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Post by solodriver on Jun 20, 2018 2:16:09 GMT -5
Tonight I decided to try the experiment with my wife that lonelywifey tried with her husband. My results were not surprising, but it hurt just the same.
While my wife was watching TV in the bedroom, I came in and stripped down to my boxers. She didn't say anything as I was standing there, so after a few minutes I got into the bed. After some chitchat about the TV show, and since my back was against the wall and she had ALL the pillows behind her, I scooted over next to her to try and snuggle. She immediately pulled away and asked "What are you doing?" I said I wanted to watch TV with her since we don't do that anymore and I thought it would be nice to snuggle. She said "Don't" and pulled further away. So at the next commercial break I said "Thank You" and got up and left the room.
It is now obvious that our marriage has disintegrated. There is nothing left.
I'm making my plans and living my life now accordingly.
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Post by ironhamster on Jun 20, 2018 3:15:47 GMT -5
...It is now obvious that our marriage has disintegrated. There is nothing left.
I'm making my plans and living my life now accordingly. Now, there is a real red pill moment. Well done, solodriver.
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Post by baza on Jun 20, 2018 3:34:10 GMT -5
Sometimes, it is the innocuous little things that sets things off. The "wrong" (right) word at the "wrong" (right) time - the "wrong" (right) bit of body language at the "wrong" (right) time.....and the fuse is lit. I hope you are well prepped for the next bit Brother solodriver - a really challenging path lies ahead.
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Post by workingonit on Jun 20, 2018 5:06:51 GMT -5
So sorry. I have been there too. At least you know with great clarity
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 5:29:56 GMT -5
Sadness and clarity, solodriver. My moment of clarity came about six months ago when I saw my wife dressed nicely and I had an urge to spontaneously hug her in the kitchen. I went over and embraced her, and she stood there stiff as a board, and mumbled, "Sorry." That was the last time I will ever attempt to hug my wife on my own initiative. (If she asks for one, which has happened exactly once since then, I'm not yet cruel enough to say no.)
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Post by h on Jun 20, 2018 5:36:18 GMT -5
Sadness and clarity, solodriver . My moment of clarity came about six months ago when I saw my wife dressed nicely and I had an urge to spontaneously hug her in the kitchen. I went over and embraced her, and she stood there stiff as a board, and mumbled, "Sorry." That was the last time I will ever attempt to hug my wife on my own initiative. (If she asks for one, which has happened exactly once since then, I'm not yet cruel enough to say no.) I would, and have once denied a hug before. It had been a particularly long period of time since we had last had sex and I told her that if we weren't going to have sex anytime soon, I didn't want her to touch me at all. I haven't done that since the one time but I have no problem doing it again if she ever let's a dry spell stretch on too long again.
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Post by northstarmom on Jun 20, 2018 6:37:50 GMT -5
Solodriver said: “snuggle. She immediately pulled away and asked "What are you doing?" I said I wanted to watch TV with her since we don't do that ”
You lied. That’s not what you were doing. You were trying to have sex, a normal thing for most people who are living romantically together. Why didn’t you just straight out say what you wanted? Of course your wife knew what you were trying to do. She knew that by throwing the ball directky in your court you’d back off and she could easily continue her sm. She knows you have no balls when it comes to meeting your sexual needs. She has no reason to change her behavior. Indeed, she was probably happy that you left the bed. She doesn’t want you to touch you. However, she wants to retain the benefits of marriage. You make it easy for her to have the marriage she wants.
Now that you’ve done your experiment what’s your next step? Or will you continue in the marriage as you always have? If you continue the same why did you bother with the experiment?
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Post by choosinghappy on Jun 20, 2018 6:45:02 GMT -5
I’m sorry solodriver. I am always of a mind that the clarity in the situation (no matter how shitty it feels) is always a good thing.
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Post by bballgirl on Jun 20, 2018 6:50:20 GMT -5
I agree that the clarity is a good thing and honestly while it's still fresh and depending on what your goals are for yourself, I would call her out.
If you do not plan to stay in the marriage then I would call her out and tell her that her behavior last night was disappointing and unacceptable. That you wanted to have sex but she wouldn't even snuggle and in your eyes this is not a marriage. Sex is part of marriage and if there's no sex then there are legal consequences.
If you plan to stay no matter what then I recommend outsourcing and don't say a thing. As well I would detach and do nothing to make her life easier.
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Post by northstarmom on Jun 20, 2018 7:23:17 GMT -5
Solodriver, do you now plan to proceed with what you posted June 5? If so, are you spending today calling lawyers?
You said: “Doing exactly what lonelywifey has done. Confront my refuser for one last time and if she refuses to get help or tries to blow it off, the clock to separation and divorce will start. I've finally reached my breaking point. On our 30th anniversary, we did absolutely NOTHING to celebrate it. No cards exchanged, not even a "Thank You' or "I love you" or a hug, and she didn't even want to go out for a dinner.
I deserve to be loved and to give love. I'm ready for that to happen now.”
Still, since you did not admit to your wife that you were attempting to make love, I don’t think you have yet confronted her., perhaps that means you aren’t ready yet to end the marriage. Time is not your friend. Delay too long and something is likely to happen that will prevent or make it more difficult for you to leave. You have already lost 30 years to your sm marriage that also seems devoid of love and concern for you.
