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Post by baza on May 29, 2018 22:36:46 GMT -5
Disclaimer - My ex missus died back in April 2015 so to that extent the point is moot.
However, I have cast my mind back to the loose affiliation of friends I had back in the day (of which she was one) and came up with a number of 20. As of today, I am still friends with 5 of those people from years ago.
So, to the question of - "If you had never married your spouse do you think you two would still be friends?" I would figure that there'd be about a 25% chance of that.
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Post by JMX on May 29, 2018 22:53:05 GMT -5
I love that baza puts a 25% chance on it at least - but @shynjdude - why never friends? I am curious how you would flesh this out - and baz too. How could you NOT be friends with someone who you chose to spend your life with? How does that work? I am sincerely curious. It reminds me of Sliding Doors (a movie) which gets back to the main point anyway. It was meant to be - for whatever reason.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2018 23:06:54 GMT -5
JMXMy wife and I met on a blind date but I didn't even know the matchmaker. Yes, weird. I thought she was very cool and we were attracted to each other and became physical way too fast for a virgin like me. But she never fit in with most of my circle of friends and if it wasn't for the attraction I don't think I would have hung out with her. We are very, very different people, in some ways opposite.
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Post by baza on May 29, 2018 23:39:19 GMT -5
I love that baza puts a 25% chance on it at least - but @shynjdude - why never friends? I am curious how you would flesh this out - and baz too. How could you NOT be friends with someone who you chose to spend your life with? How does that work? I am sincerely curious. It reminds me of Sliding Doors (a movie) which gets back to the main point anyway. It was meant to be - for whatever reason. Well, the premise of the question was - " If you had never married your spouse do you think you two would still be friends?" which I have interpreted literally. If I had not got married to her, chances are that I would have married someone else. Chances are that had she not married me, she would have married someone else. Her path, and my path, would most likely have never intersected again. As regards your - different - question Sister JMX - "How could you NOT be friends with someone who you chose to spend your life with?" my response is "very easily". Our deal degenerated into a *Financial Partnership and co-parenting* set up. Based on how she treated me, and how I treated her, it was more akin to a "room mates" relationship, and by the finish of it, we were not even good room-mates. Funilly enough, after I left in 2009 and the dust had settled, we did develop a new relationship which could be described as friends.
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Post by elynne on May 30, 2018 0:31:27 GMT -5
This is an interesting question. If I hadn't married my W, we would not be friends today. Many of our shared interests and activities developed over time during our marriage. Without the marriage, we would never have experienced each other's interests and thus wouldn't have gotten involved in them. Now, after nearly a decade of sharing these interests with each other, I could remain friends with her if we ended up in an amicable divorce situation. The marriage fostered the friendship. h, that’s actually quite nice! Learning about each other and growing together, remaining open and curious. 11 years together and it seems we’re pursuing more and more divergent interests. He goes mountain biking, race biking, swimming. I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. I’ve been race biking with him once on vacation and loved it- but race biking at home is a guy thing - competitive - who got the most miles in over the week? Who takes the lead most in their group ride? Or maybe this is just my h’s take on it. And he joins me at my functions or interests next to never and always under duress. You and your missus might be missing sex, but it seems you do other parts of the relationship well. Kudos. Not an easy thing to do.
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Post by choosinghappy on May 30, 2018 0:44:20 GMT -5
This is an interesting question. If I hadn't married my W, we would not be friends today. Many of our shared interests and activities developed over time during our marriage. Without the marriage, we would never have experienced each other's interests and thus wouldn't have gotten involved in them. Now, after nearly a decade of sharing these interests with each other, I could remain friends with her if we ended up in an amicable divorce situation. The marriage fostered the friendship. h, that’s actually quite nice! Learning about each other and growing together, remaining open and curious. 11 years together and it seems we’re pursuing more and more divergent interests. He goes mountain biking, race biking, swimming. I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. I’ve been race biking with him once on vacation and loved it- but race biking at home is a guy thing - competitive - who got the most miles in over the week? Who takes the lead most in their group ride? Or maybe this is just my h’s take on it. And he joins me at my functions or interests next to never and always under duress. You and your missus might be missing sex, but it seems you do other parts of the relationship well. Kudos. Not an easy thing to do. I had a similar reaction elynne. My H and I also grew over the last dozen years. But in separate ways. Whatever things we had in common when we first got together have long since dissolved. He changed in one way and I in another. There would be no chance we’d be friends now if we weren’t married. When we divorce we won’t be friends either, though I very much hope we’ll be friendLY, for the sake of our son.
