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Post by workingonit on Jun 24, 2018 7:40:39 GMT -5
So my h asked me to have a talk this weekend. Ended up in a 3 hour discussion of... everything. He noticed recently I have not been putting any effort into our relationship. I admitted that to be true. I am done seeking him out in his study, touching and hugging him, etc. Our relationship is going nowhere. I am however still willing to reciprocate whatever he initiates including any touching, intimacy, conversation, therapy, couples retreats, vacations, sex, etc. I have tried countless times to initiate all of the above with no benefit. Now I am done. Friendly still, peaceful, but done.
Well in this talk he said some things and I felt myself getting angry and resentful and wanting to respond with my righteous indignation for the YEARS I have begged him to work with me and he ignored me. I did not respond with anger. I breathed through it and let it go.
Beneath the anger was the deepest well of grief, pain, rejection, hurt. I suddenly was sobbing and unable to breathe. The pain was literally stunning. I let him see it, unable to do anything but be in it. I told him it was destroying my soul. I told him if our son was more stable and our finances better I would have left already. I told him the only thing that keeps me sane is working on an exit strategy. I said all of this with pain not anger. I told him it is a tragedy but that I no longer have any hope.
I am a strong person. I think like many strong people it is easier to feel anger and resentment. Those are more comfortable to wear and bear than the pain. I have been so angry for years. But it is all hiding the pain of rejection, the hit my self worth takes when my own h does not want me. That pain is really really uncomfortable to sit with.
My h was able to take it in, mostly. And share some of his own pain. At the end of the discussion he told me he still has hope. I could only look sadly at him.
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Post by GeekGoddess on Jun 24, 2018 8:19:14 GMT -5
Huge breakthrough- not even as it may or may not affect the marriage, but for YOU.
I agree that anger “feels stronger” than sitting with the pain and grief. That feels vulnerable. But that is the authentic shit. I’m glad to hear you are knowing you. It hurts, sometimes sucks - but it is so worth it.
He can have hope all he wants. My mantra towards the end came to be “too little too late” - I came to realize that even if he could give 200% every day all day (& I knew he couldn’t), that still would be too little too late and could never “make up for” what had already gone before.
Once we realize that there’s no going back, we begin moving forward. You, my dear sister, are on a forward trajectory. Stay resilient.
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Post by choosinghappy on Jun 24, 2018 9:01:54 GMT -5
“Once we realize there’s no going back, we begin moving forward. You, my dear sister, are on a forward trajectory.” Perfectly stated GeekGoddess. ((Hugs)) to you workingonit. It’s painful but it also helps you to live a more authentic existence.
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Post by bballgirl on Jun 24, 2018 9:21:29 GMT -5
Bravo to you workingonitI think it's great that you had this conversation with him because there was total honesty and focus on YOU. He noticed a change in you which was upsetting to him so now he wants to have a talk and now he has hope - wow! Too little too late. There are consequences for poor behavior and he does not get to have the marriage he wants but you don't get the marriage you want all these years. Again too little too late. Good for you for putting out the warning to him for what is to come.
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Post by flounder on Jun 24, 2018 9:33:53 GMT -5
I have been so angry for years. But it is all hiding the pain of rejection, the hit my self worth takes when my own h does not want me. That pain is really really uncomfortable to sit with. -workingonit
I know this anger and pain. We become almost wounded animals in this state. It hurts deep to your soul it seems. The anger and resentment cause you to lash out at anyone around you. Because of the actions of my wife,I have found myself arguing with co workers I have always enjoyed being around. I yell at my children. Yell at the dog. For nothing. Kudos to you for speaking up. I hope he paid attention. I am becoming the mean and bitter old man that lived down the street when we were growing up. Maybe SM was his problem too.
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Post by DryCreek on Jun 24, 2018 9:47:14 GMT -5
I am becoming the mean and bitter old man that lived down the street when we were growing up. Maybe SM was his problem too. I see this in myself, too, and it’s directly as a result of being rejected by my spouse. I find myself being intolerant and discompassionate when I would normally be zen and understanding. I refuse to live life as an angry man.
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Post by flounder on Jun 24, 2018 11:19:58 GMT -5
I am becoming the mean and bitter old man that lived down the street when we were growing up. Maybe SM was his problem too. I see this in myself, too, and it’s directly as a result of being rejected by my spouse. I find myself being intolerant and discompassionate when I would normally be zen and understanding. I refuse to live life as an angry man. I’m trying.
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Post by ironhamster on Jun 24, 2018 15:18:36 GMT -5
workingonit, well done. You are disengaging with class, with honest communication and love. I am not surprised there is a level of denial on the part of your stbx. I am not sure what he is hoping for, but hope just gets us through things. It does not change stark reality. All of us that hoped for improvement for years, or decades, eventually come to grips with that. My hope for both of you is that you find happiness, however that may look for each of you.
