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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2017 16:45:17 GMT -5
If it's important to you to feel like you've done all you can do then by all means pursue that. However, once again, he's shifted the actual initiation of sex to you. Saying "maybe soon we'll do something...wink wink" isn't even reset sex. It's an obvious manipulation that transfers the initiate/refuser back to where he wants it. You put yourself out there, he swats you down and he retains power. My two cents is that 8 years is enough time to feel like you've done your part.
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Post by workingonit on Oct 16, 2017 20:44:45 GMT -5
Thanks all. Being enmeshed in my life I can easily not realize how bad my situation is and how deeply unhappy I am. My H has this habit of becoming very vulnerable appearing and crying. At times he will derail conversations by having complete breakdowns. I have pointed out in the past that this feels like emotional manipulation. It stops me from bringing stuff up because I don't want to deal with him. Last night I was really great about not backing down or getting sucked in to his world. He cried. I watched and waited and repeated the fact that he has not made an effort ever to fix this problem.
This forum is giving me such perspective. I am starting to finally allow others to see what is going on in my marriage. Your feedback is waking me up. Damn, I have been so asleep and unhappy, letting this shit go on and on for 8 years.
I am almost done. Almost fully done. Feels like the beginning of the hardest part but maybe starting to feel a light at the end?
You all and your brave sharing and honest feedback are wonderfully aporeciated. Thank you.
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Post by allworkandnoplay on Oct 16, 2017 20:49:51 GMT -5
Hello, workingonit. Welcome. As you are new here we are still learning your story. I am not sure yet if I know what type of refuser your husband might be. There are the ones who offer reset sex to shut you up. Then there are the ones who offer it up to keep you from leaving or doing something else drastic. Then there are the ones who have such a low libido that when it is offered up every few months or so it seems like reset sex when really it just happens to be when they are actually in the mood. It is a large continuum so there are plenty of variants I am sure you have found the term "counter-refuser"? Some of us have been driven to this, not in retaliation, but because we don't want to be manipulated anymore. I have not quite let myself get to this stage yet, but the last several times have not been enjoyable. I have, instead, chosen to disengage. I have not asked for sex myself for about 15 months or so. In that time we have had sex 4 times, all at her request, and usually after she realized how long it had been since the last time. I consider it reset sex because I do not believe she actually likes having sex.
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Post by workingonit on Oct 16, 2017 21:00:33 GMT -5
Hello, workingonit. Welcome. As you are new here we are still learning your story. I am not sure yet if I know what type of refuser your husband might be. There are the ones who offer reset sex to shut you up. Then there are the ones who offer it up to keep you from leaving or doing something else drastic. Then there are the ones who have such a low libido that when it is offered up every few months or so it seems like reset sex when really it just happens to be when they are actually in the mood. It is a large continuum so there are plenty of variants I am sure you have found the term "counter-refuser"? Some of us have been driven to this, not in retaliation, but because we don't want to be manipulated anymore. I have not quite let myself get to this stage yet, but the last several times have not been enjoyable. I have, instead, chosen to disengage. I have not asked for sex myself for about 15 months or so. In that time we have had sex 4 times, all at her request, and usually after she realized how long it had been since the last time. I consider it reset sex because I do not believe she actually likes having sex. I am beginning to appreciate the differences in all our situations. It think part of the reason I would say yes to reset sex is because I don't want to be a counter refuser. I have been so desperate for affection for so long I don't want to turn it down when I get an offer. I have been without sex for 8 years. I have had 2.5 years without even any kissing or affection at all. He claims to want me, want sex, want love and intimacy. Yet he has not done anything to help move. I have really lost my desire for him, which makes the idea of sex with him now feel....unappealing. maybe too little too late? Just to be clear- he has not offered sex at this point. Or been open to my attempts at affection.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2017 22:14:32 GMT -5
No affection, no kissing, no sex for years? What's the upside of trying to make it work?