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Post by elynne on May 30, 2018 1:53:51 GMT -5
h, that’s actually quite nice! Learning about each other and growing together, remaining open and curious. 11 years together and it seems we’re pursuing more and more divergent interests. He goes mountain biking, race biking, swimming. I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. I’ve been race biking with him once on vacation and loved it- but race biking at home is a guy thing - competitive - who got the most miles in over the week? Who takes the lead most in their group ride? Or maybe this is just my h’s take on it. And he joins me at my functions or interests next to never and always under duress. You and your missus might be missing sex, but it seems you do other parts of the relationship well. Kudos. Not an easy thing to do. I had a similar reaction elynne. My H and I also grew over the last dozen years. But in separate ways. Whatever things we had in common when we first got together have long since dissolved. He changed in one way and I in another. There would be no chance we’d be friends now if we weren’t married. When we divorce we won’t be friends either, though I very much hope we’ll be friendLY, for the sake of our son. Absolutely! If we divorce I don’t expect to be friends but I certainly hope we will be polite and respectful towards each other. During the beginning of this journey I asked h if he thought we’d be friends if we divorced. ‘Of course not!’ was his reply! He has a point. We’re not friends now, divorce certainly isn’t going to build that up!
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Post by baza on May 30, 2018 2:55:53 GMT -5
I am starting to think that the definition of what constitutes "friendship" is wildly different between different people.
In my cozy little word, there's Ms enna, then there are about 5 people I regard as true friends. I could add on another 10 that I am very close to. I could add on a further 20 that I know pretty well. Probably another 20 who I know. On the next orbit of people we are into *acquaintance* territory, no idea how many people that would be
According to farcebook, I have 27 friends - most of whom I rarely see IRL - and a few of the remainder I could not care much if I never heard from them again.
According to ILIASM I have another 18 friends on here. There's 8 of them that I've not seen active for at least a year, mebbe 2.
Anyway, I have managed to veer off topic a bit here - but I do think that everyones version of what constitutes a "friend" is different.
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Post by elynne on May 30, 2018 3:48:59 GMT -5
I am starting to think that the definition of what constitutes "friendship" is wildly different between different people. In my cozy little word, there's Ms enna, then there are about 5 people I regard as true friends. I could add on another 10 that I am very close to. I could add on a further 20 that I know pretty well. Probably another 20 who I know. On the next orbit of people we are into *acquaintance* territory, no idea how many people that would be According to farcebook, I have 27 friends - most of whom I rarely see IRL - and a few of the remainder I could not care much if I never heard from them again. According to ILIASM I have another 18 friends on here. There's 8 of them that I've not seen active for at least a year, mebbe 2. Anyway, I have managed to veer off topic a bit here - but I do think that everyones version of what constitutes a "friend" is different. Such an interesting question! I’m asking my kids what they think makes a friend as we eat a leisurely breakfast on a terrace. (Love teacher strikes!) So far we’ve got: 1. Understanding you. 2. They let you be yourself and respect your opinions even when they differ from theirs. 3. Being there for each other. I think the monkeys have a good basis, but I’d add someone who truly cares about your well being and vice versa. Cool convo with the kids - talking about friendships, what makes a good friend, how we can grow closer or apart from friends based on what is important to you and the friend, that it can be fluid. Then about self-esteem and the different things we can base esteem on. Some people on possessions, bigger house, better car. Some on physical appearance. Some people on intelligence, learning or education. Others on skills that they have. And others on the qualities they possess and how they choose to act. Thanks for inspiring such a cool talk with my kids! Love getting their perspective and exploring this stuff with them! And baz- the few folks in your inner circle - they are very, very lucky to have you as a friend. You’re a good egg (to use my odd New York slang). There is no other phrase that captures it so well. I hope it translates across culture. 😊
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Post by h on May 30, 2018 3:59:52 GMT -5
This is an interesting question. If I hadn't married my W, we would not be friends today. Many of our shared interests and activities developed over time during our marriage. Without the marriage, we would never have experienced each other's interests and thus wouldn't have gotten involved in them. Now, after nearly a decade of sharing these interests with each other, I could remain friends with her if we ended up in an amicable divorce situation. The marriage fostered the friendship. h , that’s actually quite nice! Learning about each other and growing together, remaining open and curious. 11 years together and it seems we’re pursuing more and more divergent interests. He goes mountain biking, race biking, swimming. I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. I’ve been race biking with him once on vacation and loved it- but race biking at home is a guy thing - competitive - who got the most miles in over the week? Who takes the lead most in their group ride? Or maybe this is just my h’s take on it. And he joins me at my functions or interests next to never and always under duress. You and your missus might be missing sex, but it seems you do other parts of the relationship well. Kudos. Not an easy thing to do. While I do understand that what each person finds attractive is unique, I think it's pretty rude of your H to discourage you from swimming because he doesn't like muscular arms and shoulders. I think that it would make a person in better shape all over and the fact that you used to do it before and don't anymore is a sad thing. I would never discourage my W from doing any of her hobbies or activities, and especially something that would make her more healthy. Likewise, she would never discourage me from my activities and often tries them out. I enjoy painting miniature figures and playing table top games (mostly Warhammer). She picked out some miniatures for herself and will occasionally sit down and paint with me. I also enjoy hunting. It's something I have done with my father since childhood. My W had never been interested in it but took it upon herself to go take a Hunter's Safety Course and she plans to get her license to go with me this fall. It's a good way to spend more time together and will also save us on our grocery bill through the year. None of these are things I asked her to do. These are things she chose to do to share in my life and experiences. She actually enjoyed the painting and miniature games after trying them out. She has enjoyed target shooting the few times she has tried it. Hunting is yet to be determined but the fact is that she chooses to try it out because she wants to spend more time with me.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2018 5:06:18 GMT -5
I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. What. The. Fuck.
