or feel we’re worthy enough but baby steps. Eventually you can unlearn a self destructive thought process. The therapy really helps!
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Baby Steps
Sept 23, 2018 16:50:15 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by TheGreatContender -aka Daddeeo on Sept 23, 2018 16:50:15 GMT -5
Really excited for you! Well done. And thank you for sharing. The part below gives me a lot to ponder as I continue to reflect and evolve. Especially when I realized that the pieces of my personality that I didn’t like very much and was working so hard to change were actually symptoms of my SM!
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Post by baza on Sept 23, 2018 18:01:01 GMT -5
Well, I think I took a really big step last week. I finally went to consult with a lawyer. It went as expected (mostly due to all of your feedback). The only real surprise is that I found out that I would be entitled to money I thought would be entirely his. Our finances are totally separate. The only big asset (and debt) we have together is the house. I know some of you will kick me when I tell you that I don’t want any of the money I consider as his ( my lawyer wasn’t happy with me either). I’d just feel so guilty about it and I really don’t want to do anything that would hurt him. Anyway- if I can get him to agree to a divorce and amicably decide who gets what, my expenses would be about $1500. If we have to fight it out, it could go up to $10,000!! It would be in both our best interest to agree on how we should end our marriage. It won’t be easy for me to approach this with my h. That will be my next big hurdle and the focus of my future counseling sessions. Here's the obvious take-a-way for newbies or anyone else considering divorce. See a lawyer and establish how a divorce would shake out in your jurisdiction. You may find out - like Sister sadkat- that you'd be entitled to more money than you thought (equally you may find out you'd get less money than you thought) but you would "know". And, with that knowledge, you can make a fully informed choice concerning your next step. As regards you foregoing what you might be entitled to Sister sadkat , that needs to be a fully informed choice too. Have you done your sums to establish what it will take to set yourself up as a single person, your ongoing needs as far as an income stream goes and suchlike ? Those things may cost more than you think, so don't be too quick to give up the farm.
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Post by sadkat on Sept 23, 2018 18:51:36 GMT -5
Really excited for you! Well done. And thank you for sharing. The part below gives me a lot to ponder as I continue to reflect and evolve. Especially when I realized that the pieces of my personality that I didn’t like very much and was working so hard to change were actually symptoms of my SM! Yes @dadeo- it was very eye opening for me. Remember your personality before the lack of intimacy? What has changed? Then ask yourself why? I can’t tell you how relieved I was to finally see it so clearly. The simple fact that I didn’t like who I was becoming was a clear red flag for me and was the final straw that clarified that I had to leave the relationship.
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Post by sadkat on Sept 23, 2018 18:55:58 GMT -5
Well, I think I took a really big step last week. I finally went to consult with a lawyer. It went as expected (mostly due to all of your feedback). The only real surprise is that I found out that I would be entitled to money I thought would be entirely his. Our finances are totally separate. The only big asset (and debt) we have together is the house. I know some of you will kick me when I tell you that I don’t want any of the money I consider as his ( my lawyer wasn’t happy with me either). I’d just feel so guilty about it and I really don’t want to do anything that would hurt him. Anyway- if I can get him to agree to a divorce and amicably decide who gets what, my expenses would be about $1500. If we have to fight it out, it could go up to $10,000!! It would be in both our best interest to agree on how we should end our marriage. It won’t be easy for me to approach this with my h. That will be my next big hurdle and the focus of my future counseling sessions. Here's the obvious take-a-way for newbies or anyone else considering divorce. See a lawyer and establish how a divorce would shake out in your jurisdiction. You may find out - like Sister sadkat- that you'd be entitled to more money than you thought (equally you may find out you'd get less money than you thought) but you would "know". And, with that knowledge, you can make a fully informed choice concerning your next step. As regards you foregoing what you might be entitled to Sister sadkat , that needs to be a fully informed choice too. Have you done your sums to establish what it will take to set yourself up as a single person, your ongoing needs as far as an income stream goes and suchlike ? Those things may cost more than you think, so don't be too quick to give up the farm. Yes baza- I outlined everything that I would need. The lawyer wanted me to do it again for clarity. He was concerned about what might happen 10 years down the road. But, I’ve given it a lot of thought and, as long as I can sell our house before starting out my new single life, I should be good. The hardest part will be to stay in the house while we go through the separation and divorce.