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Post by workingonit on Oct 16, 2017 22:25:45 GMT -5
No affection, no kissing, no sex for years? What's the upside of trying to make it work? [rbr] Yes, years. I really don't know the upside. We are really good friends, laugh alot, parent well together. Just lonely. And NEEDING SEX!!!! He still doesn't see this as a big problem, btw. Thinks I am blowing it out of proportion.
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Post by Frustrated1978 on Oct 16, 2017 22:32:56 GMT -5
If you are horny and going through a dry spell take the reset sex on offer. However don't mistake it for anything more than it is.
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Post by M2G on Oct 16, 2017 22:47:15 GMT -5
Easy answer; no way I'm going to engage in charity sex. Probably "it" would bail out anyway due to the giant WTF consuming my rational brain IE what's she after? She said she doesn't want me so WTF?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2017 22:49:50 GMT -5
I think if you still /want/ sex with your refuser, why not? I’m so far gone at this point that I can’t imagine my refuser’s hands all over me. He’s just been too cruel and contemptuous for too long.
But if you think there’s hope for you, go for it. What’s to lose? If nothing else, it confirms what you already know. Best case scenario, it goes well and you both want more!
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Post by greatcoastal on Oct 17, 2017 7:22:58 GMT -5
No affection, no kissing, no sex for years? What's the upside of trying to make it work? [rbr] Yes, years. I really don't know the upside. We are really good friends, laugh alot, parent well together. Just lonely. And NEEDING SEX!!!! He still doesn't see this as a big problem, btw. Thinks I am blowing it out of proportion. Sorry for the blunt direct answer. With that said, you have been well trained to accept what ever little crumbs he offers you. There comes a time when even a rescuer needs to be rescued. "good friends, laugh a lot, parent well together". That's a fake mask, that accounts for 5% of your time together? I think about the times I served in Childcare at church. I was the only man there, yet the 12 hrs a week that I was with all those other woman "we were really good friends, laughed a lot, and parented well together" while taking care of children and working with parents. But we were not married, there where not issues of zero intimacy or sex, finance, control, relatives, lying, manipulation, respect, trust, having everything you say get DARVO. ( Deny, Argue-or Avoid- Reverse, making them the Victim and you the Offender). You are standing up for your self, you are leveling the playing field, and seeing the results. It's far past time that you feel cherished, desired, respected and saught after. That's why you got married!! Here are some topics that I hope you will find helpful. These where written for men, but apply to woman who are in an abusive relationship as well, just turn the wording around. shrink4men.com/2011/01/19/presto-change-o-darvo-deny-attack-and-reverse-victim-and-offender/shrink4men.com/2012/04/05/putting-women-on-pedestals-dont-do-it/www.womansdivorce.com/tired-of-walking-on-eggshells.htmlshrink4men.com/2016/07/07/narcissists-borderlines-psychopaths-and-codependents-mutual-mommy-and-daddy-issues/
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Post by greatcoastal on Oct 17, 2017 9:14:02 GMT -5
I am beginning to appreciate the differences in all our situations. It think part of the reason I would say yes to reset sex is because I don't want to be a counter refuser. I have been so desperate for affection for so long I don't want to turn it down when I get an offer. I have been without sex for 8 years. I have had 2.5 years without even any kissing or affection at all. He claims to want me, want sex, want love and intimacy. Yet he has not done anything to help move. I have really lost my desire for him, which makes the idea of sex with him now feel....unappealing. maybe too little too late? Just to be clear- he has not offered sex at this point. Or been open to my attempts at affection. They say opposites attract. There is probably a lot of truth in that. What's not said is how you get along, compared to two people who think and act alike. Imagine for a moment that you value and respect his behavior and ways of taking action-or the lack of it- and decide to be just like him, and to treat him the same way he treats you. Shouldn't that be a foundation for a relationship? You value his morals,and way of living? You have trust in his words and actions? And the same for him? He values you? His actions,words, and behavior is sounding like a one way street paved with double standards! Even using the words, "just following your lead, you trained me well". You would probably find yourself more and more detached from him. However, by giving him a dose of his own medicine, don't be surprised if he steps up his tactics more and more. You do sound like you are -or have become- co-dependent. (I've gone through the same thing) that is curable! Being a narcissist, a manipulative controller, that is not curable. Think of the type of example you are giving the children of what a caring ,giving, intimate, loving, respectful, relationship aught to be? -This was a turning point for me, that's why I feel confident in sharing it with you,and others-.