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Post by elkclan2 on May 30, 2018 5:21:37 GMT -5
I like my husband (mostly) in that I find him interesting. I love quiet people and drawing them out - it’s actually a personality flaw of mine. I like most people and I like figuring out what makes them tick. One-on-one, I am good at this. I operate on the following premise: 85% of the population are good people on any given day. 10% are having a bad day - i.e. grandma died. 5% - batshit crazy and steer clear the MOMENT you recognize it. This postulate - for me, a positive person - is pretty spot-on. I would definitely be friends with my spouse. He’s normally the 85%. He has some 10% moments. He has never been the 5%. But maybe that is my problem. I like people in general. I think this is about how I feel about people - although since I live in a big city, I'd probably take the 85% down a few notches! :-) There was a point where I probably could have remained friends with my ex. But unfortunately he's slipped into the batshit crazy category. Our values are no longer compatible at all. He has become really into a kind of politics that I find completely objectionable. He has become racist, sexist, homophobic and an anti-semite - and that's really not the kind of person that I can be friends with. I met my current partner online, we chatted for a few weeks before we met in person as we had conflicting schedules. Before our first date I decided that if there was no chemistry I wanted to cultivate a friendship with him, because I thought we'd have fun together. Throughout the date I wasn't sure if there was chemistry - I was pretty nervous - however, he kissed me at the end of our date - and WOW! It was really, really hard not to invite him back to mine. Instead we had a second date the next night and in hindsight it was fairly settled from there. We have fun together. He is my best friend.
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Post by elynne on May 30, 2018 6:35:32 GMT -5
h , that’s actually quite nice! Learning about each other and growing together, remaining open and curious. 11 years together and it seems we’re pursuing more and more divergent interests. He goes mountain biking, race biking, swimming. I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. I’ve been race biking with him once on vacation and loved it- but race biking at home is a guy thing - competitive - who got the most miles in over the week? Who takes the lead most in their group ride? Or maybe this is just my h’s take on it. And he joins me at my functions or interests next to never and always under duress. You and your missus might be missing sex, but it seems you do other parts of the relationship well. Kudos. Not an easy thing to do. While I do understand that what each person finds attractive is unique, I think it's pretty rude of your H to discourage you from swimming because he doesn't like muscular arms and shoulders. I think that it would make a person in better shape all over and the fact that you used to do it before and don't anymore is a sad thing. I would never discourage my W from doing any of her hobbies or activities, and especially something that would make her more healthy. Likewise, she would never discourage me from my activities and often tries them out. I enjoy painting miniature figures and playing table top games (mostly Warhammer). She picked out some miniatures for herself and will occasionally sit down and paint with me. I also enjoy hunting. It's something I have done with my father since childhood. My W had never been interested in it but took it upon herself to go take a Hunter's Safety Course and she plans to get her license to go with me this fall. It's a good way to spend more time together and will also save us on our grocery bill through the year. To be honest, I swam so much for so long - 2 practices a day, an hour of weight training every day, meets Saturday, rest Sunday- for sooo long! I’m totally fine not swimming! But the theme is that we do very little together. I took him on a run with me once. Never again. He had to run on the lower path, had to switch sides with me, changed the route, the pace. I finally got fed up with my run being completely changed and ended up sprinting the last kilometer home to put some distance between h and me. He says pretty consistently that he’d prefer if I weren’t there for family outings because it’s more pleasant when I’m not around. I think that’s just a terrible thing to say, especially since the unpleasantness is usually just my reaction to him acting like a jerk! Argh!
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2018 6:45:46 GMT -5
He says pretty consistently that he’d prefer if I weren’t there for family outings because it’s more pleasant when I’m not around. What. The. Fuck!!!
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Post by elynne on May 30, 2018 6:47:42 GMT -5
I used to be a long distance swimmer and he actively discourages me from swimming saying that such muscular arms and shoulders are unattractive for women. What. The. Fuck.I like being strong! I’m not a bodybuilder, but when it comes to heavy lifting or physical chores, I’m self-sufficient and love it! I actually stopped to help a man change his tire a few weeks ago! 😂 I was on my bicycle and saw him struggling. So I placed the jack for him, raised the car, switched the tire, replaced the nuts and sent him on his way to pick up his daughter on time. He was so appreciative. Sweet.
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