|
Post by greatcoastal on Jun 26, 2018 8:24:49 GMT -5
Get the kid out of the bed first off! And I don't know about anyone else but there isn't much I'd rather do after a 15 hour day than have sex and sleep like a baby after. His excuse that he gives you a hug and kiss twice a day seem pretty lame to me... that's not intimacy. I can agree with that. Especially in my younger days, but it may not apply to all men. The sex is a stress reliever and a relaxing, intimate time. A moral boost , he may be very stressed and his mind is full of "work issues" and he wants to let it all go so he can sleep. I'd rather go to sleep thinking of what a wonderful woman I have for a wife, instead of work issues. Sex is wonderful for that right before going to sleep. Releasing sperm is a relaxer. As a man, the only time I wasn't capable of desiring sex was when I had pneumonia. That's me, other men are different. Here's a guess: the hug and a kiss are his way of keeping the peace while dealing with the reality of so little intimacy and sex in the marriage, and the family is the only priority?
|
|
|
Post by elkclan2 on Jun 26, 2018 11:31:14 GMT -5
For me sex is a big stress reliever and I will engage in sex even when I feel 'too stressed' for sex, because I know I'll feel better afterward. Bone tired at night - yes, sex please - I know I'll sleep better.
My ex, on the other hand, seemed to find sex - at least with me - very stressful. It was definitely not a stress reliever for him.
Thankfully, my partner is more like me and likes sex just because and also finds it a stress reliever. He wants sex even when he's sick. I have to be pretty sick to not want it myself. The only thing I don't like to do is give oral if I'm really stuffy with a cold. Because I like to breathe, basically. :-)
|
|
|
Post by ihadalove on Jun 26, 2018 11:54:28 GMT -5
Get the kid out of the bed first off! And I don't know about anyone else but there isn't much I'd rather do after a 15 hour day than have sex and sleep like a baby after. His excuse that he gives you a hug and kiss twice a day seem pretty lame to me... that's not intimacy. I can agree with that. Especially in my younger days, but it may not apply to all men. The sex is a stress reliever and a relaxing, intimate time. A moral boost , he may be very stressed and his mind is full of "work issues" and he wants to let it all go so he can sleep. I'd rather go to sleep thinking of what a wonderful woman I have for a wife, instead of work issues. Sex is wonderful for that right before going to sleep. Releasing sperm is a relaxer. As a man, the only time I wasn't capable of desiring sex was when I had pneumonia. That's me, other men are different. Here's a guess: the hug and a kiss are his way of keeping the peace while dealing with the reality of so little intimacy and sex in the marriage, and the family is the only priority? Yes I have to be about near death to not want to, and even then.... But really I'd say if I'm very ill, or anything having to do with stomach discomfort or nasea will stop me. General colds or fevers I'm still a go. I pulled some all nighters in college that might have stopped me too, but I bet I could have fit a quicky in before passing out for 10 hours!
|
|
|
Post by greatcoastal on Jun 26, 2018 12:08:31 GMT -5
Thanks again for the insight and replies: I agree with Northstar mom “here are lots of obvious issues affecting your sex life. It really is hard to sleep with a squirming child and snorer. You can talk to a doctor who is a sleep specialist to get help with the snoring. You also could investigate the many devices -/ even a mattress that moved// that could stop your snoring. Both of you are sleep deprived and that alone results in exhaustion, irritable and on your part a lack of tact,” Looking at my situation again, this seems like a very large reason contributing to our lack of sex life. I will and always do take responsibility for my actions and words which is why I admit wrongdoing and lack of tact for my action and words. Our argument involved a lot of back and forth with some things said and both parts that was not complementary to each other. However, I was the one with the low blow. That being said, it is difficult to spell out the long history of every bit and piece of our relationship. But the reason I claim our relationship is strong is because we never fought, had the same hopes and dreams, loved each other, spent a lot of time together, and supported each other, and had sex a lot during our first four years as a couple, hence a marriage. The only issue at the time that festered is he didn’t like being around my family and I didn’t want to spend all our free time with his which caused friction. We were in our early 20’s with not too many financial responsibilities. Looking back, things deteriorated somewhat due to stressful career ( I worked 10 hours a day/ 6 days a week) and he was in grad school also holding a job. One our goals together was to buy a house a set up a financial future before having kids. But he decided he wanted sooner. Time was scarce and I was on edge due to the mounting pressures of work. We finally bought a house and that was a different chapter in our life. When the Great Recession hit in ‘08, our mortgage payment skyrocketed due to being on a loan that re-set and we couldn’t refi due to the home values plummeting by 50%. We ended up