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Post by baza on Jun 25, 2018 20:49:38 GMT -5
It reads like he still has hope (that the status quo can continue) but that your hope (that the status quo can radically alter) is rapidly diminishing. This is (one of) the awful stages in the process Sister workingonit . Feeling for you.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jun 25, 2018 21:31:50 GMT -5
My h was able to take it in, mostly. And share some of his own pain. At the end of the discussion he told me he still has hope. I could only look sadly at him. www.iliasm.org/thread/3606/thank-hope?page=2I've been looking for this today. I wanted to share this with you,and read it again for myself. I remember talking about the difference in "hope" and "false hope"? I think the whole thread would benefit you, especially near the end when we get into "false hope". False hope is what your H is projecting on you. You on the other hand have "hope" to use to your advantage! Here are some encouraging words for you , me and others. ( I've got 3 years of notes from my pastors sermons. I find them powerful and they hit the nail on the head when I was dealing with detaching from my SM) Compassionate has to have passion. Our compassion should make us available. Our compassion should be seen through our commitment. Our compassion should be COURAGEOUS! Our compassion should lead to faith that is visible in action. Just because you love someone doesn't mean you agree with their lifestyle. Why are you looking for living among the dead? Are you the kind of person who walks in a room and says " here I am" or "there you are"? Run away from condemnation to restoration. What defines you is what you do after you fail. Glory in tribulation? Yes..knowing that tribulation produces perseverance It's not his (Gods) desire to keep joy from you. It's his desire to keep you from being robbed from true joy. I also found these notes from one of my visits with my psychologist. This was his words to me about my W. It may be similar to what you have been going through, with your H. "Your wife only wants to communicate with you if it involves the family. Then the only participation she wants from you is to agree to doing things her way. You have jumped through her first hoop, and their will be several more. Then after that you are allowed to show her some intimacy, her way. Then she might, possibly, consider, giving SOME physical affection, her way only." I hope these are helpful in your journey!!
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Post by workingonit on Jun 25, 2018 21:49:08 GMT -5
It is awful, baza , thanks for seeing that. He is feeling desperate and trying really hard. He came hiking with me yesterday, asked me out to dinner, and today he called me to ask me if he sets up a Wednesday night appt with a sex therapist would I be willing/able to go. I said yes to everything but I feel I am just watching this very sad story play out. I literally do not believe we have any chance of making this work. It has simply been too long and he has been given so many many opportunities. Also, he has been this motivated in the past- this past November, for example. His enthusiasm for the work and the improved communication and understanding how we got here is impressive and unwaivering. It does not however, change anything. We remain as sexless as before. He said "I want to show you that I can be who you need. I want you to choose me, to choose us." These are so the right word for him to say...years ago when I was begging him to get help with me. I told him that it is a testament to the strength of our relationship that I have chosen to stay with him all these lonely years. I also told him I cannot at all continue to choose this relationship. I repeated that I have a timeline and that while I am here I am willing to cooperate with his initiative but I am not willing to lie. This part feels really sad.
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Post by choosinghappy on Jun 25, 2018 21:55:55 GMT -5
It’s hard when the hope is gone ☹️
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Post by workingonit on Jun 25, 2018 22:00:03 GMT -5
Thank you greatcoastal . Much of that resonates with me and I will take the time to read the whole thread. There is no compassion without passion. I think this is true if the compassion is real. What do I hope for right now? Really, a peaceful end and the blossoming of a friendship and caring as co parents and, eventually, friends. I know, it is a stretch. My h has the distinct ability to shove his head in the sand when things are intimately difficult to deal with. He does this with our very intense son with mental health challenges, he does this with anything he does not want to deal with. His sink in our bathroom leaked for years and instead of dealing with it he would just reach under the sink to turn on/off the water. He has a really impressive ability to just not face certain in the world issues. He has all sorts of amazing esoteric explanations about why our relationship is in a "hard" place and how it will improve. Not one of these explanations or long rants ever actually addresses the fact that WE DON'T HAVE SEX. His head has been so far in the sand about this problem for so very very long.
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Post by h on Jun 25, 2018 22:18:46 GMT -5
He chose to neglect you for so long and only now when you give up trying does he beg for another chance. It's great that you are being honest with him and not keeping up the charade. It's a great liberating feeling to finally start telling the truth. Keep being true to yourself.
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Post by greatcoastal on Jun 25, 2018 22:26:16 GMT -5
Sounds like you have been more than giving and patient! Someone's going to have to put on his big boy pants, and face reality!!
Pardon my analogy: He's been a procrastinator, a manipulator, and you have been picking up his slack for so many years .Please don't take that to your grave!
But it is interesting how quickly he falls back on counselling? It's like you removed his fake mask, and he knows he can attempt to put it back on. He's buying more time, to fake changing. I say that only because I have read it here, (and so many other cases) time after time.
What is his love language? Acts of service? So every "act of service" you do becomes your new daily chore, or responsibility. Meanwhile you recieve "his nothing version of touch and words of affirmation ?"
Counselling sounds like just more nails in the coffin. (especially if you get a bad one that just wants to drag things along and avoid the whole sex and intimacy). However, confirmation by going for some more counseling is helpful if and when you talk with an attorney. Some states require a certain amount of counselling, or at least an attempt. You might already have that. Even if they don't require it, it's an ace up your sleeve and speeds up the process.
You might want to skip the counselling and use that money for an attorney, or christmas presents for your son.
Keep posting about your journey. Stay strong!
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