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Post by DryCreek on Sept 23, 2018 21:05:17 GMT -5
Every person I talk to post divorce says that they didn’t want to take the money they were entitled to but they’re glad that they did. One lady I just talked to said her one regret is not taking her share and not being able to provide for her two boys as well as she could have. This, sadkatAnother facet is that money translates directly into years of labor. Altruistically leaving money on the table is like flippantly saying “I’m OK with working an extra X years before retirement”. It sounds generous, but it’s not practical, to put it politely. To repeat some of my thinking, the odds are great that the next person you meet will not be bringing their own retirement funds. Which can be a dealbreaker if you’ve only got enough to cover yourself. And FWIW, a finer detail is that money in a traditional (non-Roth) 401k/IRA is only “worth” 75-80% of its account balance because taxes will be deducted later. Ditto for 1031 real estate investments. I.e., get advice because not all dollars are equal when it comes to splitting things up. ETA: Suggestions... Step 1: interview 3 or more lawyers to find one that matches your attitude and aggressiveness; Step 2: Trust their advice on how to proceed. Certainly, challenge that they understand the context properly, but then trust their experience with the strategy and demands.
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Post by sadkat on Sept 23, 2018 21:52:15 GMT -5
DryCreek- your advice makes sense. But, there is a back story regarding the funds that makes me very reluctant to make them a part of our divorce agreement. I won’t take it completely off the table- we will see how things progress.
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Post by sadkat on Oct 7, 2018 11:31:01 GMT -5
Yesterday, he opened the door and I finally had the courage to walk through it. We were out doing what I love best- taking a ride into the country. We ended up at a fall festival- vendors were selling hand made items, wine and beer, folk music. It was a great day. On the way home, we stopped at a little coffee shop and h started talking about our future. I told him he needed to start thinking about what he wanted to do and move forward; that we had no future together and that our marriage was over. He immediately denied it- told me I hadn’t worked hard enough to save it. I told him I couldn’t do anymore than I had already done, that I was desperately unhappy, and that I was in counseling. He still insisted we could do better. He told me he couldn’t believe I was giving up, that we could work harder to resolve our issues. I asked him what he thought I could do to make things better. He told me he didn’t know. I then flat out told him I was not willing to work anymore, that porn had killed any desire I had for him. He asked me if I knew how many guys actually enjoyed porn and I told him I did know and left it at that. He was quiet for a minute or so and I just knew what he was going to say next. Yep- he asked me if I had found someone else. I told him I wasn’t going to give him that out, that he knew perfectly well that wasn’t the issue. I said this all in a calm, matter of fact tone (very different from my initial confrontation with him a few months ago when I was an emotional mess). The rest of the ride home was very quiet as was the rest of the evening. This morning, he got up pretending the conversation never happened. It sounds like I’ll need to prepare for round 3 🙄. Thankfully, I’m starting about 6 weeks of work travel which will keep me away from home. I’m looking forward to the break.
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Post by northstarmom on Oct 7, 2018 11:43:59 GMT -5
“Another facet is that money translates directly into years of labor. Altruistically leaving money on the table is like flippantly saying “I’m OK with working an extra X years before retirement”. It sounds generous, but it’s not practical, to put it politely.”
You also could become chronically ill or disabled and not be able to work. Or you could lose your job and due to age discrimination not get another or get a job with much less pay.
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Post by jamesbonding on Oct 7, 2018 12:58:13 GMT -5
Very well done sadkat! You handled that conversation perfectly. And yes, there probably will be a round 3 and more. Mr. sadkat is in denial.