making it work after 2 years working harder and negotiating with the Bank. We stayed in our house, made payments, but accumulated some debt in the process. It’s all paid off now When things settled, we finally tried for a family with a very heartbreaking miscarriage that lead to both of us being depressed. Another very traumatic event happened the same year. After 12 months, I was pregnant again only to be in hospital bed rest with a life threatening pregnancy. We pulled through, but our kid had some medical problems that I’m don’t want to really get into, but it put strain on our marriage. Overall, for what we’ve been through and just being a decade older would probably affect our sex life. I am just hopeful that counseling will help us for the future so that it doesn’t lead to 20-30 years of unhappiness. I recognize that through writing in this forum and with some advice, that I may be also need to address my decifiencies and shortfalls and try to correct those as well. To be fair, we both have said regretful things and I think my mounting frustrations have lead to this. Those bad comments on my part were 12 years apart. It’s obviously not a regular occurrence. I have set appt with a marriage counselor so we’ll see what’s next. When you go to counselling you should bring up your early years right after the marriage. These are the cornerstone years. Yours did not go very well. You mentioned your H. wanted to start a family. That involves months of sex. You said no. And 4 yrs of sex before marriage went to 3 yrs of very little? All because you went to school and advanced in your career? That's a BIG red flag problem to go back to, for both of you. There is a lot more going on right there. From what little you posted it could easily sound like you where very controlling and he remained passive and resentful. Not a good foundation to build on. That could be part of the problem with him no longer participating as much? Who is the controller and who is the passive one sounds like another red flag issue in your marriage. I hope things could be turned around for the both of you.
|
|
|
Post by northstarmom on Jun 26, 2018 13:53:09 GMT -5
“When you go to counselling you should bring up your early years right after the marriage. These are the cornerstone years. Yours did not go very well. You mentioned your H. wanted to start a family. That involves months of sex. You said no. And 4 yrs of sex before marriage went to 3 yrs of very little? All because you went to school and advanced in your career?”
Perhaps her h pushed so hard for a baby at such an inopportune time because he hoped she’d get pregnant quickly and he’d have an excuse to give up sex. There are several people here who got pregnant very easily and that ended sex in their marriage.
|
|
|
Post by saarinista on Jun 26, 2018 13:58:57 GMT -5
After a 15-hour day and a screaming toddler I might want sex as I release OCCASIONALLY-but wait, we have to get the toddler to sleep and to stay out of the room first! I don't have kids, but frankly, I'm predicting that much of the time, I might also be tempted just to say, "Forget about it. We'll do if tomorrow. Then tomorrow becomes a week, a month, a year. I mean just as an aside there are many times when I deeply regret not having children. However I also Marvel at those who have them and managed to keep the marriage sexy as well. It has to be difficult. From the money issues kids can cause to the behavioral issues to the time they take to the mere fact that their presence makes it difficult to have privacy for sex... Like I said it all sounds so challenging I am hesitant to criticize anyone with children for being too tired for sex. I just can't imagine how people do it all. Or maybe it's been so long that I've had sex that I just can't remember how good it might feel.😜 Go to that counselor carencaren and tell us how it works out.
|
|
|
Post by carencaren on Jun 27, 2018 0:00:21 GMT -5
All- what a great support group this is. Many different points of view have been presented and it is giving me time to reflect on this relationship wholistically. Things don’t typically deteriorate overnight and there may be other factors that have put us in this state.
* update from my last post,* Hubby and I talked the next day after our fight. I apologized and asked for forgiveness in which he granted. I mentioned counseling and he agreed and told me to just give him date/time. He reaffirmed his love and stated that me and my kid are the only things that matter to him. He also said a comment that made me wonder if he’s maybe not as into intimacy with me because “you know we’ve been together for a LONG time, right?” 16 years. Perhaps we’ve been monogamous for so long that he’s just bored of having sex with the same person??? Hubby didn’t say those words or it’s possible I was just reading too much into that comment. We talked about more kids after successful counseling. But no direct conversation about sexless marriage.
The following day we were somewhat back to normal and we actually had sex! He was really tired but I knew he wanted to be intimate because no TV and stayed up after putting the kid to bed. Maybe he felt obligated? It was not mind blowing, but I felt like I needed to make him confident again after my comment so I did everything I could to keep it going. There was effort on his part, but it was me initiating everything.