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2017 13:58:08 GMT -5
No affection, no kissing, no sex for years? What's the upside of trying to make it work? [rbr] Yes, years. I really don't know the upside. We are really good friends, laugh alot, parent well together. Just lonely. And NEEDING SEX!!!! He still doesn't see this as a big problem, btw. Thinks I am blowing it out of proportion. Getting along day to day and raising happy/healthy children is a lot. I think that's what keeps many (most?) of us in a SM. I'm there myself. We can rationalize that "sex isn't everything" but I still maintain that there is a fundamental enigma that your husband can't ignore. Either sex isn't a big deal (his take on it) or it is. If it's not a big deal (his argument) then he shouldn't have a problem having it because, well, it's not a big deal. If he has a problem with it then he's admitting that IT IS a big deal.
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Post by lwoetin on Oct 18, 2017 1:51:17 GMT -5
My H has refused therapy for years. This summer when I started talking about separating he agreed to a date night. Every Sunday we sit together for 2 hours and talk only about our relationship. Of course all of this comes from me and he is mostly listening/reacting. He never brings anything to the discussion, never works on stuff on his own. Last night I talked about my ideal sexual relationship and where ours went off the rails (week 1). He was receptive and actually said "That is exactly my ideal." And then he got THAT look and said "You know whatever problems we have me desiring you has never been a problem. Of course I want you." Really? WTF? How in the WORLD would I know that??? I was really mad actually. 8 years of nothing and this is what he says?? He makes no effort to fix anything? Even now he is only responding to MY growth. To MY pushing and pushing. Interestingly when that look came on his face and he told me he wanted me my stomach turned a little. Not in a good way. He wants to try to save this hell hole with that weak ass stab at a move? I saw so clearly this heading toward reset sex. (Maybe one day- I mean he STILL did not make a move - he actually said "Maybe soon we could do something sexual." Aaaaaaahhh!!!!) So, do you take reset sex knowing that is exactly what it is? Is it worth it? It feels like at least I will know I have done everything I can.....A last attempt. is it reset if it's been 8 yrs? It may be an honest attempt. It seems like all is great except for the sex. It's about time to work on the sex if he is serious about it. Your H seems really emotional and sensitive type, and cares about you and your kids.
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Post by ironhamster on Oct 18, 2017 4:15:41 GMT -5
If I dare say, after eight years of rejection, I expect that you are going to find that his attempt at reset sex lacks the passion, the feeling, the connection that you would expect to get.
I am sorry it has gotten to that point. I get not wanting to be a counter-refusers, too. I have always made it a point to have sex with my wife whenever she was willing. I'm done asking, though, because I know what I am getting.
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Post by h on Oct 18, 2017 5:08:53 GMT -5
I take whatever I get also. I have only ever turned her down once. It was a weekend and she turned me down in the morning because she "had too much stuff to do" so she got out of bed early. I was angry and frustrated and spent all day working myself ragged. She said later that night that we could "do stuff" as she put it, but after all the heavy junk she made me move and lift, my back was shot for the day so I couldn't since she only allows the one position. I asked if she could be on top instead but she refused that and then accused ME of rejecting her. I tried to tell her that I physically couldn't but she didn't bother listening. To this day, I still think she set the whole day up like that intentionally just to make me out to be the bad guy.
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