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Post by shamwow on Jun 20, 2018 7:39:12 GMT -5
Solodriver said: “snuggle. She immediately pulled away and asked "What are you doing?" I said I wanted to watch TV with her since we don't do that ” You lied. That’s not what you were doing. You were trying to have sex, a normal thing for most people who are living romantically together. Why didn’t you just straight out say what you wanted? Of course your wife knew what you were trying to do. She knew that by throwing the ball directky in your court you’d back off and she could easily continue her sm. She knows you have no balls when it comes to meeting your sexual needs. She has no reason to change her behavior. Indeed, she was probably happy that you left the bed. She doesn’t want you to touch you. However, she wants to retain the benefits of marriage. You make it easy for her to have the marriage she wants. Now that you’ve done your experiment what’s your next step? Or will you continue in the marriage as you always have? If you continue the same why did you bother with the experiment? Ouch. That one brings memories that sting. I would do similar, not stating what I actually wanted, but dancing around the edges. Looking back I'm ashamed of the fear I had to just say what I needed. In my heart I was scared to hear the answer. I was scared to hear the truth of why she didn't want me. I was scared where the conversation might go. In the past year and a half I've found that lif is much better when you find your voice. I'm no longer afraid to just talk with people and stand up for myself. Hoping you find your voice solodriver
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Post by northstarmom on Jun 20, 2018 7:57:49 GMT -5
Full disclosure: while I was nyc direct in calling him on not directly saying he wanted sex, I have btdt and know how frightening and even shameful it can feel for one in a sm to directky request sex and to talk directly about one’s needs. By the time my refuser and I divorced it had been years since I had made a sexual overture or spoken about my needs. It also had been years since we had spoken intimately about anything except our grown children. We lived lsepararely in the same house like polite roommates with little in common.
I grew up with parents who from the time I was at least 6 slept apart and didn’t even affectionately touch each other. I was married for 34 years of which at least 13 were completely sexless and several not there met the definition of sm (10 or fewer sexual encounters a year). How I learned what sexually normal is has been through my post sm lover. I didn’t know before that sex could be lol fun, that a man would be flattered and receptive not timid or disparaging if I made a direct sexual overture. That a man would take pleasure and pride in sexually pleasing me and exploring my body.
So, I understand how difficult it is for the refuser to speak up directly about sex. Still, you don’t have to do that to get proof that there is no hope of having a mutually enjoyable sex life with your wife. You have seen that evidence for years. If you want a chance of having a committed and passionate relationship, your best chance of getting that would be by divorcing and thus making yourself fully available to a compatible woman. You have to admit that truth to yourself and then take the steps to end your marriage whether or not you directly talk to your wife about your sexual needs. When I decided to divorce, I did not mention sex. I said we had grown apart.
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Post by GeekGoddess on Jun 20, 2018 16:02:34 GMT -5
I’m sorry solodriver - clarity does hurt. It can also be a firm foundation. While you get your exit plan into place, start “not doing” things for her that she can do for herself. I used to: brings drinks from the other room, get up to get things he wanted, agree to “his choice” consistently without debate - a whole slew of behaviors that really just gave my “self” away. When I was pretty sure of my decision to go, but hadn’t let him know yet - I stopped doing these things. As I would share my real opinions (& face derision) or decline to cater to him (& watch as he tried to guilt me or manipulate to get his way) - I observed, like a lab experiment. It helped me a lot with the detachment process. Start stopping doing whatever things you do “to make her life easier” - and watch her responses & reactions. I’d bet a dollar you’ll start & continue to see her uglier sides come out. I’m sorry the experiment ended the way you would have predicted. But do try to appreciate how solid your knowledge is now. She will not change.
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Post by shamwow on Jun 20, 2018 16:13:41 GMT -5
I’m sorry solodriver - clarity does hurt. It can also be a firm foundation. While you get your exit plan into place, start “not doing” things for her that she can do for herself. I used to: brings drinks from the other room, get up to get things he wanted, agree to “his choice” consistently without debate - a whole slew of behaviors that really just gave my “self” away. When I was pretty sure of my decision to go, but hadn’t let him know yet - I stopped doing these things. As I would share my real opinions (& face derision) or decline to cater to him (& watch as he tried to guilt me or manipulate to get his way) - I observed, like a lab experiment. It helped me a lot with the detachment process. Start stopping doing whatever things you do “to make her life easier” - and watch her responses & reactions. I’d bet a dollar you’ll start & continue to see her uglier sides come out. I’m sorry the experiment ended the way you would have predicted. But do try to appreciate how solid your knowledge is now. She will not change. On the flip side it isn't a bad idea to start doing any things she does for you. If you're a guy and don't know how to cook, you should learn. If she does a lot of the parenting, start forging stronger relations with your kids BEFORE you split from your spouse. It's all part of getting your own shit together but is often overlooked in the manic dash to freedom.
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Post by solodriver on Jun 20, 2018 23:28:37 GMT -5
Tonight I decided to try the experiment with my wife that lonelywifey tried with her husband. My results were not surprising, but it hurt just the same.
While my wife was watching TV in the bedroom, I came in and stripped down to my boxers. She didn't say anything as I was standing there, so after a few minutes I got into the bed. After some chitchat about the TV show, and since my back was against the wall and she had ALL the pillows behind her, I scooted over next to her to try and snuggle. She immediately pulled away and asked "What are you doing?" I said I wanted to watch TV with her since we don't do that anymore and I thought it would be nice to snuggle. She said "Don't" and pulled further away. So at the next commercial break I said "Thank You" and got up and left the room.
It is now obvious that our marriage has disintegrated. There is nothing left.
I'm making my plans and living my life now accordingly. Awww, so heartbreaking. It's reminiscent of Lucy yanking the football from Charlie Brown. Good for you for not falling for it anymore! Well I've played the "Charlie Brown" part for so long it's hard to stop. But not anymore.
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