I was thinking about scheduling sex on the weekends so that it can be planned and both parties are aware that it is “our time.” We’ve made an agreement to get our kid in his own bed ASAP. I did this a few years ago and it worked for awhile, but we didn’t stick to the schedule after a few months.
Our counseling is next week, so I hope I can bring up this issue more openly.
I agree with GreekGoddess “I feel like you two have been so focused on goals & your child & “externalities” that you forgot to focus on each other, and each of you on yourselves once in awhile too. You forgot to feed the relationship itself. The thing that is to be the foundation of all that other stuff.
Novelty is huge. Try counseling- yes! But also try to just be. Be present for each other. You’ve set up a lifestyle that seems untenable. It sounds exhausting just to read it.
Sleep exhaustion is classified as a form of torture for a reason. Good luck, sister - glad you got the ball rolling on a counseling session!”
H did say that his exhaustion is the cause of him falling asleep early every night. He agrees that the kid needs to sleep in his own room. I’ve offered to sleep in our spare bedroom for my snoring and also see a sleep specialist for a CPAP. But he told me the CPAP would keep him more awake than my snoring.
As far as the period after our “4 Glorious years,” I think that life got busy, and things became mundane and predictable in the bedroom. But when I first brought up the decline in our sex life, H didn’t really think it was a problem. He never refused, but he initiated infrequently to the point where I was initiating 100% of the time. I got tired of doing this and stopped trying for sex. I think he noticed after about a month and finally made his move. I never refused him, but felt hurt and unattractive. At this point it was 1x per month or 2 months. I tried to stop thinking about it, and put all my energy into my career, which paid dividends and was quickly promoted to a role which required 60+ hours. We were both still in our late 20’s and I would say the peak of my attractiveness. I never let myself go and was in shape and successful. Thinking about controlling issues, I am assertive and know what I want so it’s possible that I steered our relationship and made a lot of major decisions. H is equally, if not more attractive than I am, educated, and hardworking, so there was no dominant person in the relationship. I’m sure I made mistakes by calling shots on a lot of issues, but he was equal in the things he did.
When we tried for a baby the 1st time, sex was stressful because of my irregular cycles and it was so planned that it did take the fun out it. After a year of no success, we saw a specialist and got pregnant right away. This was the miscarriage. Fast forward another year and I naturally got pregnant through good old fashioned times intercourse. As I mentioned in my previous posts, this was a high risk, problem ridden pregnancy that left me hospitalized for almost my entire pregnancy.
We get very close during this time due to my disability, but of course sex was not allowed per the Dr. this lasted 10 months.
I do believe there is a deep love and devotion for each other and that we’ve been focusing on everything else but “us” as a Romantic couple. H feels that he’s met all my needs as a provider, protector, father, friend, and occasional lover. He was taken aback to learn that “Lover” is almost as important as those other qualities. I now realize that our love languages are different. My hope is to at least restore “lover” as a priority and learn truthfully from him if there’s something about me that has potentially made him lose his desire?
I also want to learn if there’s anything more I can do or not do that might be driving him away from wanting sex with me. I’m not trying to be vain when I say I get multiple propositions from successful professionals all the time. I even get asked out by men in their 20’s and get carded when I buy alcohol. I am a respected professional at my company.
To me, it was always important to feel good about myself and maintain my appearance and body for my husband. I felt it was my duty to not let myself go and always be a good sexual partner. I take pride in being a good mother, good housewife, career oriented, and friend. I don’t smoke, have any addictions, and come from a good family.
There is a saying, “ For every beautiful man or woman, there is someone who is tired of making love to them.” It could be that simple.
Again, thanks for all the feedback and advice. I’ll keep posting as things progress.
H says that appearance is not an issue
|
|
|
Post by carencaren on Jun 27, 2018 0:18:07 GMT -5
Forgot to add this to my above post:
I don’t want to make it seem like I am the perfect wife. I have been naggy, temperamental, rude, annoying, mean, complained , PMS, and controlling at times in our relationship. It wouldn’t be honest to not include my shortcomings as well. I can say that it was not consistently happening over the course of our relationship. And I was never a refuser.
|
|
|
Post by DryCreek on Jun 27, 2018 1:24:00 GMT -5
carencaren, one small point... you may find that a simple dental appliance will do the job for your snoring without the need for a CPAP mask/pump. It’s a custom-molded upper/lower mouth guard that’s designed to keep your jaw positioned to prevent snoring. Around here, they’re prescribed via dentists or orthodontists and covered by health insurance plans (not dental).