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Post by shamwow on Oct 7, 2018 15:04:07 GMT -5
Just a side note about counselling: Every attorney I went to for a consultation asked me " have the two of you been to marriage counselling? I don't know how important it is legally, but they all asked about it. When given the answer of "Yes for years, my wife refused to go anymore and I continue to get individual therapy. Our psychologist said that there isn't even a dying ember left there is nothing left to fix". The attorneys next reply was " then your marriage is "irretrievably broken". They then seemed happy to know what kind of a case they needed to present.( think of it as an ace up your sleeve) The only marriage counseling my ex and I did was how to do the divorce with the least impact on the kids. It was one 30 minute session. Kind of hard to fix a car that is on fire.
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Post by shamwow on Oct 7, 2018 15:08:44 GMT -5
Well, I think I took a really big step last week. I finally went to consult with a lawyer. It went as expected (mostly due to all of your feedback). The only real surprise is that I found out that I would be entitled to money I thought would be entirely his. Our finances are totally separate. The only big asset (and debt) we have together is the house. I know some of you will kick me when I tell you that I don’t want any of the money I consider as his ( my lawyer wasn’t happy with me either). I’d just feel so guilty about it and I really don’t want to do anything that would hurt him. Anyway- if I can get him to agree to a divorce and amicably decide who gets what, my expenses would be about $1500. If we have to fight it out, it could go up to $10,000!! It would be in both our best interest to agree on how we should end our marriage. It won’t be easy for me to approach this with my h. That will be my next big hurdle and the focus of my future counseling sessions. When I got divorced, I left some money on the table that I didn't have to. I used this carrot as a stick over her head in order to "encourage" an amicable settlement. The idea being that I made it clear I would win the fight over this money. We would split it if she "played nice". The moment she stopped playing nice, the offer would be rescinded. She played nice and our marriage came to a quick and amicable end.
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Post by sadkat on Mar 17, 2019 9:55:25 GMT -5
As promised- here is my update. I’ve had a series of successful baby steps-
I’ve gone on two separate solo vacations which I thoroughly enjoyed. They were so much more fun and relaxing without my h! I learned a valuable lesson- I enjoyed traveling solo (without a mate) so much more than traveling with my h! The idea of traveling alone now fills me with anticipation rather than dread!
I told all of my close family members and several friends about the issues I’ve had in my marriage and my desire to leave it. They have all been incredibly supportive and have offered me a shoulder to cry on when I needed it (and I’ve needed a shoulder numerous times over the past several months).
I’ve also made a concerted effort to go out with coworkers when I’m traveling with them. I’ve even made a future plan to spend a couple of days with a few coworkers when we get together for a meeting in November ( this is something I would not have done a year ago!)
I told my son about my intent to leave my marriage (at the encouragement of my therapist). That was an incredibly difficult thing to do and it did not go well. He is not very happy with me at the moment. I’m hoping he will soon come to realize that I have not come to this decision lightly and will accept it for what it is.
I continue to seek therapy as I move forward. My therapist told me during our last session that I’m doing well and making progress. That was very encouraging!
My next task and biggest hurdle is putting our house on the market. My h is still in denial and believes that I am not serious about leaving. The attorney I consulted advised me to seek my h’s cooperation in selling the house- it would obviously be the cheapest option. If I cannot convince him, I would need to take the more expensive option of taking him to court to force the issue. This is where I am today. My goal is to get the house on the market in April. Any ideas as to how I can get h to agree to doing this without taking him to court?
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Post by northstarmom on Mar 17, 2019 10:03:07 GMT -5
You’ve taken some great big steps! Congrats!
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Post by DryCreek on Mar 17, 2019 11:52:07 GMT -5
Any ideas as to how I can get h to agree to doing this without taking him to court? Persuasion. Carrot. Stick. If he’s in denial, logic and persuasion isn’t going anywhere. Do you have something he would want? Ideally, something you don’t actually care about giving up. Maybe something you’re entitled to that he holds dear. Those items can be either carrot or stick depending on how you present them. A colleague once used a combination of the three... “We can do this amicably and split things fairly. Or we can do it the hard way and split it 3 ways, with the lawyers taking a third.”
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