|
|
|
Post by baza on Jun 27, 2018 1:36:16 GMT -5
If you are embarking on a joint counselling path, it is as well to be aware of a couple of things. #1 - the limiting factor is always the level of effort 'the least invested spouse' puts in. If one of you is only putting in a 25% effort, that's the limit of how far joint counselling can take you (even if the other spouse is putting in 100%) #2 - 'Saving the marriage' is NOT the purpose of counselling. Rather, it is to dig down to the truth of the marriage to see what is really there. It may reveal that there are rock solid foundations to your deal - it may reveal quite the opposite. It is most unwise to go into this with any other agenda other than 'getting to the truth'. #3 - the counsellor. They are NOT all brilliant. Hopefully, your initial consultation will reveal that the person knows their stuff and can help guide you through the process. Don't be afraid to bale out if you strike a dud. These 3 things above - your spouses ability, the outcome and the counsellors ability - are all matters you do NOT control. What you DO control in the process is *you*. It is advisable to bring to the table the best possible version of *you* as possible. As mentioned earlier in the thread, that would include a "no bullshit" mindset, where you do not say things you don't mean, nor make any threats that you are not prepared to carry out. Say what you mean and mean what you say. If your spouse adopted the same mindset, you could get incredible value out of the process - but what you can't do is mandate the outcome. All you can do is dig down to the truth. You (both) do that, then the outcome will take care of itself. The track record for joint counselling in this group is, frankly, abysmal. It usually founders due to the spouse....who will either not attend, or attend but not contribute, or contribute but not follow through with action. The signs of this are usually pretty obvious. If that happens, there is not a lot of point in persisting with a "joint" approach. You (that's *you*) would get way better value out of individual counselling. Anyway, enough of the wet blanket. I hope you get great value out of your counselling process Sister carencaren .
|
|
|
Post by elynne on Jun 27, 2018 2:31:52 GMT -5
If you are embarking on a joint counselling path, it is as well to be aware of a couple of things. #1 - the limiting factor is always the level of effort 'the least invested spouse' puts in. If one of you is only putting in a 25% effort, that's the limit of how far joint counselling can take you (even if the other spouse is putting in 100%) #2 - 'Saving the marriage' is NOT the purpose of counselling. Rather, it is to dig down to the truth of the marriage to see what is really there. It may reveal that there are rock solid foundations to your deal - it may reveal quite the opposite. It is most unwise to go into this with any other agenda other than 'getting to the truth'. #3 - the counsellor. They are NOT all brilliant. Hopefully, your initial consultation will reveal that the person knows their stuff and can help guide you through the process. Don't be afraid to bale out if you strike a dud. These 3 things above - your spouses ability, the outcome and the counsellors ability - are all matters you do NOT control. What you DO control in the process is *you*. It is advisable to bring to the table the best possible version of *you* as possible. As mentioned earlier in the thread, that would include a "no bullshit" mindset, where you do not say things you don't mean, nor make any threats that you are not prepared to carry out. Say what you mean and mean what you say. If your spouse adopted the same mindset, you could get incredible value out of the process - but what you can't do is mandate the outcome. All you can do is dig down to the truth. You (both) do that, then the outcome will take care of itself. The track record for joint counselling in this group is, frankly, abysmal. It usually founders due to the spouse....who will either not attend, or attend but not contribute, or contribute but not follow through with action. The signs of this are usually pretty obvious. If that happens, there is not a lot of point in persisting with a "joint" approach. You (that's *you*) would get way better value out of individual counselling. Anyway, enough of the wet blanket. I hope you get great value out of your counselling process Sister carencaren . I’d certainly see a pulmonologist about the snoring. There’s a lot that can be done. CPAPs have improved. If you have large tonsils or adenoids they can be surgically removed. If your snoring is related to sleep apnea, sorting out the apnea can be huge. People often say they feel like a new person. And despite the noise of the CPAP, patients tend to love their machine and how well rested they are in the morning. Seeing a specialist will give you answers as to causes and the possible solutions - and with that info you can choose a course of action. An aside: my h has seen patients divorce due to sleep apnea and snoring! You may be surprised at the improvement in quality of life if you resolve all the family members sleep issues! Good luck!
|
|
|
Post by greatcoastal on Jun 27, 2018 7:09:12 GMT -5
If you are embarking on a joint counselling path, it is as well to be aware of a couple of things. #1 - the limiting factor is always the level of effort 'the least invested spouse' puts in. To @workingonit, I'm glad you 'Like' baza advice. This would fit your situation nicely.
|
|